

==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: at home

From: Christa-Maria <cmaria@triton.net>

Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 16:03:09 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by cmaria@triton.net :



I use an electric coffeegrinder to powder some herbs.

C-M



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: at home

From: "Jimmie" <wolfclan@home.com>

Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 17:09:29 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Jimmie <Wolfclan@home.com> :



I use one too.  It works great...

Jimmie



> Sent to the herblist by cmaria@triton.net :

> 

> I use an electric coffeegrinder to powder some herbs.

> C-M



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: at home

From: Christa-Maria <cmaria@triton.net>

Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 17:26:45 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by cmaria@triton.net :



My Yuppy kids are very perturbes that I have used the grinder for herbs,

of course with good cleanings in between, so for Christmas I got a new

one from them, for coffee only :)

C-M



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: at home

From: "Jimmie" <wolfclan@home.com>

Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 17:18:58 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Jimmie <Wolfclan@home.com> :



Nothing like a little Bear Root residue to give your Java some "bite"  :-)



> Sent to the herblist by cmaria@triton.net :

> 

> My Yuppy kids are very perturbes that I have used the grinder for herbs,

> of course with good cleanings in between, so for Christmas I got a new

> one from them, for coffee only :)

> C-M



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: at home

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 23:05:22 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



 Sent to the herblist by Jimmie <Wolfclan@home.com> :> 

> Nothing like a little Bear Root residue to give your Java some  "bite" 

:-)> 

> > Sent to the herblist by cmaria@triton.net : > > My Yuppy kids are

very perturbed that I have used the grinder for herbs, ... C-M



Perhaps there is enough oily substance in the coffee beans to capture the

essential oils of your herbs, and maybe the herbs gather up some of the

oil of kaffea arabica when they are ground in a machine used for kaffea

arabica.   Are there any benefits in this?

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Vitex dosage (was: fluid measures)

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 20:14:06 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by May Terry <mterry@snet.net> :



Marcia V Grossbard wrote:



> My apologies to the LIST.  I made a big mistake. I read through what I

> said three times, and still

> GOOFED BIG TIME.

>

> > I would guess that drops that are 1/8 of a dram bottle and can

> > probably be measured, but may not be quite in the metric domain. This

> much was correct.

> What followed needs correction.

>

>  A ml,  Milliliter, is 1/1000 NOT OF A DRAM, BUT OF A LITER which is

> about 1 quart and 1/2 approximately in English fluid measure.  A liter is

> 1000 milliliters, and is metric and might be equivalent to two or three

> drops.



Ummm....I'm still confused.  A liter is one quart plus about 1.8 fluid ounces,

or 33.8 fluid ounces.  And...a liter is equivalent to two or three drops...?

I'm still not sure what you're saying.



Anyway, I have started to take Vitex during the luteal phase of my menstrual

cycle.  One brand I bought says that two capsules supply 200 mg. "certified

potency chasteberry fruit extract standardized to 0.9-1.1% glycosides,

including agnuside)", and advises that this dosage be taken twice daily.  The

other says one capsule contains 40 mg. Vitex-agnus castus fruit, and advises

taking one capsule two or three times daily; the label further states that

"dosage is based on research conducted on Vitex agnus-castus in Germany as

stated in Commission E Monograph revised December 1992".  Obviously these

dosages are rather far apart.  Can someone tell me what is actually a proper

dosage?



Thanks,

May



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Vitex dosage (was: fluid measures)

From: Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net>

Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 21:29:54 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net> :



> Marcia V Grossbard wrote:

>> about 1 quart and 1/2 approximately in English fluid measure.  A liter is

>> 1000 milliliters, and is metric and might be equivalent to two or three

>> drops.



From my experience with an eyedropper and a graduated cylinder, one ml

contains approximately 30 drops, give or take a drop.



> May Terry wrote: 

> dosages are rather far apart.  Can someone tell me what is actually a proper

> dosage?



For Vitex, the dosage that works really well for me is one teaspoon of

tincture, once a day. I don't know if that can compare to a standardized

capsule though.



Blessings - bek



-- 

bek@timelessremedies.com

http://www.timelessremedies.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Vitex dosage (was: fluid measures)

From: "Linda Shipley" <lindashipley@intercorp.com>

Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 22:56:29 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by lindashipley@intercorp.com :



May,

I know we have discussed this before. Please forgive me.

I am wondering about taking vitex during the luteal phase of  cycle. Is that

2 weeks prior and during the menstrual cycle? Thank you.

Linda Shipley

P.S. I took vitex for a while but it made me feel light-headed. I am

wondering if it was because I didn't take it during the luteal phase?



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Vitex dosage (was: fluid measures)

From: "Kerry's Herbals" <jclarke2@uswest.net>

Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 15:51:29 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by Kerry L. <jclarke2@uswest.net> :



> I am wondering about taking vitex during the luteal phase of  cycle. Is

that

> 2 weeks prior and during the menstrual cycle?



The luteal phase is defined as the time from ovulation until menses. So you

would take it from the time you ovulate (roughly 14 days prior to

menstruation, but every woman is different - my luteal phase is only 10-12

days long) and you would stop taking it once you start menstruating.



Kerry



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Vitex dosage (was: fluid measures)

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 12:45:09 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



May Terry <mterry@snet.net> wrote to herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>other says one capsule contains 40 mg. Vitex-agnus castus fruit, and advises

>taking one capsule two or three times daily; the label further states that

>"dosage is based on research conducted on Vitex agnus-castus in Germany as

>stated in Commission E Monograph revised December 1992".  Obviously these

>dosages are rather far apart.  Can someone tell me what is actually a proper

>dosage?



I do 15-20 drops of Vitex tincture, dried berries, 1:5 65 %, every

morning during the luteal phase (ovulation-menses).

I once tried to give powdered Vitex to a client; half a teaspoon a day.

After about two weeks she called me and said the taste was impossible.

Fortunately the tincture tastes different, and she was very happy with

that, then.



As to standardized - if you have to measure some marker constituent you

didn't know your herb, is my take.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland      http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, jpegs, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: fluid measures

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 23:12:37 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



Again I apologise to the list for any confusion.



For what I can share at the moment.  One fluid ounce contains 8 drams,

each dram contains 8 standard drops, and each standard drop contains 8

minims, which may be an apothecary measure.



When considering something for personal use, the strength of the material

in the liquid is the main consideration.  Some tinctures are effective as

two drops to 8 ounces of liquid.



Good luck and good health,

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: fluid measures

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 12:45:53 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> wrote to herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>For what I can share at the moment.  One fluid ounce contains 8 drams,

>each dram contains 8 standard drops, and each standard drop contains 8

>minims, which may be an apothecary measure.



And each tincture has a different number of drops to the milliliter (or

oz), as each tincture has a different viscosity.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland      http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, jpegs, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Echinacea and children

From: "chris coughlan" <gherbalistco@hotmail.com>

Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 06:23:46 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by chris coughlan <gherbalistco@hotmail.com> :



hello,

>Thought I might put my two bits in.

there is also a lot more to consider than just the administation of herbal 

preparations.

>It's the whats, the hows, thethe whys, etc.

>You know, how old is child, aqute or chronic ailment, the quality of the 

>product. If you have a certian senario you want to discuss just write back.

>As to the tinctures may this might help.

--If you take the standards suggested by Michael Moore

     ECHINACEA ANGUSTIFOLIA - root/flower Tincture[fresh 1:2,Dry     1:5 70% 

alcohol] Ave dose for adult 30-100drops as needed

      ECHINACEA PURPUREA   -  SAME AS ANGUSTIFOLIA

--So what does all of that mean. Well the ratio of 1:2 means 1 part plant 

and 2 parts solvent by volume. The solvent is 70% alcohol and 30% water.

-- If you compair that to a tincture that is at 1:3, 70% alcohol (1part 

plant and 3 parts solvent)you will have a 'weaker' or more diluted product. 

If it's a 1:10, well there is 5 times more solvent to plant if you compare 

it to the 1:2 ratio tincture.

---The alcohol is an other contributing factor that will determine the 

stregth of the product- but that all depends if the plants constituents are 

more soluble in alcohol or water. If you make your own an you use vodka 

(40%alcohol - 60%water). The tough question is is it stonger or weaker that 

a 70%alcohol tincture. you'll have a difference in opinion on that one.

>As to the doses ,well its herbal medicine, nothing is written in stone. It 

>all depends on WHAT the prparation is being administered for and for WHO. 

>That is where experiance comes into play.



>the other thing is is if its a store bought product make you know that the 

>company is of quality. Some companies may use a methanol or hexanol solvent 

>rather than a grain alcohol (ethanol) in there extraction.



>Oh ya, ml vs drops - just remember 30 drops per ml (may vary on dropper 

>size) 30 ml per ounce - oz. has approx. 900 drops

I hope this help out & all the best!!!

>chris coughlan

>>-



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Echinacea and children

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 23:06:37 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"chris coughlan" <gherbalistco@hotmail.com> wrote to

herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>--If you take the standards suggested by Michael Moore

>     ECHINACEA ANGUSTIFOLIA - root/flower Tincture[fresh 1:2,Dry     1:5 70% 

>alcohol] Ave dose for adult 30-100drops as needed

>      ECHINACEA PURPUREA   -  SAME AS ANGUSTIFOLIA

>--So what does all of that mean. Well the ratio of 1:2 means 1 part plant 

>and 2 parts solvent by volume. The solvent is 70% alcohol and 30% water.



Umm. MM says 



Fresh 1:2



That means that you take 1 part of chopped-up herb (by weight) to 

2 parts of 95 % alcohol (by volume). Throughout his materia medica the

menstruum strength for fresh herb is 95 %; it's understood, not

mentioned, except in the instructions at the very end.



>-- If you compair that to a tincture that is at 1:3, 70% alcohol (1part 

>plant and 3 parts solvent)you will have a 'weaker' or more diluted product. 

>If it's a 1:10, well there is 5 times more solvent to plant if you compare 

>it to the 1:2 ratio tincture.



Not necessarily. Which is why I like Michael Moore's percentages - they

are derived from the eclectics, foremost among them the Lloyd brothers,

who experimented to see just what ratios and percentages get most zing

from the least plant.



I'd say, generally, that I'd take 3-4 times more of a 1:5 40 % than of a

1:5 60-70 % (dried plant). 

And I'd take more than twice the amount of a 1:10 70 % than a 1:5 70 %

(Ech, dried herb).

However, dosage should -always- be mentioned with ratio and percentage.

If not, the tincture materia medica in your hand isn't any good.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland      http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, jpegs, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Fw: tendonitis

From: "brosta" <brosta@supanet.com>

Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 19:24:36 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Julia M Brown <brosta@supanet.com> :



My tendonitis is in my right elbow, l did try frozen peas first but then l

found it less painful when my elbow was warm. l can't afford chiropractors

in the U.K. l will take your advice and try the frozen peas again. Thank

you, Old York is very cold as well, roll on summer l say.

Julia (York U.K.)

"Make today the best you've ever had".



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Fw: tendonitis

From: JCrobin838@aol.com

Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 14:37:22 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by Jackie <JCrobin838@aol.com> :



In a message dated 3/1/01 2:31:52 PM Eastern Standard Time, 

brosta@supanet.com writes:



<<  Old York is very cold as well, roll on summer l say. >>



It's all those darn castles keep the cold in. BTW the York Cathedral is 

gorgeous.  I can't wait to see it again.  Grandparents were from Lancashire 

and Nottingham.



Jackietoo



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Fw: tendonitis

From: "brosta" <brosta@supanet.com>

Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 15:41:17 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Julia M Brown <brosta@supanet.com> :



Thank you every one for your help, willow sounds like the answer, l will

check out the prices at the health food shop. Living in the middle of a city

and in a wheelchair, trees are out.. l get my aspirin free, so l hope it

isn't to expensive. l get all drugs free from my Dr , and l take vitamins.

Julia (York U.K.)

"Make today the best you've ever had"



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: A Decision to leave Off Hormone Replacement Therapy

From: "Cindy Lee" <texasbluebonnets@home.com>

Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 15:36:28 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by Cindy Lee <texasbluebonnets@home.com> :



Dear Friends,



I have made a decision ( which my doctors will not be happy with but who

cares )    I have been having trouble with my blood repssure lately being

very high. I was sent to the emergency room yesterday from work because I

began to have a change in vision in my right eye, a bright squiggly flashing

line going up the center of my eye. It was exxtremly wierd. When iwent into

the health room at school my blood pressure was elevated to 180 over 100.

( I know, pretty dang high ) It remained so for a over a few hours until I

was in the emergency room. they gave me a CT scan to make sure I had nothing

going on in my brain, and think I may have been suffering the onset of

ocular migraines.  In the meantime I am to monitor my blood pressure and go

into the doctor tomorrow for follow up work.



 I have had a sudden change in my hormone therapy, I'm now taking Estradiol

and have heard that all forms of estrogen  can cuase an increase in blood

pressure. ( plus they think it was spiking because I was terrified )



In discovering that there really is no prescription estrogen that doesnt

have high blood pressure as a warning, ( I asked the pharmacist to tell me

which one does NOT raise your blood pressure he told me they all do )



So, I am going to go out on a limb here and just try not taking any at all

for ahwile, and maybe try to supplememnt some Soy and look into some other

herbs, but some that don't raise the blood pressure. Anyone know of any?



I have tried adding more soy into my diet and to be honest, I htink that

helped my hot flashes better then anything.



Cindy



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: A Decision to leave Off Hormone Replacement Therapy

From: "Heidi Scholes" <hscholes1@earthlink.net>

Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 17:08:29 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Heidi Scholes <hscholes1@earthlink.net> :



Good for you!



Try the soy, you can also try black cohosh. There are quite a few OTC

herbals in the stores now. Good luck!



The hot flashes are the pits, but the soy really helps. The other thing I

find really helpful is a good old fashioned hand fan, or even fanning with a

paper plate.



Don't laugh!! It helps!!



:-) Heidi



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: heart formula

From: rja86@webtv.net (Renee and Jerry)

Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 14:47:35 -0800 (PST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by Renee <rja86@webtv.net> :



Hi everyone,

Do you know if there are any products on the market in capsule or tablet

form that contain:

hawthorne, red clover, cactus grandiflorus, motherwort, garlic and

ginger.

This is Ian Shillington's heart formula in tincture form, and my husband

wont stick with it two and three times a day in tincture form.

His arrhythmia is getting worse, and has high cholesterol.

I am going to take him to a cardiologist when HE is ready.

Any suggestions appreciated and thank you all in advance.



Take good care and have a great day.



Love,  

Renee and Jerry



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: heart formula

From: rja86@webtv.net (Renee and Jerry)

Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 15:58:51 -0800 (PST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by Renee <rja86@webtv.net> :



I want him to be tested to see what is wrong, but would like, if

possible, to have him try the herbal route.  This formula I have is in

tincture form, and need to find it in another form.  HE wont disipline

himself to do the tincture thing several times a day at this point.

Thanks ;)



Take good care and have a great day.



Love,  

Renee and Jerry



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: heart formula

From: "Richard & Cyndi Ask" <ask@gtii.com>

Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 20:55:19 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Richard & Cyndi Ask <ask@gtii.com> :



I have fought heart problems since 1992.

Arrhythmia, for me, can be caused by lack of minerals

and/or blood sugar.



Richard



> Sent to the herblist by Renee <rja86@webtv.net> :

>

> I want him to be tested to see what is wrong, but would like,

if

> possible, to have him try the herbal route.  This formula I

have is in

> tincture form, and need to find it in another form.  HE wont

disipline

> himself to do the tincture thing several times a day at this

point.

> Thanks ;)

>

> Take good care and have a great day.

>

> Love,

> Renee and Jerry

>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: heart formula

From: Christa-Maria <cmaria@triton.net>

Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 22:54:53 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by cmaria@triton.net :



Renee, all of those herbs can be ingested in teaform, like make a

thermos full and have him zip it during the day..might be easier than to

remember to take the tincture..

But still, first you need a good diagnosis. If he has an electrical

problem that triggers the arrythmia, that can be managed, high

cholesterol take lifechanges.

C-M



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: heart formula

From: Christa-Maria <cmaria@triton.net>

Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 18:56:02 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by cmaria@triton.net :



As far as I can see this is a safe formula, but your husband has to be

checked just to stay on top of the situation unless he does not want to

live any more..

I have arrhythmia and take a cal/mag/c supplement that works well, with

the blessing of my Cardiologist, but every situation is different. First

find out what is going on, than you can figure out what to use.

C-M



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: heart formula

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 13:24:06 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



has high cholesterol.

Can you get foods into him with red yeast rice as a seasoning? Or get him

to take the capsules.   I find it pleasant, and it appears to have helped

my cholesterol.



Good luck and good health to you and yours,

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: heart formula

From: "D.L." <danlowe@ciudad.com.ar>

Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 03:49:58 -0300

--------

Sent to the herblist by daniela lowe <danlowe@ciudad.com.ar> :



Hi Renee, how are you ? How is your husband today?

I am also struggling with an arrythmia, since a long time ago. And in my

case I don't have cholesterol, or high blood pressure.

And that made me think about the whole subject and write to you.

You don't specificate, if your hubby, has ever been on a heart control.

Normally the first thing is ECG , and then to control his blood pressure.

There are many triggers of an arrythmia. And there are different kind of

arrythmias too! How do you know that in his case he has an arrythmia? Is his

pulse always too high? Even when he is not doing any efforts? Is it just

triggered when he gets nervous, or has any emotional strike? Does he feels

that sometimes his heart make some unnormal beatings , (like if it was going

to come out of his mouth) ? Those strange beating are called estrasistols,

and they are normal to everybody. But it depends on how many he is getting

through out the day. Is he stressed?

On the other hand , and besides everydays stile life triggers, you can be

facing any other heart alterations that have to be checked through different

studies.For example any arrythmia developed due an enlarging of the mitral

valve,  has to be treated in a different way. Also if he has an electrical

problem, this has to be treated in a different way, mostly they use

catheterism, which today is a very simple procedure, and a not risky one.

Then, and as you say he has a high cholesterol, he should check this, change

the diet, and see if this betters the condition, if not he should have some

other tests. Also and as you were already suggested Calcium and Magnesium

makes the situation better. And I was also recommended by a fellow list to

have a hair analysis, in case I was depleted of minerals. I have just

received the analysis, and I will hopefully send it this week.

I hope that this helps you in anyway.

I send you my best wishes, for you and your husband and also hope he can

have a soon recovery.



Danielita.

Tortuguitas,

Buenos Aires,

Argentina.



"Lo que mata no es la humedad, sino la repeticin"



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Spilanthes

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 05:30:07 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



>I know you can mix it with Echinacea to enhance its effectiveness.  It works

>on all types of infections, even viral in nature.

>I know John Mason has a book called "Growing Tropical Plants" that lists

>uses of this wonderful medicine.

>

>Good luck in your search

>Jimmie



I too have been looking for info on Spilanthes.  How would Spilanthes work, with

or without Echinacea, where the problem is allergies rather than infections?



I didn't even know, prior to this point, whether Spilanthes was temperate or

tropical.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Spilanthes

From: "H.A.C. Le Poole" <hlepoole@planet.nl>

Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 12:07:40 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by h.a.c. le poole <hlepoole@planet.nl> :



Dear list members,

Thanks for your interest and contributiions on this subject which I had

touched already more than a year ago on the same list without any response

and my conlclusion was at that time that here's one more herb which is still

quite unknown and undervalued, even tough it is so easily accessable and its

benefits so obvious.

Although it is indeed basically an herb from the tropics and subtropics it

will also grow quite well in temperate climates, if the summer is not too

bad. I have grown it on a semi-commercial scale in South Africa under very

hot conditions where it grows and flowers profusially with many runnners and

also in my garden in The Netherlands where it grew slowly, but did flower

reasonably well. Although basically all the parts of the plant can be used,

the highest concentration of the active ingredient(s) is found in the

flowers.

I have now found that the Thais have done several studies on Spilanthes, but

most of it is in written in Thai, with very brief english summaries.

However a herb friend of mine has just passed  a few references on to me

which I would like to share with you below. I am still trying to get the

complete publications, but the first impression I got is  that there is

indeed a similarity with Echinacea spp. as the main active ingredient in

Spilanthes seems to be spilanthol which is chemically very closely related

with the immunostimulating isobutylamides found in Echinacea spp..



Since so few on this list seem do have direct experience with this herb I

wonder if some of the experts on this list would not be interested to try it

out in their practices?



Anyway here are the references I found so far:



Ramsewak RS, Erickson AJ, Nair MG. Bioactive N-isobutylamides from the

flower buds of Spilanthes acmella.

Phytochemistry. 1999 Jul;51(6):729-32.



Fabry W, Okemo PO, Ansorg R. Antibacterial activity of East African

medicinal plants.

J Ethnopharmacol. 1998 Feb;60(1):79-84.



Fabry W, Okemo P, Ansorg R. Activity of east African medicinal plants

against Helicobacter pylori.

Chemotherapy. 1996 Sep-Oct;42(5):315-7.



Fabry W, Okemo P, Ansorg R. Fungistatic and fungicidal activity of east

African medicinal plants.

Mycoses. 1996 Jan-Feb;39(1-2):67-70.



Calle M, Caballero JD. Anti-herpes and anti-aphtha effects of Spilanthes

americana (Chisaca).

Rev Fed Odontol Colomb. 1977 Jan-Mar;24(120):59-66. Spanish.



May I finally ask Jimmy if he could kindly copy me off the list

hlepoole@planet.nl the paragraph in John Mason's book on Spilanthes,

supposing you have a scanner?



Rik Le Poole



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Spilanthes

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 01:30:40 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



In response to Rik Le Poole:



I'm looking for info on Spilanthes acmella now, am getting ready for an order of

herbs.  Blessed Herbs (no commercial interest, I am only a customer) in their

current catalog offers Spilanthes Root, certified organic.  Maybe the root keeps

better than the flowers?  I see you stated the flowers contain the highest

concentration of the active ingredient(s).  My immune system is strong for

avoiding infections, I am concerned with allergies, particularly food allergies

which seem to be escalating, or at least some of them.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Spilanthes

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 08:45:30 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net> wrote to

herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>I'm looking for info on Spilanthes acmella now, am getting ready for an order of

>herbs.  Blessed Herbs (no commercial interest, I am only a customer) in their

>current catalog offers Spilanthes Root, certified organic.  Maybe the root keeps

>better than the flowers?  I see you stated the flowers contain the highest

>concentration of the active ingredient(s).  My immune system is strong for

>avoiding infections, I am concerned with allergies, particularly food allergies

>which seem to be escalating, or at least some of them.



Help your -liver-.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland     http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, pics, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Spilanthes

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 01:51:49 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



> Help your -liver-.



Henriette,



I am not clear, was Spilanthes something that would help the liver?  Books I

have make no mention of Spilanthes.



I also wonder, what is supposed to be the effect of chaparral on the liver: 

is it beneficial, harsh, or still the subject of controversy?



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Spilanthes

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 08:55:47 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net> wrote to

herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>> Help your -liver-.

>

>I am not clear, was Spilanthes something that would help the liver?  Books I

>have make no mention of Spilanthes.



No, you asked about your allergies, which are on the rise. Help your

-liver-.



>I also wonder, what is supposed to be the effect of chaparral on the liver: 

>is it beneficial, harsh, or still the subject of controversy?



With your history? Stay well clear.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland     http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, pics, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Spilanthes

From: "H.A.C. Le Poole" <hlepoole@planet.nl>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 15:24:32 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by h.a.c. le poole <hlepoole@planet.nl> :



I can't see any benefit in using the roots.

As for the allergies: IMHO most cases are not due to food "contamination" ,

but  rather to an imbalance in your lipid metabolism, but I suppose that is

an off list topic.

----- Original Message -----

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

To: <herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu>

Sent: Wednesday, March 07, 2001 7:30 AM

Subject: Re: Spilanthes



> Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :

>

> In response to Rik Le Poole:

>

> I'm looking for info on Spilanthes acmella now, am getting ready for an

order of

> herbs.  Blessed Herbs (no commercial interest, I am only a customer) in

their

> current catalog offers Spilanthes Root, certified organic.  Maybe the root

keeps

> better than the flowers?  I see you stated the flowers contain the highest

> concentration of the active ingredient(s).  My immune system is strong for

> avoiding infections, I am concerned with allergies, particularly food

allergies

> which seem to be escalating, or at least some of them.

>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Spilanthes

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 18:47:49 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



>>I am not clear, was Spilanthes something that would help the liver?  Books I

>>have make no mention of Spilanthes.



>No, you asked about your allergies, which are on the rise. Help your

>-liver-.



Considering that H.A.C. Le Poole believes Spilanthes root has no benefit, I 

think I can save my money on that one.



>>I also wonder, what is supposed to be the effect of chaparral on the liver: 

>>is it beneficial, harsh, or still the subject of controversy?



>With your history? Stay well clear.



>Cheers

>Henriette



Recent events clearly force me to follow this advice, as asthma reliever turned

asthma provoker beginning gradually middle or late last January.  For a time I

didn't know whether the asthma exacerbation was because of chaparral, because of

something else in the mix, or despite the chaparral.  Now I wonder if the asthma

relief might have been due to something else, like wild yam (which I finished

early last December) or yucca root, which I definitely intend to try again,

without chaparral.  Wild yam and yucca root should be safe with me.  I still

have some of the yucca root left but am close to finishing it.



I don't know about harm to my liver, but since I seem quite able to digest 

raw peanuts, almonds, filberts and pecans, high in fat, I don't see any severe

liver damage.



Now I wonder how long it will take me to recover from the chaparral.  I've been

making up for lost time with green tea, which works much better for me than

lobelia or Chinese ephedra (ma huang).  Without the green tea, my condition

would be much worse.



I prefer to stay away from pau d'arco too, despite Balch's recommendation in

Prescription for Natural Healing.  Past experience, while not completely clear,

indicates a high risk factor, and I never came close to Balch's recommendation

of three cups a day.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: update on CIndy

From: "Cindy Lee" <texasbluebonnets@home.com>

Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 16:35:47 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by Cindy Lee <texasbluebonnets@home.com> :



Went to the doctors today to get updated on my blood pressure scare the

other day. Once again at school it was elevated, and again at the doctors

office it still was elevated, so doctor put me on blood pressure medicine.

She said I have a running history now for a while of it being elevated as

she looks over my records, they tend to assume that it's high because a

person is in pain or doesnt feel good but that this is obviously a sign that

that isnt the case here, that it's been to border line for too long so...

here we go. And I know I've heard enough about how if they want to put you

on blood pressure medcine to let them do it, better that thent o ignore it

right?



So I am on it and thier going to see me back in a month. Meanwhile they want

my blood tested for cholestorol and diabetis.  Mother, anyone in our family

got that?  Debbie or Tommy, any diabetics on daddys side?



Anyway, that's about where I stand right now. SHe did tell me also that I

need to find an outlet for my stress, asked me about my job, and so forth.

to be frank she told me to either find an outlet for the stress or quit my

job. so now what do I do.



well will upadte you all more later.



love

Cindy



The best and most beautiful things in the world cannot be seen or even

touched. They must be felt with the heart.

Helen Keller



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: update on CIndy

From: Debbie McDonald <lullwater@airmail.net>

Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 17:53:07 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by Debbie McDonald <lullwater@airmail.net> :



They never look for the cause. Do you take enough minerals for

example. Just stopping the horror called diet coke got me off high

blood pressure meds after several years. There are tons of things

to think of , get yourself an holistic doctor ND or something.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: update on Cindy

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 21:22:23 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Fri, 2 Mar 2001 16:35:47 -0600 "Cindy Lee" <texasbluebonnets@home.com>

writes:

> Sent to the herblist by Cindy Lee <texasbluebonnets@home.com> :

> so...

> here we go. And I know I've heard enough about how if they want to 

> put you on blood pressure medcine to let them do it, better that then

to 

> ignore it right?



If you want to get off it later on because of side effects, get guidance

to be weaned off.

>

> So I am on it and thier going to see me back in a month. Meanwhile 

> they want my blood tested for cholestorol and diabetis.  If you can

tolerate the bloodwork, some tests are helpful.  Perhaps they can include

TSH, which can subtly affect blood pressure. ( Thyroid stimulating

hormone, a more useful test TSH than T3 and T4).



Stress----Exercise?  Yoga? T'ai Chi?  Bead necklaces to give to charities

to make money. That is fun, but it is kind of "sit-down", but if you

enjoy the unfolding of design and color, it might do you good anyway.

Other crafts? Walk, march or dance to music?  Sometimes that can keep me

walking, marching, semi-dancing for 15 minute bouts, and if my energy

levels go up sometimes a little bit longer... Artwork, even bad artwork

is helpful, if your involvement is total concentration, or music

practicing or serious involved journaling or even random writing if it is

involved in concentration and sticking to a subject.   Massage?   Sauna? 

Facials?



Herbs?  Well if you are going on allopathic meds, you would have to be

careful with hawthorne berry capsules, which helped me, and you would

probably have to ask permission to use CoQ10, or vitamin E or low dose

gingko biloba, and if their choice med is a calcium channel blocker, you

would probably have to ask permission to use calcium tablets or

calcium/magnesium or the calcium ascorbate as used in Alacer III (nci). 

Complications are everywhere.



Good luck and good health to you and yours,

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Curcumin and adrenals

From: "Simon Martin" <sm@otherwise.fsbusiness.co.uk>

Date: Sat, 3 Mar 2001 21:07:41 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Simon Martin <sm@otherwise.fsbusiness.co.uk> :



 Sent to the herblist by Simon sm@otherwise.fsbusiness.co.uk



I am looking for herbs that might help sensitise cortisol receptors. I have

seen a reference suggesting that curcumin (tumeric) might do this. Has



anyone got any info on this?

Thanks,

Simon.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: R: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: "marco valussi" <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2001 11:25:57 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it> :



Hmmmm, I do not know really how relevant oral absorption would be for many

of the herbs.  This you are talking about seems to be a galenic form

mutuated from conventional and/or homeopathic treatments, but herbs are

different.  Many of them contain constituents in forms (glycosides) which

are not readily absorbable by mucosae, and need to be broken down to

aglycones by our intestinal flora.  Many other remedies work by local or by

reflex action in the gut and are not absorbed if not in minimal parts (in

fact, higher absorption via the oral mucosae might be uncalled for, if it

happened). Many of the vitamins need intrinsic factor from the stomach to be

absorbed.



marco



<<What I am talking about are products of Vitamist. (nci) They claim that

vitamins, herbs, and minerals  are much better absorbed through the mucous

membranes in the mouth than through the stomach. Amongst other formulas

they have one they call Cardio Care with Vit C and E, Ginko Biloba, Garlic

extract, ginger, Co-Q10, L-lysine, and L-proline. I hope someone can give

me some info,

Thanks,

Margot>>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: R: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: "marco valussi" <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 13:10:39 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it> :



It most probably is a saolubilizer of the Tween class, perhaps Tween 80,

which can be used internally, or one of the  IGEPALS put out by a French (I

think) company called Rhone Poullanc.   Usually long-chained polysaccharides



marco



<<'Solubaliser' is the rather clumsy name given to a product that disperses

essential oil into water, it gives the mixture a milky appearance. It is

made and distributed by Sunspirit of Australia--a company that has a

reputatation for being both professional and ethical.

When this product first came on the market I wrote to them (without holding

my breath!!) asking the source. They answered that they couldn't tell me

what it was other than that it was 100% plant derived and suitable for

ingestion after dilution (there is however a warning to keep out of the

reach of children).>>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: "Veress" <kveress@freenet.npiec.on.ca>

Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 09:16:59 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Veress <kveress@freenet.npiec.on.ca> :



Is there any experience and/or opinion about herbs, vitamins and minerals

in spray form?

They are fairly pricy, but also very convenient.

Thanks,

Margot



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net>

Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2001 15:19:24 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net> :



on 3/5/01 9:16 AM, Veress at kveress@freenet.npiec.on.ca wrote:



> Is there any experience and/or opinion about herbs, vitamins and minerals

> in spray form?



I have tried Herb Pharm's (nci) Echinacea Propolis throat spray and found it

wonderfully helpful for sore throat. What other types of sprays, or other

uses for sprays, have you come across? I will often put external skin

formulas into spray bottles for ease of use and that works just fine.



blessings, bek



-- 

bek@timelessremedies.com

http://www.timelessremedies.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 01:30:44 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



>I have tried Herb Pharm's (nci) Echinacea Propolis throat spray and found it

>wonderfully helpful for sore throat. What other types of sprays, or other

>uses for sprays, have you come across? I will often put external skin

>formulas into spray bottles for ease of use and that works just fine.

>

>blessings, bek

>

>-- 

>bek@timelessremedies.com

>http://www.timelessremedies.com



Is there any throat spray helpful for the dreaded throat tickle as opposed to

sore throat?  My throat is so preoccupied tickling, it has forgotten how to get 

sore.  Throat tickle for me means coughing and/or respiratory muscles will

tighten and make breathing and sleeping difficult.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net>

Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 02:39:45 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net> :



on 3/7/01 1:30 AM, Thomas Mueller at tmueller@bluegrass.net wrote:



> sore.  Throat tickle for me means coughing and/or respiratory muscles will

> tighten and make breathing and sleeping difficult.



It might help.  the first thing that comes to mind though might be a tea

made with sage (Salvia off.) and lemon thyme (Thymus citriadora). the combo

for me eases the throat and eases chest congestion. i'm going through my

"keep it simple" phase.



blessings!  bek



-- 

bek@timelessremedies.com

http://www.timelessremedies.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 19:25:23 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Mon, 5 Mar 2001 09:16:59 -0500 "Veress" <kveress@freenet.npiec.on.ca>

writes:

> Sent to the herblist by Veress <kveress@freenet.npiec.on.ca> : 

> 

> Is there any experience and/or opinion about herbs, vitamins and 

> minerals  in spray form?  They are fairly pricy, but also very

convenient.

> Thanks,  Margot



I haven't seen them in our local yuppy stores, where they would probably

show up first.

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 19:28:00 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Mon, 05 Mar 2001 15:19:24 -0500 Elizabeth Scotten

<timelesstree@earthlink.net> writes:

> Sent to the herblist by Elizabeth Scotten 

> <timelesstree@earthlink.net> :

> 

 I will often put external  skin  formulas into spray bottles for ease of

use and that works just 

> fine.  blessings, bek



I would like to hear more about this, if you would care to share.

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net>

Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2001 20:42:45 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net> :



on 3/5/01 7:28 PM, Marcia V Grossbard at ngbard@juno.com wrote:



>> Bek wrote:

>> I will often put external  skin  formulas into spray bottles for ease of

>> use

> Marcia wrote:

> I would like to hear more about this, if you would care to share.



I like to put my poison ivy formula in a spray bottle because sometimes

rubbing it onto the skin can be too painful and can irritate the blisters. I

sometimes do this with an insect repellent formula and a deodorant formula

as well as facial toners.  If you are into using Flower Essences, you can

combine your preferred remedies and add them to rosewater or a hydrosol that

you like and spray it on yourself or around the room for a more subtle

healing action on an emotional level.



:)  bek



-- 

bek@timelessremedies.com

http://www.timelessremedies.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: "Veress" <kveress@freenet.npiec.on.ca>

Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 19:34:54 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Veress <kveress@freenet.npiec.on.ca> :



What I am talking about are products of Vitamist. (nci) They claim that

vitamins, herbs, and minerals  are much better absorbed through the mucous

membranes in the mouth than through the stomach. Amongst other formulas

they have one they call Cardio Care with Vit C and E, Ginko Biloba, Garlic

extract, ginger, Co-Q10, L-lysine, and L-proline. I hope someone can give

me some info,

Thanks,

Margot



> I have tried Herb Pharm's (nci) Echinacea Propolis throat spray and found

it

> wonderfully helpful for sore throat. What other types of sprays, or other

> uses for sprays, have you come across? I will often put external skin

> formulas into spray bottles for ease of use and that works just fine.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: "Ravenna" <ravenna@netserv.net.au>

Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 13:35:11 +0800

--------

Sent to the herblist by Ravenna Morgan <ravenna@netserv.net.au> :



bek wrote:

I will often put external skin

> formulas into spray bottles for ease of use and that works just fine.



Greetings,

I too put lavender essential oil, solubaliser and distilled water in a spray

bottle for use on children with measles and chickenpox. If the spray bottle

is kept in the refrigerator and shaken well before use, the cool lavender

spray can help to ease the itching.



I have used this method on my dogs also.



Blessings



Ravenna

*Yes!*



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 09:35:32 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by May Terry <mterry@snet.net> :



Ravenna wrote:



> I too put lavender essential oil, solubaliser and distilled water in a spray

> bottle for use on children with measles and chickenpox. If the spray bottle

> is kept in the refrigerator and shaken well before use, the cool lavender

> spray can help to ease the itching.



Is 'solubaliser' a brand name?  Is it an emulsifier?  Is it natural?



Thanks,

May

--

Let food be thy medicine.

                --Hippocrates



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 11:48:11 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Tue, 06 Mar 2001 09:35:32 -0500 May Terry <mterry@snet.net> writes:

> Sent to the herblist by May Terry <mterry@snet.net> :

> 

> Ravenna wrote:

> 

> > I too put lavender essential oil, solubaliser and distilled water 

> in a spray... Is 'solubaliser' a brand name?  Is it an emulsifier?  Is

it natural? Thanks, May



Solvents for essential oils would never be natural.  Would it be "GRAS"

for mucus membranes?

Maybe if the final product were diluted with enough good quality water,

probably distilled, it might not be harmful in the process of delivering

stuff like vitamins, herbal essential oils, etc.



If there was a solvent derived from vegetable glycerin, it would still be

derivative-not natural, and it would probably be alcohol-based, because

as I understand it, glycerine is a higher alcohol.



Good luck and good health,

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: "Ravenna" <ravenna@netserv.net.au>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 14:28:29 +0800

--------

Sent to the herblist by Ravenna Morgan <ravenna@netserv.net.au> :



Subject: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals



>May wrote:

 Is 'solubaliser' a brand name?  Is it an emulsifier?  Is

it natural? Thanks,



Marcia wrote:

Solvents for essential oils would never be natural.



Greetings May and Marcia,



'Solubaliser' is the rather clumsy name given to a product that disperses

essential oil into water, it gives the mixture a milky appearance. It is

made and distributed by Sunspirit of Australia--a company that has a

reputatation for being both professional and ethical.



When this product first came on the market I wrote to them (without holding

my breath!!) asking the source. They answered that they couldn't tell me

what it was other than that it was 100% plant derived and suitable for

ingestion after dilution (there is however a warning to keep out of the

reach of children).



As I rarely take EO's internally I didn't need it for this application but

have used it in air sprays, sprays for the family, for pets and in insect

repellent sprays in the garden. I also use it for EO and water lotions for

rubbing on the skin to reperl insects.



Ravenna

*Yes!*



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 14:01:05 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Wed, 7 Mar 2001 14:28:29 +0800 "Ravenna" <ravenna@netserv.net.au>

writes:

> Sent to the herblist by Ravenna Morgan <ravenna@netserv.net.au> :

> 

> Subject: Re: spray herbs-vitamins-minerals> 

> >May wrote: >  Is 'solubaliser' a brand name?  Is it an emulsifier?  Is

 it natural? Thanks,> 

> Marcia wrote:  Solvents for essential oils would never be natural.



> 'Solubaliser' is the rather clumsy name given to a product that 

disperses

> essential oil into water, it gives the mixture a milky appearance. 



Makes the product a SOLVENT!



. They answered that they couldn't  tell me what it was other than that

it was 100% plant derived and suitable  for  ingestion after dilution.

What makes it suitable?



Grain alcohol?  Potato alcohol?   Glycerin derived from one of these?  I

doubt that it is a vinegar?

If they export to the USA they would have to list most of their

ingredients.  

Solumel nci, a nice but smelly diluent, is tea tree oil with tincture of

green soap and SD alcohol which is produced by the Melaleuca Company nci,

also Australian with a good reputation, but I wouldn't use it to start a

throat spray or a nasal spray.  



Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: red rice yeast

From: Elfreem@aol.com

Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2001 17:37:00 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by elfreem@aol.com :



>  Can you get foods into him with red yeast rice as a seasoning? Or get him

>  to take the capsules.   I find it pleasant, and it appears to have helped

>  my cholesterol.



Marcia,



Most preparations of red rice yeast are marketed in low doses. For

example, the dose of the active constituents similar to lovastatin

(an HMG-CoA reductase inhibitor) in Cholestin which was the first red 

rice yeast promoted in the U.S contains 2.4mg HMG-CoA reductase 

inhibitors. The recommended dose is 2 capsules BID or 2400mg/day 

(9.6mg active contituents). The starting dose of lovastatin is 20mg/day 

and the max is 80mg/day. When you consider that the dose of Cholestin 

is only half the starting dose of lovastatin you then understand the problem 

...at recommended doses red rice yeast is only good for mild to and

possibly moderate hypercholesterolemia, at best.



May I suggest that instead of increasing the dose of red rice yeast,

that you take the same dose with 4-8oz of grapefruit juice. Since grape-

fruit juice allows more lovastatin to be absorbed and delays its metabolism 

as well, its equivalent to doubling, tripling, or possible quadrupling the 

dose.



If you take me up on my suggestion, would you do me one small favor

---and that goes for anyone else who wants to try red rice yeast and

grapefruit juice:



1) after taking red rice yeast at the recommeded dose for at least 2 

months, would you get your LDL-C and HDL-C checked.



2) contact me via email at elfreem@aol.com and let me know your 

cholesterol values.



3) begin taking either 4 or 8oz (one of the other consistently, but not

both) grapefruit juice along with the same dose of red rice yeast after 

baseline cholesterol results are done.



4) contact me at elfreem@aol.com and let me know which amount of 

grapefruit juice you elected to take (ie. 4oz or 8oz).



5) 2 months after taking grapefruit juice with red rice yeast, have 

another LDL-C and HDL-C level.



6) contact me at elfreem@aol.com and let me know what the new values are.



Most community health centers charge a small amount for cholesterol

levels, so this shouldn't be a problem. For example, I think the Skokie 

Dept. of Health charges $10 which is a small indeed.



It is recommended that Cholestin be taken with a drink and some food 

to minimize the possibility of GI discomfort. At the first sign of severe 

unexplained muscle pain, tenderness, or weakness (one of the side effects 

of lovastatin and other HMG CoA reductase inhibiters), the grapefruit juice 

and red rice yeast should be discontinued.



Please let me know if this project interests you.



Regards,



Elliot Freeman RPh

Member, Association of Natural Medicine Pharmacists

www.anmp.org



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: red rice yeast

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 00:03:39 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



In response to Elliot Freeman:



I've seen red rice yeast that looked like rice but reddish, in a Chinese grocery

store.  Because of language difficulties, I couldn't get an explanation of how

this red rice yeast was used.  I think this red rice yeast would be used in

cooking, but how and how much?  Add to brown rice and beans?  I am also looking

for things that might improve my appetite, make the brown rice and beans go down

easier.  I can't use any capsicum because of delayed asthmatic reaction.  The

amount of cayenne/red pepper that one might use for medicinal benefits would

make me feel an energy blockage in the chest, just the opposite of what I'm

looking for.  I'm skinny and worried about calorie deficit rather than calorie

excess.



I am more interested in stimulating circulation and general energy than in

lowering cholesterol.  My only cholesterol measurement, as far as I remember, 

was in April 1997, and the reading, with no HDL/LDL breakdown, was 79, which was

below the normal range (105 to 200).



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: red rice yeast

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 11:37:55 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Tue, 6 Mar 2001 00:03:39 -0500 (EST) "Thomas Mueller"

<tmueller@bluegrass.net> writes:

> Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :> 

> In response to Elliot Freeman:

> 

> I've seen red rice yeast that looked like rice but reddish, in a 

> Chinese grocery  store.  Because of language difficulties, I couldn't

get an 

> explanation of how  this red rice yeast was used. 



It is red yeast rice, and It can be cooked multitudinous ways.   You

might like it as a major part of the breading mixture for baked or fried

meats, chicken or seafood, or added to a soup or stew and you may have to

develop a recipe to get the texture to please you.  Sometimes they sell

this as red riel ( whatever that means).



For the most part I use capsules by mouth, but sometimes I empty two

capsules into something that has yogurt or cottage cheese or mayonnaise,

and it adds flavor that pleases me.  I also take the capsules by mouth

with my tea with milk.



  Add to brown rice and beans? 

Why not.  

I am  also looking  for things that might improve my appetite, make the

brown rice and  beans go down easier. 

Why not try a small batch?



  I'm skinny and worried about calorie deficit rather  than calorie 

excess.

Do you have a fat that you can add in small amounts?   Fats, sugars and

small amounts of salty substances ( like Kelp and dulse if you are not

allergic) enhance flavors.  If you like them they could increase your

appetite if the food is appealing. And, of course, they would increase

your calories, and if you pig out often enough....



If your cholesterol is that low, maybe you only want this red yeast rice

as a powder to flavor your hardboiled egg salad that allopathic

physicians would tend to restrict to once in 7 to 10 days. 



Good luck and good health,

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: red rice yeast

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 01:51:40 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



>It is red yeast rice, and It can be cooked multitudinous ways.   You

>might like it as a major part of the breading mixture for baked or fried

>meats, chicken or seafood, or added to a soup or stew and you may have to

>develop a recipe to get the texture to please you.  Sometimes they sell

>this as red riel ( whatever that means).



This red yeast rice looks like red grains of rice, is not a powder.  I never

really thought of it as part of a breading mixture.  Besides this red riel, I

remember once actually having a red rice (really rice, not yeast) from Thailand.

I have difficulty with animal protein foods heavy on the upper abdomen, this

heaviness in some cases spreading to the respiratory system.  Animal protein

for me is limited to fish or squid on a sporadic basis, now I wonder if even

that is too much.  I believe nutritional yeasts contain vitamin B12, my main

concern regarding a vegan diet.



>Do you have a fat that you can add in small amounts?   Fats, sugars and

>small amounts of salty substances ( like Kelp and dulse if you are not

>allergic) enhance flavors.  If you like them they could increase your

>appetite if the food is appealing. And, of course, they would increase

>your calories, and if you pig out often enough....



Yes, I depend on nuts such as almonds, filberts, pecans and raw peanuts, also

sesame seeds and flax seeds, for fat calories.  It is counterintuitive to eat

a substantial amount of nuts in combination with an oily fish like Boston

mackerel (Scomber scombrus), but necessary to enable me to get sufficient 

calories since my appetite for grains such as brown rice is likely to be

severely diminished.



>If your cholesterol is that low, maybe you only want this red yeast rice

>as a powder to flavor your hardboiled egg salad that allopathic

>physicians would tend to restrict to once in 7 to 10 days. 

>

>Good luck and good health,

>Marcia



Even in my egg-eating days, I never really liked hard-boiled, always hated

mayonnaise, not a good bet now with my food allergies/intolerances.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: spilanthes

From: "hallie scher" <inner_be@yahoo.com>

Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2001 19:43:58 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by hallie scher <inner_be@yahoo.com> :



 I am a clinical herbalist and I am very interested in this herb. Can

someone tell me a little about it and thier experince with it?



Thank you

Hal



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Yerba de la Negrita

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 00:03:44 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



Does anybody know anything about Yerba de la Negrita (Sphaeralcea fendleri)?

One entry in the Blessed Herbs catalog is Yerba De La Negrita Herb, and I never

heard of this herb before, don't know where to find info.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Yerba de la Negrita

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 11:06:50 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net> wrote:



>Does anybody know anything about Yerba de la Negrita (Sphaeralcea fendleri)?

>One entry in the Blessed Herbs catalog is Yerba De La Negrita Herb, and I never

>heard of this herb before, don't know where to find info.



You'll find it in one or the other of Michael Moore's books. 

And it's in the Malvaceae, which should tell you lots. I think I've got

a pic of it online under Sphaeralcea.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland     http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, pics, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Yerba de la Negrita

From: "Pamela Quayle" <herbgatherer@hotmail.com>

Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 07:30:33 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Pamela Quayle <herbgatherer@hotmail.com> :



> Does anybody know anything about Yerba de la Negrita (Sphaeralcea

fendleri)?



Los Remedios by Michael Moore lists it under the common name Scarlet Mallow.

It is wild in the southeast US and used as a demulcent and emollient.  He

lists hair rinse for conditioning the scalp, for dry, raspy sore throat,

painful urinary tract and to sooth skin rashes.  Sounds like any Malvaceae

could be substituted.



pamela



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Yerba de la Negrita

From: Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net>

Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 10:21:56 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net> :



>Thomas wrote:

>

>Does anybody know anything about Yerba de la Negrita (Sphaeralcea fendleri)?

>One entry in the Blessed Herbs catalog is Yerba De La Negrita Herb, 

>and I never

>heard of this herb before, don't know where to find info.

>

Thomas, well it grows here in the southwest, it is a mallow. you can 

find some info on it in Healing Herbs of the Upper Rio Grande, 

Traditional Medicine of the Southwest, by L.S.M. Curtin revised and 

edited by Michael Moore original 1947 new 1997 relatives of the plant 

S. coccinea , S.incana, S. ambigua and S angustifolia are used 

similarly look at Michael Moore's books Los Remedios and Medicinal 

Plants from the Desert and Canyon Southwest. Basically it is a 

soother for skin, uti, sore throats can also be used as cream rinse. 

It is fairly hairy plant and the hairs are irritating this plant 

needs to be made into a decoction, to be useable. Sharon in Tucson



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Hormones

From: "Angela" <aldt77@dial.pipex.com>

Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 17:02:34 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Angela <aldt77@dial.pipex.com> :



Im trying to find where we get progesterone from before the menopause.  I

have just learned quite a bit about hormones but have a few missing

pieces.  Ive learned progesterone is the precurser to estrogen in women

and testosterone in men.  I have suspicion that Asthma has a connection to

hormone problems could be wrong but curious.  Also because there are so

many hormone replacement herbs on the market would like to understand

which one is for which for example Black cohosh decreases progesterone It

seems to me and Agnus Castus increases it,it seems. I would be grateful

for any help.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Hormones

From: "brosta" <brosta@supanet.com>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 12:40:38 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Julia M Brown <brosta@supanet.com> :



Hi Angela, l am taking Black cohosh  for hormone replacement, it can take

four to eight weeks before you see the benefits.

Julia (York U.K.)

"Make today the best you've ever had"



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Hormones

From: "Amy Cook" <acook@in4web.com>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 08:05:22 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Amy Cook <acook@in4web.com> :



I believe it is produced by the ovaries.  



> Im trying to find where we get progesterone from before the menopause>>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Hormones

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 11:19:39 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"Angela" <aldt77@dial.pipex.com> wrote to herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>Im trying to find where we get progesterone from before the menopause.  I

>have just learned quite a bit about hormones but have a few missing

>pieces.  Ive learned progesterone is the precurser to estrogen in women

>and testosterone in men.  



That is not so. If progesterone were the precursor of estrogen you'd

only have estrogen between ovulation and menses, ie. when you have a

corpus luteum. The corpus luteum is what's left after the egg has left

its "cup", and that's what makes progesterone.



I don't remember what comes before estrogen (or testosterone, or

progesterone), but the raw material for -all- steroid hormones is

cholesterols. Which are not as dependent on dietary cholesterols as you

might think.



>Agnus Castus increases it, it seems.



Vitex strenghtens the corpus luteum and thus the progesterone phase of

your cycle. If you think your corpus luteum dies early on you get off 

- caffeine (coffee, tea, chocolate, cola drinks, guarana...)

- stress

- tobacco

- anything else that enhances your adrenaline secretion



and do Vitex. And liver herbs.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland     http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, pics, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Hormones

From: "Emily Roe" <emily@foxroe.freeserve.co.uk>

Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 18:44:29 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Emily <emily@foxroe.freeserve.co.uk> :



Hi Angela

>

> Im trying to find where we get progesterone from before the

menopause.

As Amy said in a reply progesterone is produced in the ovaries, but as

menopause progresses then progesterone and eventually estrogen levels

fall as the ovaries shut down.



>I  have just learned quite a bit about hormones but have a few

missing

> pieces.  Ive learned progesterone is the precurser to estrogen in

women

> and testosterone in men.  I have suspicion that Asthma has a

connection to

> hormone problems could be wrong but curious.  Also because there are

so

> many hormone replacement herbs on the market would like to

understand

> which one is for which for example Black cohosh decreases

progesterone It

> seems to me and Agnus Castus increases it,it seems. I would be

grateful

> for any help.

A good place to get information about the menopause and herbal

treatments is

on  the alt.support.menopause newsgroup.



Emily(UK)



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Hormones

From: "Angela" <aldt77@dial.pipex.com>

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 17:00:29 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Angela <aldt77@dial.pipex.com> :



Im still confused about hormones I'm affraid.  Could someone please

explain the elementals.  For example what are the syptoms of too much

estrogen or too little.  And how can a woman have too much testosterone. 

And anything else which would help me to understand.  Much apprieciated.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Hormones

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 10:19:01 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"Angela" <aldt77@dial.pipex.com> wrote to herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>Im still confused about hormones I'm affraid.  Could someone please

>explain the elementals.  For example what are the syptoms of too much

>estrogen or too little.  



You might want to check 



- the European Journal of Herbal Medicine. Peggy Wilbur (I think) did a

two-part article in 1995 (or so), and those articles are online.

Here: http://www.btinternet.com/~nimh/ - go for the EJHM, go for the

archived articles, look for hormones.



- the latest issue of Medical Herbalism (subscription info and back

issues here (nci): http://www.medherb.com ). It had a nice piece on PMS,

its different causes, and what to do about said causes.



>And how can a woman have too much testosterone. 

>And anything else which would help me to understand.  Much apprieciated.



Testosterone in women has to do with ovarian cysts.



Cysts are small hollow balls of scar tissue. Your egg can't cross scar

tissue as easily as it can most any other tissue (it 'burns' its own

path, most of the time), and if it hits a knot of scars it'll bounce

back, not able to go anywhere, burning away the tissue around it,

causing the body to throw up a wall of scar tissue around it in defense.

If the cyst is close to the ovary it also includes the egg-cup (= the

corpus luteum), which has started to send out progesterone ... but which

is now enclosed in a hollow ball.



Your hypothalamus and pituitary wonder "Where is all the progesterone we

should be seeing in the blood? We ovulated, didn't we?" and start to

send out -more- gonadotropin releasing hormones (GRH) and luteinizing

hormones (LH), respectively.



Now, your corpus luteum -is- producing progesterone. The progesterone is

just not going anywhere. It gets the hormone-stimulating hormones in its

blood supply, so it's now producing -more- progesterone, but your

pituitary and hypothalamus still can't see it. As your levels of GRH and

LH go up and up and up, your hormone-producing glands (including the

corpus luteum, but with high enough levels of GRH and LH they all start

to react) go frantic and put out anything they can. Some of it is very

strange. Some of it is testosterone. A lot of the testosterone comes

from your corpus luteum, which is set up to produce something quite like

it. The testosterone will sit in that cyst until, after perhaps ten

days, your corpus luteum dies. (It's wearing itself out too fast with

its overly hectic production schedule). As your egg dies, too, your cyst

is eventually reabsorbed. Or it might burst. Either way, you now have an

extremely interesting cocktail of hormones in your bloodstream. That

fancy lady's beard is the least of your troubles ...



What to do, what to do ... 



Help your -liver-. Clean up your eating and drinking habits. If you give

your liver a rest from whatever crud it is you ask it to handle every

day, it has a chance at general house-cleaning, and can resolve scar

tissue, lowering the risk for another cyst. See, the more scar tissue

you have on or around your ovaries, the higher the chance for another

cyst.



It'll take a while, so go on a lots-of-fresh-veggies, no coffee, no

fried fat, no sugar etc. diet, for half a year or so. Learn to wok or

something.



And do dandelion, burdock, berberis, or other liver herbs.



Fibroids are cysts that are filled with connective tissue. Same protocol

- help your liver, and clean up your habits.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland     http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, pics, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Hormones

From: Susan Beck <susanb@rlns.com>

Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 15:08:28 -0800

--------

Sent to the herblist by Susan Cole <susanb@rlns.com> :



    Thought I'd clarify some of the obvious confusion (and inaccurate

information) regarding progesterone:



   Progesterone IS ABSOLUTELY a precursor of estrogen (all three types of

estrogen).  Hormones are formed from cholesterol, which forms pregnenolone, from

which comes progesterone.  Progesterone can then EITHER be made into cortisol OR

androstenedione.  If it goes the androstenedione route, androstenedione will

then form testosterone, which in turn will form the three estrogens: estrone,

estradiol, and estriol.

     It is true that progesterone production can be described as "secreted by

the ovaries", but this description is a little simplistic.  The mechanism by

which progesterone is secreted by the ovaries goes as follows: Ovaries are made

of up hundreds of thousands of sacs (also called follicles) which contain eggs.

After menstruation, when both estrogen and progesterone levels are low, the

pituitary gland (located in the brain) gets the message that there isn't enough

estrogen, so it releases follicle stimulating hormone (FSH), which causes one of

the follicles of the ovaries to secrete estrogen. This estrogen secretion then

sends the signal back to the pituitary gland to stop the production of FSH, and

at the same time signals the pituitary gland to secrete luteinizing hormone

(LH).  A surge of LH is released at ovulation, which causes the follicle to

rupture and expel an egg into the fallopian tube.  This ruptured follicle then

becomes a structure known as the corpus luteum.  This structure then secretes

large amounts of progesterone (and smaller amounts of estrogen).  If there is no

fertilized egg, the corpus luteum will eventually degenerate, and estrogen and

progesterone levels will decline, leading to menstruation, when the cycle begins

all over again.

    Any of the above information can be confirmed in a physiology book.

   I hope this helps.

   Susan



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Hormones

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 11:50:53 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by May Terry <mterry@snet.net> :



Susan Beck wrote:



>     Thought I'd clarify some of the obvious confusion (and inaccurate

> information) regarding progesterone:

>

>    Progesterone IS ABSOLUTELY a precursor of estrogen (all three types of

> estrogen).



Thank you, Susan--it does help.  I'm wondering if you can tell me, what happens when

ovulation is sporadic, as at perimenopause?  I'm taking vitex during the luteal

phase, due to menorrhagia, but will it help if I haven't ovulated at all?  (I'm 49

and still have pretty regular menstrual periods.)



May

--

Let food be thy medicine.

                --Hippocrates



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Hormones

From: "LJS Doody" <ldoody@internetcds.com>

Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 09:09:33 -0800

--------

Sent to the herblist by LJS Doody <ldoody@internetcds.com> :



may



there is an excellent book "women hormones and the menstrual cycle" by ruth

trickey, i think it would interest you



Lizzie



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: URGENT- baby fever

From: "NIAMH MCGINLEY" <niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 13:16:34 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Niamh <Niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk> :



Hello everyone.



I need some help. My 15 mth old boy had a sudden onset fever sometime

between 11 and 1 am. No vomitting, diahorrea stiff neck, rash or anything

like that. He is now running at 103.3 and drowsy. He will drink milk. Imade

him a chamomile, elderflower, catnip and cinnamon tea but he won't take it.

No cough or cold as such, some green from nose, when he does cough it is a

bark (his usual). His tongue has a thick white coat, thichest left andright

of centreand across the middle, although can't see the back. It has been

less thick but a definite coat for some weeks now, like after you drink milk

only a tad drier.. But its a lot thicker today. His heart and breathing are

racing. He isn't sweating.



Doc says chest is clear and could be a virus but because he has a history of

a UTI (no fever that time) she has prescribed amoxycillin and paracetemol.

Urine tests won't be through til Fri or Mon, I'd rather wait to see if it is

another UTI but is this too long to wait? Today is Wadnesday, 1pm.



The previous UTI was due to reflux, we refused the prophylactic antibiotics

and treated him homeopathically. There hasn't been a problem for 9 months

ish. He is teething but surely this is more?



I don't have any meadowsweet, I do have white willow bark: is it ok for

babes? Any other recommendations?



Thanks in anticipation,



Niamh & Peter



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: URGENT- baby fever

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 08:20:25 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by May Terry <mterry@snet.net> :



NIAMH MCGINLEY wrote:



> I need some help. My 15 mth old boy had a sudden onset fever sometime

> between 11 and 1 am. No vomitting, diahorrea stiff neck, rash or anything

> like that. He is now running at 103.3 and drowsy.

>

> I don't have any meadowsweet, I do have white willow bark: is it ok for

> babes? Any other recommendations?



A while back Henriette recommended a lemon balm bath for babies; I've used a

gylcerite this winter when I feel like I'm fighting off a virus, and it seems to

help.



May

--

Let food be thy medicine.

                --Hippocrates



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: URGENT- baby fever

From: "Kerry's Herbals" <jclarke2@uswest.net>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 07:33:45 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by Kerry L. <jclarke2@uswest.net> :



> I need some help. My 15 mth old boy had a sudden onset fever sometime

> between 11 and 1 am. No vomitting, diahorrea stiff neck, rash or anything

> like that. He is now running at 103.3 and drowsy.



Hi Niamh! While I know fever is scary in small children, it is very normal

for them to run quite high fevers. A 103 fever in an adult would cause

panic, yet that fever in a child is relatively normal. It's best to go by

his demeanor - if he's not lethargic or unresponsive, and he's not having

severe headaches, abdominal pain or neck pain, then my opinion is that it's

best to let the fever run it's course (meaning - don't give any fever

reducers, such as children's tylenol, or even natural fever reducers).



>He will drink milk.



I wouldn't recommend giving him milk (unless you're talking about mama's

milk, which is a different story entirely!). Dairy increases mucous

production, and is not a good thing to give while battling a cold. Same for

citrus. I'd stick with water, watered down apple juice, flat sodas like

ginger ale or sprite. The one concern with fevers is that the baby doesn't

become dehydrated. He should be having at least 6 wet diapers a day.

However, during illness, they often do become somewhat dehydrated. As long

as he's got at least 2 wet diapers, it hasn't reached *dangerous* as long as

it doesn't last more than a couple days. Again, go by his demeanor, not the

numbers on a thermometer.



> Doc says chest is clear and could be a virus but because he has a history

of

> a UTI (no fever that time) she has prescribed amoxycillin and paracetemol.

> Urine tests won't be through til Fri or Mon, I'd rather wait to see if it

is

> another UTI but is this too long to wait? Today is Wadnesday, 1pm.



I'd definitely wait on the abx until you know for sure if you're dealing

with an infection. Prophylactic abx are EVIL, as are the doctors who

prescribe them, IMNSHO.



>

> The previous UTI was due to reflux, we refused the prophylactic

antibiotics

> and treated him homeopathically. There hasn't been a problem for 9 months

> ish. He is teething but surely this is more?



Not necessarily. My son was notorious for running really high fevers while

teething. It would often peak at 102-103, and the next day he'd be fine,

with a lovely new pearly white.

>

> I don't have any meadowsweet, I do have white willow bark: is it ok for

> babes?



My understanding, and I could be wrong, is that willow bark contains

salicylates, also found in aspirin. For this reason, willow bark should be

avoided in children, for the same reason as aspirin (Reye Syndrome).

However, others may know more about this than I do - it could be that there

are other components to willow bark that would protech the child against

this, that are not present in aspirin.



>Any other recommendations?



Just keep him comfortable. Again, I wouldn't do anything to treat the fever,

per se. You might try giving him some antimicrobial herbs, such as Oregon

Grape Root, which will help against virus OR bacteria. Echinacea to help

stimulate his immune response. Otherwise, lots of fluids and TLC, and try to

ride it out.



Good luck!



Kerry



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: URGENT- baby fever

From: "Jimmie" <wolfclan@home.com>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 08:44:01 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Jimmie <Wolfclan@home.com> :



Have you noticed any change in the color or smell of his urine?  Watching

what the Kidneys are producing is usually a good indicator if its an

infection or not.  Kids run fevers sometimes, and for reasons the

"traditional" medical society has no answers for.  Keep him comfortable,

lots of juice to make sure he doesn't become dehydrated, use a sponge with

cool, not cold water...gently apply to forehead, face, back...make sure he

doesn't get a chill.  Keep him close, don't let him see you worry, just

cuddle him and make him feel loved and safe.  In his eyes, you're his hero.



Prayers,

Jimmie



> Sent to the herblist by Niamh <Niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk> :

>

> Hello everyone.

>

> I need some help.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: URGENT- baby fever

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 14:24:08 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Wed, 7 Mar 2001 13:16:34 -0000 "NIAMH MCGINLEY"

<niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk> writes:

> Sent to the herblist by Niamh <Niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk> :

> 

> Hello everyone. I need some help. My 15 mth old boy had a sudden onset

fever 

> sometime between 11 and 1 am. 



One of your return posts mentions getting in the fluids. GREAT IDEA!   If

you are pushing the milk which he does not want, perhaps instead you can

make a batch of chicken broth, which is supposed to move mucus out

slightly more efficiently than plain water and similar fluids.  If you

add garlic and lemon and lemon balm and maybe a smidge of powdered ginger

root  and really make a strong decoction and pour it through a coffee

filter, it might not only go down good, but you would getting the fluids,

the proteins and the "helper-fighters" into the same drink.  Suggest

adults have smidges in a glass and say,"MMMMM good!" or something before

you serve.



Good luck and good health to you and yours,

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: URGENT- baby fever

From: "Daphne Saul" <dtstsz91@hotmail.com>

Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 21:58:52 

--------

Sent to the herblist by Daphne Saul <dtstsz91@hotmail.com> :



"If you

add garlic and lemon and lemon balm and maybe a smidge of

powdered ginger

root  and really make a strong decoction and pour it through a

coffee

filter, it might not only go down good, but you would getting

the fluids,

the proteins and the "helper-fighters" into the same drink. "



Another helpful decoction, since you've mentioned a concern for the urinary 

tract here, might be ginger and red clover.



I cut it in half with juice for my kids (I wonder if your baby would drink 

cranberry juice?), and they really like it...It has a natural sweetness to 

it...and the red clover has antibiotic properties, as well, and is good for 

the urinary tract.



Hope baby's better soon!!!



Daphne



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: URGENT- baby fever

From: Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net>

Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 11:21:40 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net> :



>

Niamh, I think that my reply comes days late but here is a 

recommendation for the future Mary Bove's book An Encyclopedia of 

Natural Healing for Children and Infants she is a British trained 

herbalist who became a naturopath and midwife. Recommend this book to 

my clients.  Sharon in Tucson



---

You are currently subscribed to herb as: hetta@saunalahti.fi



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: foods/herbs with hormonal properties

From: Astrid9787@aol.com

Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 12:15:25 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by erica <astrid9787@aol.com> :



hello,



i was wondering what your take is on this matter. i am suffering from candida overgrowth/interstitial cystitis/inner imbalance, pms, acne, GI distress/constipation, dysmennorhia, eczema, and several allergies that appear to be related to candida. righ now i'm focusing on my immune system, endocrine system, and digestive system...or at least i'm trying to:)



i just wrapped up a short vegetable juice fast last night. the first thing i ate was a green salad with braggs liquid aminos. when i got home a few hours later, i had a green apple, a banana, and a raw carrot. i also had a cup of uva ursi tea.



recently, i've been taking fish oil caps, evening primrose oil caps, and i took compounded dong quai (from gaia) during the follicular phase and am now taking what's called vitex elixir (also from gaia) during the luteal phase. i stopped taking birth control pills last month. i have been easing back on natural antifungals a little bit to give my body some rest. 



before i started the juice fast i got a fever blister on my lip. i've never had one before. i believe this might be due to my having a few vodkas at a bar last week (plus staying up late and having to go to work early the next morning). i never drink anymore, but did just this one time to feel "normal." duh....i should've known better. i haven't felt well since. not that i've been feeling well anyway, but this just made my symptoms worse. i am using lemon balm on the cold sore.



also, just this morning the skin on my jawline started to itch and a few hives popped up. i felt fabulous during the fast....no symptoms whatsoever. i'm wondering what could've caused the hives....braggs liquid aminos or the apple or banana? all consumed last night.



this brings me to my main question. late yesterday i found this article online written by a woman who successfully combated many of the problems (or at least similar ones) i'm suffering with using traditional chinese medicine. her big thing is that you must avoid any herbs and foods with hormonal/estrogenic properties or you'll never recover. here are some of the things she mentions in her article:



--The common symptoms of PMS such as mood swings, depression and bloating are all signs of estrogen dominance. Evening Primrose oil, which contains estrogenic activity, is a popular supplement for PMS sufferers.  It offers quick relief for PMS symptoms but long term use may aggrevate the problems.  Most people don't realize this.  A PMS sufferer who had been taking evening primrose oil for 4 years came to see me.  Her thighs were swollen with water retention due to excessive estrogens.  After I told her to stop taking evening primrose oil, her swollen thighs became normal in about a month's time. 



she goes on to say:



There seems to be a common misconception in the natural health community that women with high estrogen levels should take phytoestrogen (plant estrogen) because phytoestrogens are "protective estrogens" which reduce estrogenic activity. It is believed that phytoestrogens compete with endogenous estrogens for estrogen receptors.  When the estrogen receptors are occupied by phytoestrogens, cell divisions are reduced because phytoestrogens are "weak estrogens". This theory made sense to me until my own experience showed otherwise. With my endometriosis, my pain level was a measurement for my condition. When I tried Don Quei, Licorice, Ginseng and Royal Jelly, I did feel better initially for a few weeks because they helped my blood circulation. As I continued to take these remedies, my pain would come back with a vengeance, more severe than before. I realized that weak estrogens could add up significantly if given enough time. I believe that many women are misled by initial feel!

in!

gs of wellness without realizing

 that longer periods of usage actually makes the problem worse. Many other endometriosis sufferers that I know also have had similar experiences with phytoestrogen.  After my personal experience, my belief is that weak plant estrogens may replace our own more potent estrogens for receptor sites, but our own estrogens still have to go somewhere if the liver is incapable of eliminating them. 



and finally:



Generally I have found that estrogen contents in foods are less than in herbs.  My suggestion for women with hormone imbalance is to avoid herbs which have estrogenic activities such as Don Quei, Licorice, Ginseng, Royal Jelly, fennel, hops, anise, clover, flax seed oil and evening primrose oil even though they may make you feel better initially.  Estrogen-containing foods such as alfalfa, chick pea, carrot (or beta carotene) can be taken occasionally but not on a regular basis. 



what, if anything, do you make of this? now i'm worried that taking the compounded dong quai and vitex plus the efa's are wrong and i'm only messing things up more. this is my body i'm talking about and it's already screwed up enough. i want to get better, not worse.



of course, this goes against everything i've read. it's all so confusing.



thanks to anyone that can offer assistance.



best regards,

erica 



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: foods/herbs with hormonal properties

From: Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net>

Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 13:45:15 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net> :



Hi Erica



Sounds like you've been doing the right things. Could you have reacted to

the banana?  I know that i have suffered from many of the same symptoms in

the past and can only tolerate banana for some reason only during

menstruation.  I'm surprised that you didn't get hives during the fast,

which would be a prime time for your body to detox via the skin as well as

in other ways.  The phytoestrogen info is new to me as well. Does this

include vitex?  i've had such good luck with it and was about to start

taking it again. I have recently started a "diet" (i hate that term)

recommended by my chiropractor, along with supplements, to help deal with

blood sugar/hypoglycemia issues, and also get the hives and jaw tingling

when i'm allergic to things, but also when i'm detoxifying. i'll let you

know if it's helpful because it seems to go along well with the candida type

diet, except no dairy is allowed.



be well!  bek



-- 

bek@timelessremedies.com

http://www.timelessremedies.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: foods/herbs with hormonal properties

From: "B J Wyatt" <bjwyatt@accesstoledo.com>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 20:40:15 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Brenda J. Wyatt <bjwyatt@accesstoledo.com> :



Hi, Erica:



Just a few thoughts on candida based on my own life with it the past few

years--I used the Dr. Cook book's diet as a starting point--three weeks of

very little variety in my diet, but was symptom-free very quickly this

way--can't remember the title and the book is lent to a friend (The Yeast

Syndrome?). All literature I have found recommend avoiding sugar in any

form--yes, fruit, too (also fruit juice)--in fact, in my case, fruit will

give me a reaction (the hive-y rash you spoke of) more quickly than

processed sugar. Actually, I do little raw--very simple grains like oats,

quinoa, mild beans in small quantity (nothing with a tough skin), eggs, soy,

miso, animal protein if you eat animals, very little dairy, shiitake

mushrooms (portabellas, too, and I would think morelles), dulse and/or kelp,

seeds and nuts--I do lots of brothy soups, dark greens (cooked), less raw

all the time--acidophilus and bifidus helped me tremendously when I was

trying to regain some sort of balance in my system, as well as burdock or

dandelion root tincture and pau d'arco infusion. I also used whey protein

powder while on the severely restricted diet, since I don't eat meat--



I get thrush inside my mouth from acidic veggies/fruits--tomato

especially--my symptoms my come immediately (orange or grapefruit), or take

some time to develop (tomato)--your fever blister may have a similar cause



> --The common symptoms of PMS such as mood swings, depression and bloating

are all signs of estrogen dominance.



These are also signs of candida--the same thing? Are all people with candida

overgrowth estrogen dominant? Maybe someone else on the list can shed some

light here.



If my diet gets out of whack now, I'll go get a bottle of acidophilus or

bifidus and use it until gone while paying closer attention to my diet

(again!! yes, but life gets in the way!)--anyway, hope some of this was

helpful.



Be well,

Brenda



Brenda J. Wyatt

Womynwyse Herbs & Botanicals



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: foods/herbs with hormonal properties

From: "brosta" <brosta@supanet.com>

Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 13:53:17 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Julia M Brown <brosta@supanet.com> :



Hi Erica, You sure gave us a lot to get our heads round, l couldn't follow

everything, l have e.mailed before about Candida, all l can tell you is what

l found out treating myself.  l read up a lot on evening primrose oil, l

never found anywhere that it could cause weight gain. The symptoms you

mention could all be caused from Candida, it is evil when it takes over. You

might be wise to forget p.m.s  at the moment,  and plan to settle the

candida first. l got started with Leon Chaitow's Candida Albican, it tells

you what you can eat and drink and vitamins and herbs to help. After six

years on his diet l found other things that helped me, acidophilus is a must

in all candida treatments. If you can take Echinacea, that helps fight acute

candida , it was cranberry juice that got me O.K. but l still have to drink

a glass every morning. l think that clears my system of anything l ate and

drank that was wrong for me. If you like a drink, stick to dry white or red

wine, not red if you have high blood pressure.l also drink my two cups of

Lapacho tea, that cleanses.

Readers Digest, Vitamins, Minerals,and herbs, have an easy to follow page on

Yeast Infections, good luck.

Julia (York U.K.)

"Make today the best you've ever had".



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: foods/herbs with hormonal properties

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 18:47:29 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



Erica,



I never heard of ill symptoms resulting from taking herbs and foods containing

phytoestrogens long-term, though there might be discomforting effects from too

much of a specific herb, such as ginseng or Angelica sinensis.



Avoiding some of the foods/herbs you cite seems too restrictive, in particular,

if you don't get sufficient vitamin A from animal sources, you need beta 

carotene from plant sources on a steady basis.  If you eat a healthy amount of

fruits and vegetables, you will get beta carotene.



  Generally I have found that estrogen contents in foods are less than in herbs.

  My suggestion for women with hormone imbalance is to avoid herbs which have

  estrogenic activities such as Don Quei, Licorice, Ginseng, Royal Jelly,

  fennel, hops, anise, clover, flax seed oil and evening primrose oil even

  though they may make you feel better initially.  Estrogen-containing foods

  such as alfalfa, chick pea, carrot (or beta carotene) can be taken

  occasionally but not on a regular basis.



Chinese herbal medicine views licorice as a peacemaker herb, used in many or

most combinations.  Don Quei (Angelica sinensis) is considered too strong to

take on a steady basis, I think so is Ginseng.  I believe clover, flax seeds,

carrots, alfalfa and chick peas are considered safe for consumption on a regular

basis, except where there are specific allergies or other contraindications. 

Most people don't know these foods contain phytoestrogens.  I didn't.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: foods/herbs with hormonal properties

From: Ray Bayley <silwit@suba.com>

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 02:42:48 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by silwit@suba.com :



>Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :

>I never heard of ill symptoms resulting from taking herbs and foods containing

>phytoestrogens long-term, though there might be discomforting effects from too

>much of a specific herb, such as ginseng or Angelica sinensis.

	As hard as it was to believe, elimination-reintroduction 

trials showed one woman client of ours to react to phytoestrogens, 

even just those in a reasonable diet with vegetables.  They 

interfered with her cycle--she would have irregular, skimpy, or even 

no menses.  That is until between nutrition and herbs we got the 

lab-assayed detox pathways of the liver working well.  Now she eats a 

reasonable amount of vegies no problem.  Why?  Not sure.  A guess 

would be that somehow her own estrogens or the phytoestrogens needed 

to be sulfated, put into a buffer pool...ummmm, from there I don't 

know yet the explanation.  Of course, there are other explanation 

paths.  My first science mentor told me "well done data stands 

forever, explanations change".  If anyone has an explanation of this 

client I'd like to hear it.



>Avoiding some of the foods/herbs you cite seems too restrictive, in 

>particular,

>if you don't get sufficient vitamin A from animal sources, you need beta

>carotene from plant sources on a steady basis.  If you eat a healthy amount of

>fruits and vegetables, you will get beta carotene.

	Some do not adequately convert provitamin A (carotenoids) 

into human bioactive vitamin A (e.g. retinol).  We have literally 

seen clients with orange skin (sclera, palms, even limb and face 

skin), from consuming, e.g., lots of carrot juice, who actually were 

vit A deficient.  Various nutritional deficiencies, hormonal 

imbalances, and liver problems can cause this.  Strong hints that 

genetics can too, e.g. the same cold climate, ancestors-ate-fish gene 

pools that have a harder time converting vegetable omega-3 to animal.



>   Generally I have found that estrogen contents in foods are less 

>than in herbs.

>   My suggestion for women with hormone imbalance is to avoid herbs which have

>   estrogenic activities such as Don Quei, Licorice, Ginseng, Royal Jelly,

>   fennel, hops, anise, clover, flax seed oil and evening primrose oil even

>   though they may make you feel better initially.  Estrogen-containing foods

>   such as alfalfa, chick pea, carrot (or beta carotene) can be taken

>   occasionally but not on a regular basis.

	I'd sure love to see an actual table on this--weights of food 

and herbs and their phytoestrogen/flavone contents.  Anyone know of 

such a table?  Pretty please.



-- 

Ray Bayley

silwit@suba.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: "Solubaliser"

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 14:11:10 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Mon, 5 Mar 2001 13:10:39 +0100 "marco valussi" <marcobabi@libero.it>

writes:

> Sent to the herblist by Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it> :



> Marco said: It most probably is a saolubilizer of the Tween class,

perhaps Tween 

> 80,  which can be used internally, or one of the  IGEPALS put out by a 

> French (I > think) company called Rhone Poullanc.   Usually

long-chained 

> polysaccharides , marco



> Ravenna said:> <<'Solubaliser' .... disperses  essential oil into

water,  Sunspirit of Australia-  it was 100% plant derived and suitable 

for ingestion after dilution (there is however a warning to keep out of 

> the reach of children).>>

  

Marcia: maybe it is too derived to be natural.  If it is a

polysaccharide, and it is not a migraine trigger for people who have to

worry about that, maybe it can be considered "GRAS".



Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: ear infection

From: "Linda Shipley" <lindashipley@intercorp.com>

Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 21:46:21 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by lindashipley@intercorp.com :



Hello all,

I am interested in an herbal treatment for my 9 year olds

ear infection. She doesn't like the garlic oil in the ears. Does this oil

cure the ear ache/infection? I have given her echinacea and she can't stand

the goldenseal. (I can't blame her.) She wants the "pink" medicine from the

allopath. I can't think of the name of the chronic otitis media

medication-something like erythromyacin. I would like to know if anyone has

found an equivalent to that??This is kind of scary for me. She has had these

quite often and they are painful I understand. I would like to get rid of

them for good. I know dairy and wheat might be a culprit. She doesn't drink

milk or eat much of the other either. Well, thanks for your help.

Linda Shipley



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: RE: ear infection

From: "Leppihalme, Miikkali" <leppihalme@quartal.com>

Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 10:57:28 +0200 

--------

Sent to the herblist by Miikkali Leppihalme <leppihalme@quartal.com> :



Linda Shipley:

> I am interested in an herbal treatment for my

> 9 year olds ear infection. She doesn't like the

> garlic oil in the ears.



Is it the oil or the smell of garlic that she dislikes? If she is willing to

use some other oil, Mullein (Verbascum sp.) oil would be the one to use.



> Does this oil cure the ear ache/infection?



Garlic oil can be helpful but it can also be quite rough to the skin of the

ear tube. Go with Mullein. It reduces the pain right away and heals the

infection. A couple of drops in the ear a few times a day, or whenever the

pain comes back.



-

M



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: ear infection

From: "Linda Shipley" <lindashipley@intercorp.com>

Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 12:56:40 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by lindashipley@intercorp.com :



Hi and thank you to all who responded about my daughter's ears and what to

do. The ENT checked her ears with a tympanometer and she has very negative

pressure behind one ear. Also she has yeast/fungus growing in her ear. He

gave us Lotrimin drops. I am considering using the combo mullein drops I

found at the health food store also. Will this assist in draining or

whatever is needed to rebalance the pressure in the ear? He said there was

no inner ear problem, just the pressure problem. We are to return in a week.

Thanks. We are cutting out the sugar, by the way. This will be tough. She

likes to eat sweets every day.

Linda S.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: RE: ear infection

From: "chris coughlan" <gherbalistco@hotmail.com>

Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 15:03:25 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by chris coughlan <gherbalistco@hotmail.com> :



>Re:Ear Infections

>Linda Shipley:

> > I am interested in an herbal treatment for my

> > 9 year olds ear infection. She doesn't like the

> > garlic oil in the ears.

>

I'll pass on a formula that I use very successfully to treat all

types of ear ailments. The reason that I have formulated this herbal 

preparation was to use it as an alternative to anitbiotic threrapy.

The herbal and aromatic constituents are so complex in their structure that 

viruses & bacteria cannot genetically mutate to be resistant to it. Over the 

years I collected hundreds os case studies with all positive outcomes. It 

can be used for ear infections, excess ear wax, or ever mites in your dogs 

ears. It's formulated specifically with children in mind.



Base-Org. cold pressed olive oil

Macerate 50g of lobelia inflata c/s and 50g verbascum thapsus lf. in 1 lt. 

of base oil for 14 days. Transfer and heat for 3 hrs at approx. 80 degrees 

(low setting on your crock pot work excellent!). Strain.



Per 100ml of macerated oil add:

Lavendual off.(lavender) - 120 drops

Melaleuca alternifolia(tea tree) - 100 drops

Thymus satureioides(thyme) - 20 drops

Cymbopogan martini(palmarosa) - 40 drops

Aniba roseaodora (rosewood) - 40 drops

Citrus limon(lemon) - 20 drops

Shake and bottle.

1-3 drops per ear 1-3 times per day. Keep in mind that internal application 

of herbs to cleanse and support the lymph/liver/immune

systems is a must. A mucusless diet is appropiate aswell.

> > Does this oil cure the ear ache/infection?

With great success and it smell wonderful.

Chris



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: ear infection

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 15:57:46 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Wed, 7 Mar 2001 21:46:21 -0600 "Linda Shipley"

<lindashipley@intercorp.com> writes:

> Sent to the herblist by lindashipley@intercorp.com :

> 

> Hello all,

> I am interested in an herbal treatment for my 9 year olds

> ear infection. She doesn't like the garlic oil in the ears.  Warm

compressing may not need any ingredients.   If there is itching, that is

another story. (peroxide,etc)



There may be no cold symptoms, but generally when you go to an allopathic

Ear Nose and Throat specialist, there are mostly things to take by mouth,

usually decongestants and antibiotics.

To have an herbal antibiotic-type  substance by mouth, there are:

capsules of garlic, garlic oil perles, oil of oregano in capsule form,

olive leaf; teas like melissa-lemon balm.   There is also food like

chicken soup with garlic,etc.



Decongesting by mouth or sprays is usually an allopathic option.  Perhaps

steaming with herbs to get some soothing moisture to the nasopharynx

where otitis frequently starts ( kelp in a bowl of boiling water with a

beach towel steam tent being my personal favorite).  Allopathic nasal

douching is very similar to neti pot activities.



Good luck and good health,

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: ear infection

From: Pjcpinole@cs.com

Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 15:45:46 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by Pjcpinole@cs.com :



You might try warm mullein drops.  It might be the garlic that is troubling 

your daughter.

Namaste,

Phyllis - California



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: ear infection

From: "Linda Shipley" <lindashipley@intercorp.com>

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 08:57:11 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by lindashipley@intercorp.com :



I am concerned about the eustachian tube draining properly now more than

anything.  Anyway I believe the pressure in the ear would be normalized when

that happens. Do you think the mullein would help that?

Many thanks.

Linda S.>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: ear infection

From: "chris coughlan" <gherbalistco@hotmail.com>

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 20:39:23 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by chris coughlan <gherbalistco@hotmail.com> :



>I am concerned about the eustachian tube draining properly now more than

>anything.  Anyway I believe the pressure in the ear would be normalized 

>when

>that happens. Do you think the mullein would help that?

Hi Linda,

When you place varbascum oil with in the outer ear it will percutaneously 

absorb through the permiable tempanic menbrane. If you are going to be 

administering the oil 1-3 drops 3-4 times per day over a period of it will 

slowly reduce the inflammation and reduce the fluid buildup behind the 

eardrum. The eustachian tube is connected to the sinuses and lymph system in 

the neck so with the support of mucolitic and expectorant herbs (eyebright, 

fenugreek, elder,etc.)internally you should get good results. Gaia herbs has 

a gylcerine tincture called Edler eyebright compound for childrenthat woks 

excellent.

So, yes it will help to equalize the pressure.



chris coughlan



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: ear infection

From: "Linda Shipley" <lindashipley@intercorp.com>

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 17:14:41 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by lindashipley@intercorp.com :



Thank you for explaining that to me, Scott. I have  read Echinacea was good

to give with ear problems in children, but then I heard on the list about it

causing growth problems in kids. Anybody know anything else about this??

Linda



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: ear infection

From: Pjcpinole@cs.com

Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:39:13 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by Pjcpinole@cs.com :



It's a good question.  I don't know the answer.  

Good luck,

Phyllis



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Scabies

From: "Ravenna" <ravenna@netserv.net.au>

Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 13:22:30 +0800

--------

Sent to the herblist by Ravenna Morgan <ravenna@netserv.net.au> :



Greetings to all



Urgent help needed!! My immaculately clean husband has Scabies! we are

appalled. I have moved into the spare bedroom at his suggestion but it still

makes him feel like a leper!



He belongs to a swimming club and visits the pool 4 times a week, we think

that this is where he may have contracted the mite. At the moment we are

using Neem extract topically but I understand that topical applications may

be useless unless the entire body is treated. Has anyone got

experience/advice about this problem? I sincerely hope so,



Ravenna

*Yes!*



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Scabies

From: "brosta" <brosta@supanet.com>

Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 16:05:42 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Julia M Brown <brosta@supanet.com> :



Hi Revenna, My daughter got Scabies from a kid at school, this was about

1970, l guess things have improved. We all had to brush some stuff all over

our bodies, not to use anyone  face cloth or towel. Sorry l am not much

help, l guess better than nothing. Good luck.

Julia (York U.K.)

"Make today the best you've ever had"



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Carry case

From: keith hubbard <keithhubb@yahoo.com>

Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 15:18:25 -0800 (PST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by keith hubbard <keithhubb@yahoo.com> :



Hi, Folks



Does anyone out there know were I can buy a herbal

portable carrying case? That has small bottles

securied by elastic and opens like a book. I saw one

at the A.H.G. conference , 7song uses one for his

herbal first aid kit. I guess I should of asked back

then but forgot too.



Thanks for any help,

Keith Hubbard C.H.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Carry case

From: Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net>

Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 09:24:47 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net> :



on 3/8/01 6:18 PM, keith hubbard at keithhubb@yahoo.com wrote:



> Does anyone out there know were I can buy a herbal

> portable carrying case? That has small bottles

> securied by elastic and opens like a book. I saw one



They are pretty easy to make. Some options, if you want to buy, are regular

toiletry kits or small tool boxes. I've used a toolbox for Emergency Medical

Tech med kits. for my own herbal first aid kit i copied an old fashioned

jewelry case of my grandmothers, complete with pockets and pouches for

everything. The commercially made toiletry/travel kits often have places for

bottles, scissors, small tools etc and seem to work quite well.



blessings, bek



-- 

bek@timelessremedies.com

http://www.timelessremedies.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Sphaeralcea

From: Susan Marynowski <sumar@mail.ifas.ufl.edu>

Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 20:53:25 -0400

--------

Sent to the herblist by susan marynowski <sumar@gnv.ifas.ufl.edu> :



Pamela Quayle wrote 3/6/01:

>Los Remedios by Michael Moore lists it under the common name Scarlet Mallow.

>It is wild in the southeast US and used as a demulcent and emollient.  He

>lists hair rinse for conditioning the scalp, for dry, raspy sore throat,

>painful urinary tract and to sooth skin rashes.  Sounds like any Malvaceae

>could be substituted.



Just to clarify....the Sphaeralcea is wild in the SOUTHWEST united states.

We also have a native "scarlet mallow" or "scarlet hibiscus" (H. coccineus)

that grows in swampy areas here in the southeastern united states that is

very different in visage, with red blossoms about 6" in diameter! But, as

you say, probably any Malvaceae could be substituted.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Solubilizer

From: ferret <ferret@panix.com>

Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 21:08:24 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by ela <ferret@panix.com> :



What is the difference between a solubilizer/solvent and an emulsifer,

then?  Thanks!



- Ela



   (000)___(000)        Ela Heyn

   /   @    @  \        ferret@panix.com

   |           |

   ======@======    http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/5483



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Solubilizer

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 09:59:03 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Thu, 8 Mar 2001 21:08:24 -0500 (EST) ferret <ferret@panix.com> writes:

 What is the difference between a solubilizer/solvent and an  emulsifer,

then?  Thanks! - Ela



Solubilizer/solvent dissolves and disperses and spreads something like an

essential oil throughout the liquid in question.  Emulsifier holds things

together so that you would not have an oily surface like the top of a

very greasy chicken soup on the top of the liquid, or a greasy scum on

top and the remainder of the liquid un-mixed.  A solvent is needed when

you want to add essential oils to a basically watery mixture.  Oh, yes,

you can keep shaking your mixture, and some mechanical action will change

your watery solution like kids making "perfume" out of mom's old cologne

with water, but the grownups will never like it.



Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Speedwell

From: "Cindy Lee" <texasbluebonnets@home.com>

Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 07:30:33 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by Cindy Lee <texasbluebonnets@home.com> :



Does anyone know anything aobut an herb called Speedwell?



thanks



cindy



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Speedwell

From: Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net>

Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 09:32:33 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net> :



on 3/9/01 8:30 AM, Cindy Lee at texasbluebonnets@home.com wrote:



> Does anyone know anything aobut an herb called Speedwell?



Veronica officinalis. It's a beautiful, low growing perennial with

lilac-blue flowers. Makes a nice groundcover and likes part shade.



It has alterative, expectorant, and diuretic properties.  I haven't used it

medicinally, so i can't testify to it, but the leaves have and astringent

flavor. I really enjoy it as a garden plant though. It is really lovely!



blessings, bek 



-- 

bek@timelessremedies.com

http://www.timelessremedies.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Speedwell

From: "chris coughlan" <gherbalistco@hotmail.com>

Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 14:37:56 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by chris coughlan <gherbalistco@hotmail.com> :



>Does anyone know anything aobut an herb called Speedwell?



Hi cindy, If your want to know more about common speedwll(Veronixca off., 

SCROPHULARIACEAE) I have used it mostly for mucus congestion, uric acid 

build up(gout), and mostly urinary problems with calculi

(combines well with hydrandea rt & gravel rt.).

Common speedwell is different form her sister plant "tall 

speedwll"(Veronicastrum virginicum)  or also called Culver's root which is a 

cathartic laxative.They are both small herbaceous plant that grow in the 

u.s.



Hope this helps,

Chris Coughlan MH

Canada



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Speedwell

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 10:04:32 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Fri, 09 Mar 2001 14:37:56 -0000 "chris coughlan"

<gherbalistco@hotmail.com> writes:

> Sent to the herblist by chris coughlan <gherbalistco@hotmail.com> :

t common speedwll(Veronixca  off.,  SCROPHULARIACEAE) I have used it

mostly for mucus congestion, uric  acid  build up(gout), and mostly

urinary problems with calculi

> (combines well with hydrandea rt & gravel rt.). 



How do you use it for mucus congestion?  ( tea, tincture added to a glass

of water?)  Do you keep it dried in bunches and make a strong decoction

for a week of the seasonal colds and flu?  Can you buy it packaged as a

tea or powdered in capsules? ( My need is almost bad enough to yell help

to the list.)



Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Ear infections

From: "Eleanor K. Sommer" <eksommer@gator.net>

Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 11:11:01 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Eleanor K. Sommer <eksommer@gator.net> :



> herbal treatment for my 9 year olds ear infection.

I tried a garlic/mullein oil made by Herbs Etc. It smells only VERY mildly

of garlic. You don't even notice it unless you stick your nose right in the

bottle! Two drops in each ear before I showered and/or before I went

outside on a cold or windy day plus a drop in each ear before I went to

bed. It took a while, but the ear infection is gone.

Ellie Sommer

eksommer@gator.net



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Symphytum

From: "Rosemari Roast" <walkinthewoods@5Pillars.com>

Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 12:57:54 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Rosemari Roast <walkinthewoods@5Pillars.com> :



NatureSymphytum officinalis and Sympytum uplandicum ~ does anyone have any

experience with respect to these two comfreys?



When prescribing this herb I always stick with the Symphytum officinalis, as

that is the one that is well documented and widely used.



However, for myself, I grow and use (externally) Symphytum Uplandicum (AKA:

Russian comfrey) and I am curious about their medicinal connections. I have

found very little docuemented about this Russian cousin and yet, my

experience and sense tells me they may well be interchangable.



Any input?



rose



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Symphytum

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 06:56:12 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"Rosemari Roast" <walkinthewoods@5Pillars.com> wrote to

herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>However, for myself, I grow and use (externally) Symphytum Uplandicum (AKA:

>Russian comfrey) and I am curious about their medicinal connections. I have

>found very little docuemented about this Russian cousin and yet, my

>experience and sense tells me they may well be interchangable.



Yes, you can in principle use all Symphytums interchangeably. However,

they all contain hepatotoxic pyrrolizidine alkaloids (PAs) to a greater

or lesser degree.



The one you're talking about is Symphytum x uplandicum [1], and it's got

more PAs than Symphytum officinale.



Also, according to a German study PAs were found in the blood after

external application.



So use other plants. I like Calendula flowers (external use) and petals

(internal use), or Plantago leaf, but plantain is far more work to pick,

and it's not as gorgeous while drying as the Calendula.



For mucilage I usually use mallows. I have seven or so different species

in my garden, and they give me quite a lot of herb each summer.



Cheers

Henriette



[1] ie., a hybrid. The parent species are S. asperum and S. officinale.

S. asperum is called, in Swedish, feed comfrey, I guess because it's

been used to feed livestock.



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland     http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, pics, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Symphytum

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 00:33:24 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



> NatureSymphytum officinalis and Sympytum uplandicum ~ does anyone have any

> experience with respect to these two comfreys?



There was discussion on this list some time ago.  Apparently 

Symphytum uplandicum contains pyrrolizidine alkaloids that can be damaging to

the liver when taken long-term.  Symphytum officinalis was believed much safer

in this regard.  I have no experience of my own, have used Symphytum officinalis

but only on a limited basis, short-term.  If I had used the same amount of 

Symphytum uplandicum, I would have in all likelihood been well below the danger

level.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Symphytum

From: "Eleanor K. Sommer" <eksommer@gator.net>

Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 07:38:09 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Eleanor K. Sommer <eksommer@gator.net> :



>Subject: Re: Symphytum

Symphytum officinalis was believed much safer

>in this regard.



According to some information I received via James Duke, the following

levels of pyrrolizidines are found in various symphytum species. Note the

plural: pyrrolizidines are a group of alkaloids, so on some constituent

lists, it is difficult to compare the various amounts of pyrrolizidines,

unless someone has conveniently grouped them together or unless you know

them by name.



S. officinale

Leaf = 300 ppm

Root = 3,000 to 6,000 ppm



S. x uplandicum (also called Russian comfrey)

leaf = 100 to 1500 ppm



S. tuberosum

Root = 330 plus ppm



S. asperum

Leaf = 100 ppm

Root = 1400 to 3700 ppm



Ellie Sommer

eksommer@gator. net



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Symphytum

From: "Heidi Scholes" <hscholes1@earthlink.net>

Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 12:21:26 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Heidi Scholes <hscholes1@earthlink.net> :



Ellie

Is there a comparison of the allantoin content also?



Thanks for the information

Heidi



a blank email to leave-herb-97361G@franklin.oit.unc.edu



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Asthma and Herbs

From: "Emily Roe" <emily@foxroe.freeserve.co.uk>

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 13:52:27 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Emily <emily@foxroe.freeserve.co.uk> :



Can anyone tell me of any contraindications for herbs when used 

by people suffering from Asthma? I am thinking specifically

of St John's Wort or Echinacea.



Thanks



Emily Roe



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Asthma and Herbs

From: "Steve and Christine Wilson" <scwilson@bigpond.net.au>

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 11:27:38 +1100

--------

Sent to the herblist by Christine <scwilson@bigpond.net.au> :



Hi Emily

> Can anyone tell me of any contraindications for herbs when used

> by people suffering from Asthma? I am thinking specifically



We had a case here in Oz where a person who was an asthma suffer died from

taking Royal Jelly.



> of St John's Wort or Echinacea.



I have not heard about these two herbs or any others but others on the list

may be able to help .



My only concern would be giving herbs to any pts with an allergic diathesis

. I guess you would have to look at the individual case . Anyone like this

is at risk of being allergic to whatever.



I'd be interested in others views.



Just a few thoughts

Chrisitne



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Asthma and Herbs

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 23:42:28 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



>Can anyone tell me of any contraindications for herbs when used 

>by people suffering from Asthma? I am thinking specifically

>of St John's Wort or Echinacea.



>Emily Roe



I've never used St. John's Wort but hear it helps clear some foreign substances

from the body including anti-rejection drugs given to organ transplant patients.

That might be advantageous for asthma, only a guess on my part.  I have taken

Echinacea but never on a steady long-term basis, owing to general 

recommendations not to use Echinacea on a steady long-term basis.  Unclear

whether Echinacea helped, but no indication of any harmful effect.



Regarding other herbs, it helps to know what family they're in, so you have an

idea about possible allergic reactions.  Most people suffering from asthma will

probably not be allergic to the great majority of herb species, but might be 

allergic to some.  



Cayenne is in many allergy/asthma mixtures, but I have to be careful to avoid

these, since cayenne definitely has adverse effect on me, apparently due to the

solanine.  Anybody buying a herbal mixture for allergies, asthma or anything

else is advised to read the ingredients!



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Asthma and Herbs

From: "Emily Roe" <emily@foxroe.freeserve.co.uk>

Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 08:01:01 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Emily <emily@foxroe.freeserve.co.uk> :



Thanks for the replies so far on the Asthma and herbs.

From my observations of my daughter in the 14 years

since her asthma started there is a very strong correlation 

between stress and an attack, nothing she is in contact

with or around seems to bring on an attack, though she

is more prone to them when she has a cold. But increase 

the stress and the attacks start. She does suffer from 

Hayfever in the summer months but unless she is highly

stressed the asthma takes its holiday around then.

So unless it is the stress and an allergy working together

then I don't think allergies are a problem generally.



Emily ROe



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Asthma and Herbs

From: "Kerry's Herbals" <jclarke2@uswest.net>

Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 13:03:10 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by Kerry L. <jclarke2@uswest.net> :



I haven't been following the thread closely so I don't know if this has been

mentioned, but does your daughter consume dairy products? This is a BIG

contributor to asthma (and excema, and ear infections, and respiratory

allergies). Even if the asthma seems to be triggered by stress, dairy can be

one of the factors contributing to it. I would highly recommend eliminating

dairy from her diet and see if that doesn't help.



Kerry



> Sent to the herblist by Emily <emily@foxroe.freeserve.co.uk> :

>

> Thanks for the replies so far on the Asthma and herbs.

> So unless it is the stress and an allergy working together

> then I don't think allergies are a problem generally.

>

> Emily ROe

>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Asthma and Herbs

From: KR1989@aol.com

Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 13:16:39 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by kr1989@aol.com :



HI,

I have asthma and control it with herbs.  I have never even heard of using 

echinacea or st.johns wart for it.  I stick with large doses of 

antioxidents(c,e, and pycnogenol), nettle, propolis, and bee pollen.(as 

someone on the list already pointed out, be careful with the bee pollen and 

even the propolis.  If you're allergic to bees you could have a terrible 

reaction and even die)  It is recommended that anyone trying bee pollen for 

the first time start with one small granule under there tongue and see if 

they experience any tingling, stinging, ect..then if that goes OK take one 

granule the first day, 2 the next and keep increasing by 1 granule a day 

until your pretty comfortable that it isn't going to cause a reaction.  

Brands of herbs and antioxidants do have an effect also.  If one brand 

doesn't seem to work try another...they are not all created equal!

Kathy Haag

Pure Pleasures Natural skin care

www.ppleasures.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Asthma and Herbs

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 00:08:20 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



from kr1989@aol.com :



>I have asthma and control it with herbs.  I have never even heard of using 

>echinacea or st.johns wart for it.  I stick with large doses of 

>antioxidents(c,e, and pycnogenol), nettle, propolis, and bee pollen.(as 

>someone on the list already pointed out, be careful with the bee pollen and 

>even the propolis.  If you're allergic to bees you could have a terrible 

>reaction and even die) (snip)



How, in what form, do you take nettle?  Is it by capsule, or by infusion or

decoction?



I have never taken Pycnogenol(R) as such, but have tried a do-it-yourself

version made by including Pinus strobus (once Pinus sylvestris) lead stems and

needles in a mixed herbal brew.  I have also used spruce, not sure of the

species, but the needles are blue-green, and it's a frequently cultivated

variety or species, apparently the same species widely used for Christmas trees.

But I am strongly dependent on green tea.  I don't know if it's the catechins

(antioxidants), theophylline or something else, but it can't be simply the 

caffeine, since yerba mat does little or nothing for me.



I never tried coffee, have always found the smell unpleasant, though not nearly

as bad as tobacco smoke.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Asthma and Herbs

From: KR1989@aol.com

Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 09:57:52 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by kr1989@aol.com :



I use the nettle in the capsule form.  I have tried a couple brands with the same amount of success.  In the pycnogenol, I need to use the same brand always.  I had a freind who recommended a different brand and I tried it, but it wasn't as effective as what I was already using.  Experiment and try different brands. 

Good luck,

Kathy Haag

Pure Pleasures

www.ppleasures.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Lupus

From: "Angela" <aldt77@dial.pipex.com>

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 17:07:49 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Angela <aldt77@dial.pipex.com> :



Does anyone know of anything that has stopped or affected Lupus. 

Thankyou.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Saw Palmetto

From: "Angela" <aldt77@dial.pipex.com>

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 17:29:09 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Angela <aldt77@dial.pipex.com> :



Hello

Very interested to here Saw Palmetto used for women in the menopause.  I

was under the impression it was just for men [silly I know].  Does anyone

know how it works for women.  And any good tips for a very worried friend

whose father suffered with prostate problems for years and he is now

following in his footsteps.  Hes trying Saw Palmetto with Pygem Africanam,

it is early days yet.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: allantoin in comfrey

From: "Eleanor K. Sommer" <eksommer@gator.net>

Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 08:36:01 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Eleanor K. Sommer <eksommer@gator.net> :



<Is there a comparison of the allantoin content also?



<Thanks for the information

<Heidi



Yes there is:

S. asperum = none listed

S. officinale = 4500-13000 LF and 6000-25000 RT

S. x uplandicum = none listed for the leaf and 6000-8000 RT



I'm not sure how extensive the tests are for these herbs. Sometimes there

is a long list of constituents and sometimes very short. I am not sure that

means a constituent is not present. Although it seems that a lab requested

to test comfrey (at great expense!) would test for the the allantoin in all

the comfreys! So maybe it is in fact not present if not listed!



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: allantoin in comfrey

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 15:43:10 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"Eleanor K. Sommer" <eksommer@gator.net> wrote to

herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>I'm not sure how extensive the tests are for these herbs. Sometimes there

>is a long list of constituents and sometimes very short. I am not sure that

>means a constituent is not present. Although it seems that a lab requested

>to test comfrey (at great expense!) would test for the the allantoin in all

>the comfreys! So maybe it is in fact not present if not listed!



Another problem with these databases is that they usually don't specify

fresh vs. dried herb, nor cultivated vs. wild plant.



Sure, it's fun to check them, but don't trust them -too- far.



Also, the people who order the tests (or the people who test, I don't

know) don't know their plants. Heh. Just check the variety of things

found in Pedicularis species -- totally disregarding the fact that it's

a semiparasite, and only flowers if it's sitting on the root of a host.

Senecio alkaloids, anybody? Plenty of PAs there, too.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland     http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, pics, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: allantoin in comfrey

From: "H.A.C. Le Poole" <hlepoole@planet.nl>

Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 15:27:10 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by h.a.c. le poole <hlepoole@planet.nl> :



----- Original Message -----

From: "Henriette Kress" <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

To: <herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu>

Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2001 2:43 PM

Subject: Re: allantoin in comfrey



> Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :

>

> "Eleanor K. Sommer" <eksommer@gator.net> wrote to

> herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:

>

> >I'm not sure how extensive the tests are for these herbs. Sometimes there

> >is a long list of constituents and sometimes very short. I am not sure

that

> >means a constituent is not present. Although it seems that a lab

requested

> >to test comfrey (at great expense!) would test for the the allantoin in

all

> >the comfreys! So maybe it is in fact not present if not listed!

>

> Another problem with these databases is that they usually don't specify

> fresh vs. dried herb, nor cultivated vs. wild plant.

>

> Sure, it's fun to check them, but don't trust them -too- far.

>

> Also, the people who order the tests (or the people who test, I don't

> know) don't know their plants. Heh.



OK, Know your plants, fair enough. But how do you get to know your plants if

they vary every year in strength? This is a  most essential topic on this

list which comes back every so many times, but is usually somewhat shrugged

away by the experts on this list, supposedly because they have learned how

to deal with such variations?. But how do you actually get to know the

delicate changes in strength from year to year or from location to location?

Do you actually try  out every new batch you have collected? On your self or

on patients? And what if you are not able to test them out before

using/recommending/prescribing them? What other reference do you have in

that case than some sort of chemical analysis or standardisation, whatever

the limitations of such analyses may be?



Just check the variety of things

> found in Pedicularis species -- totally disregarding the fact that it's

> a semiparasite, and only flowers if it's sitting on the root of a host.

> Senecio alkaloids, anybody? Plenty of PAs there, too.

>

> Cheers

> Henriette

>

> --

Rik Le Poole



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: allantoin in comfrey

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 16:58:36 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"H.A.C. Le Poole" <hlepoole@planet.nl> wrote to

herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>> Also, the people who order the tests (or the people who test, I don't

>> know) don't know their plants. Heh.

>

>OK, Know your plants, fair enough. But how do you get to know your plants if

>they vary every year in strength? 



If all around me everything gets lots of water in any given year, it's

usually got less strength than if it gets lots of sunshine.



Shrug. 



I just make sure that I get the correct plant, the right part(s) of it,

and, if it's important in terms of efficacy, that I pick it at the right

time of day and/or year.



The rest? If it doesn't work, I up the dosage, or give another herb. 



Funny though, -people- change from year to year, too, and need different

strength herb, or even different herbs altogether.



So I'll just reply to your oft-asked question with the much-repeated

phrase: 



I don't care about lab tests and standardized herbs, as long as my

clients aren't standardized.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland     http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, pics, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: RE: allantoin in comfrey

From: "Leppihalme, Miikkali" <leppihalme@quartal.com>

Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 15:47:04 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Miikkali Leppihalme <leppihalme@quartal.com> :



Eleanor:

> Yes there is:

> S. asperum = none listed

> S. officinale = 4500-13000 LF and 6000-25000 RT

> S. x uplandicum = none listed for the leaf and 6000-8000 RT

> 

> I'm not sure how extensive the tests are for these herbs.



Please, be aware that the test was made with a specific batch of Comfrey

grown in a specific environment in climatic conditions that happened to rule

that year. The Comfrey in _your_ backyard would probably give different

results when tested. And the results would be different again if you tested

the next year's batch. And so on.



-

M



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Chronic Fatigue Syndrome

From: "John Neustadt" <neustadt00@hotmail.com>

Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 15:50:12 -0800

--------

Sent to the herblist by John Neustadt <neustadt00@hotmail.com> :



Does anyone know anything about Chronic Fatigue Syndrome?



Specifically, my girlfriend was diagnosed with it a couple years ago.  After 

treatment by her physician her symptoms went away.  Well, they're back now.  

She's been on an elimination diet for two weeks now, and that does not seem 

to be helping (although she is enjoying all the new grains we're eating).



Some of her symptoms include:  headaches, lack of energy, dizziness, 

achiness in muscles and joints,  nausea, fever, swollen glands, occassional 

heart palpitations, constipation, gas, light sensitivity, heightened 

aversion to smells (such as smoke and perfune), general physical weakness, 

and anxiety.



She's moved away from the town in which she was seeing the original doctor, 

and is now seeing a new naturopath.  Her naturopath, who she just started 

seeing a couple of weeks ago, has her taking:



1. Vital Nutrients' brand BCQ (2 capsules between meals for aches and pains; 

each capsule contains 200 mg Beswelia serratta standardized to 65% Boswellic 

Acids, 100 mg Bromelium 2400gdu/3600mcu, 200 mg Curcuma longa standardized 

to 95% Curcumin, and 100 mg Quercetin) before thymus gland supplement



2.  Thymucin(tm) for thymus gland and immune system support. She's taking 1 

capsule a day. Each capsule contains 750 mg Enzymatic Polypeptide Fractions 

(Thymus Fractions)--predigested, concentrated soluble extract standardized 

for peptides and polypeptides with molecdular weight less than 10,000 

daltons--and 250 mg Astragalus (Astragalus membranaceus)--root extract 

4-6:1, standardized to contain 0.5% minimum of the isoflavone 4' hydroxy 3' 

methoxy isoflavone 7-SUG (GHMIF).



3.  Maxxum brand multiple vitamin and mineral supplement. 6 capsules each 

day. (The list of ingredients is too long to list here)



4.  Vital Nutrients brand TripleMag. She's taking 4 250mg capsules a day (2 

in the a.m. and 2 in the p.m.).  Each capsule contains 25mg magnesium 

(glycinate), 75mg magnesium (citrate) and 150mg magnesium (oxide).



5.  Tyler brand Adrenal Complex.  She's taking 4 capsules a day--two in tha 

a.m. and two at lunch.  Each capsule contains:  10,000 IU vitamin A, 500 mg 

Vitamin C, 60 mg Pantothenic acid, 15 mg Zinc, 360 mg Adrenal (freeze dried, 

bovine), 150 mg Licorice root (glycyrrhiza glabra, 8:1 concentration), 

Siberian ginseng root extract (Eleutherococcus senticosus, standardized to 

1.2% Eleutherosides).



All her blood work that the previous doctor did during the last episode of 

CFS came up negative (lupus, MS, lymphomas, thyroid disease, HIV).



Any suggestions on how to cure this once and for all?



Thanks.

John (for Romi)



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Chronic Fatigue Syndrome

From: Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net>

Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 21:56:40 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Elizabeth Scotten <timelesstree@earthlink.net> :



on 3/14/01 6:50 PM, John Neustadt at neustadt00@hotmail.com wrote:



> Sent to the herblist by John Neustadt <neustadt00@hotmail.com> :

> 

> Does anyone know anything about Chronic Fatigue Syndrome?



About 4 years ago a woman came and gave a talk on her experience with

Chronic Fatigue. The herbs that she found extremely helpful were Astragalus

and Reishi mushroom. She also used herbs to cleanse the liver and the

lymphatic system, and body work - accupressure, massage therapy, and

stretching. She also suggested avoiding sugar and take a decent

multivitamin. 



The books she recommended are: "Running on Empty" by Katherine Berne

"Living With Chronic Fatigue" by Susan Conant; "The Alchemy of Illness" by

Cat Duff; "Sick and Tired of Feeling Sick and Tired" by Anne McIntyre.



If you think it would be helpful, i will type up my notes on the whole talk

which goes into a little more detail on most of the herbs she took and why.

I know that a few years ago she was doing some consulting for folks who are

suffering with CFS.



Hope this helps - bek



-- 

bek@timelessremedies.com

http://www.timelessremedies.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Chronic Fatigue Syndrome

From: "Richard & Cyndi Ask" <ask@gtii.com>

Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 20:01:29 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Richard & Cyndi Ask <ask@gtii.com> :



In the fall of 1997 Cyndi was bedridden with FMS/CFIDS.

It is one of two things that brought us to herbs.



We have had two article published on the subject.

One in Nature's Field (Nov/Dec 1999)which is published

by Steven Horne the president of the American Herbalist Guild

and another in Healing Gardens.



We have condensed these down into an email

Because it is product specific in some places

I think it would be best if I sent it back channel.

If you would like it let me know



Richard M. Ask

ask@gtii.com



----- Original Message -----

From: "John Neustadt" <neustadt00@hotmail.com>



> Sent to the herblist by John Neustadt <neustadt00@hotmail.com>

:

>

> Does anyone know anything about Chronic Fatigue Syndrome?

>

> Specifically, my girlfriend was diagnosed with it a couple

years ago.  After

> treatment by her physician her symptoms went away.  Well,

they're back now.

> She's been on an elimination diet for two weeks now, and that

does not seem

> to be helping (although she is enjoying all the new grains

we're eating).

>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: new herb shop ideas

From: "chris coughlan" <gherbalistco@hotmail.com>

Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 16:12:40 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by chris coughlan <gherbalistco@hotmail.com> :



Hi everybody,

I was just wondering if anyone could give me some suggestions or opinions. I 

am currently in the process of expanding my tradition herbal practice. We 

custom prepare medicinal herbal formulas (ointments,salves,liniments,teas, 

tinctures etc.) for our clients and the demand is high. So we're going into 

more of a retail herb shop as well.

I would definitely like to hear any pointers.

thanks, chris



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: new herb shop ideas

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 19:11:50 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"chris coughlan" <gherbalistco@hotmail.com> wrote to

herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>I was just wondering if anyone could give me some suggestions or opinions. I 

>am currently in the process of expanding my tradition herbal practice. We 

>custom prepare medicinal herbal formulas (ointments,salves,liniments,teas, 

>tinctures etc.) for our clients and the demand is high. So we're going into 

>more of a retail herb shop as well.



Well, -where- are you? Local habits and local regulations differ, so

advice that's valid in, say, the UK, won't necessarily work in, say,

Cananananada.



Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland     http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, pics, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Sinus drops or wash for chronic SInus Infections

From: "Cindy Lee" <texasbluebonnets@home.com>

Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 17:14:45 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by Cindy Lee <texasbluebonnets@home.com> :



I suffer with chronic sinus infections, and am on high blood pressure

medication and so can not take decongestants.  The doctor has called in a

antibiotic for me, but I'm concerned that this alone may not get rid of the

congestion. I'd always heard you need both.



Does anyone know of drops or nose wash that I can use to help clear this up?



I am not a practicing herboligist and so don't grow my own herbs, I would

have to rely on an herbal store or what's in my pantry.



thanks for any help anyone can offer.



cindy



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Hemp seed oil cream

From: "NIAMH MCGINLEY" <niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk>

Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 11:37:09 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Niamh <Niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk> :



I want to make a cream of hemp seed oil for babies with eczema. I was

thinking of adding chickweed oil as well. I want to know the best way of of

comining them, I am reluctant to heat the hemp, so that rules out cocoa

butter, beeswax and all. I could mix into an aqueous cream, but that's

hardly ideal. So is a vegetable base cream the best option? Is it best

applied as an oil, and by extension could herbs be macerated in it?



Graham?



Ta,

Niamh



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Hemp seed oil cream

From: "gcwhite" <gcwhite@ntlworld.com>

Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 11:32:58 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Graham White <gcwhite@ntlworld.com> :



> Sent to the herblist by Niamh <Niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk> :



> I want to make a cream of hemp seed oil for babies with eczema. I was

> thinking of adding chickweed oil as well. I want to know the best way of

of

> comining them, I am reluctant to heat the hemp, so that rules out cocoa

> butter, beeswax and all. I could mix into an aqueous cream, but that's

> hardly ideal. So is a vegetable base cream the best option? Is it best

> applied as an oil, and by extension could herbs be macerated in it?



> Graham?



Easiest thing is to buy it, much more consistent quality.  As you are in the

UK you can  get it from Stuart FitzSimmons at www.advancedherbals.com

(nci), or if you only want small amount, lots of herbalists are using it

now.



BTW the website is worth a visit - lots of interesting stuff on some more

unusual herbs.



> Ta,

> Niamh



Cheers



Graham White  B.Sc. (Herb. Med.), MNIMH.

Medical Herbalist

Bishop's Stortford & Buntingford

--------------------------------------------------------------------



gcwhite@ntlworld.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: shelflife

From: "NIAMH MCGINLEY" <niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk>

Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 11:45:02 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Niamh <Niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk> :



   I have quite a lot of marigold petals from 3 years ago. They were stored

in heavy duty brown paper and still smell and taste vital. Are they ok do

you reckon? I want to make an infused oil of marigold and would like to know

if this a waste with old petals.



I made a lovely tincture of hawthorn 6 months ago too and it has sediment in

and te light (Iknow, I know) has turned it from red to brown. Is it still

vital do you think?



Thanks,



Niamh



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Herb Constituents

From: "Eleanor K. Sommer" <eksommer@gator.net>

Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 08:32:12 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Eleanor K. Sommer <eksommer@gator.net> :



>Funny though, -people- change from year to year, too, and need different

>strength herb, or even different herbs altogether.

>

>So I'll just reply to your oft-asked question with the much-repeated

>phrase:

>

>I don't care about lab tests and standardized herbs, as long as my

>clients aren't standardized.

>

>Cheers

>Henriette



I can't agree more. I am fascinated by the scientific analysis of herbs and

what it can reveal, but I am very satisfied with the comfrey, the

motherwort, the valerian root, etc. in my garden and can attest to their

efficacy without lab tests! Perhaps the levels vary from year to year --

but as you point out -- so do I! I think the wide range of results in

Duke's analyses shows that tests have been done on plants from different

areas and at various times -- at least the range gives a fundamental base

for what one might expect.



-Ellie

eksommer@gator.net



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Bilberry

From: Pjcpinole@cs.com

Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 13:15:32 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by Pjcpinole@cs.com :



Recently ordered bilberry from a different source and they sent the powdered 

leaves, rather than the powdered berry.  Are the leaves as effective as the 

berry for vision issues?



Namaste,

Phyllis



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Arnica & Boneset for babies?

From: paf@webzone.net

Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 13:31:14 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by paf@webzone.net :



Anyone know how advisable it is to give arnica montana homeo and external

boneset to a 24-mo-old with a fractured clavicle?  I don't know if they are

safe for babies.



tia, Anita



--



paf@webzone.net



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Arnica & Boneset for babies?

From: "Amy Cook" <acook@in4web.com>

Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 16:17:05 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Amy Cook <acook@in4web.com> :



Anita,



Homeopathic arnica is fine for babies.  Is it Comfrey you are thinking of

using externally?

If this is a birth injury, be sure the baby is seen by a rehabilitation

professional such as a physiotherapist or occupational therapist.



Amy



>> Anyone know how advisable it is to give arnica montana homeo and external

> boneset to a 24-mo-old with a fractured clavicle?  I don't know if they

are

> safe for babies.

>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Arnica & Boneset for babies?

From: "Heidi Scholes" <hscholes1@earthlink.net>

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 09:01:22 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Heidi Scholes <hscholes1@earthlink.net> :



Boneset (Eupatorium purpurea) was given to aid in "Break Bone Fever",

typhus, I think.

You'd be better off with Comfrey for bone healing.



BUT I don't know if comfrey is safe for children, maybe someone else can

answer that for you.



Heidi



> >> Anyone know how advisable it is to give arnica montana homeo and

external

> > boneset to a 24-mo-old with a fractured clavicle?  I don't know if they

> are

> > safe for babies.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Arnica & Boneset for babies?

From: "Joanie MacPhee" <macphee@net1plus.com>

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:54:23 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by macphee@net1plus.com :



Hmmm.

Eupatorium purpurea is more often called Joe Pye Weed.  Eupatorium

perfoliatum is the species usually called Boneset.



I would use Symphytum officinalis, grown in my back yard, where winterkill

suppresses pyrrolizidine alkaloid production, for external application on

most anyone.  I would be hesitant to used bought and dried comfrey when I

did not know where it was grown, or what species or hybrid it was.  I try to

avoid comfrey grown in non-winter areas, prickly comfrey (S. aspera) and

Russian Comfrey (Symphytum X uplandicum).  Lots of comfrey on the market,

dried and live, is mislabeled.  I had a major flamewar going a few years ago

on another list with a woman who manufactured and sold a comfrey  salve made

of comfrey she grew herself which "sounded" to me like Russian Comfrey from

her description...she was in total denial that more than one species of

comfrey even existed...



I would use homeopathic arnica salve right after any injury to deal with

bruising problems...but not after that, though I would use the liquid form

in bathwater for healing anytime, anybody.



I think I pretty much agree with Heidi on everything except nomenclature.

Joanie



>Boneset (Eupatorium purpurea) was given to aid in "Break Bone Fever",

>typhus, I think.

>You'd be better off withcHvIfrey for bone healing.

>BUT I don't know if comfrey is safe for children, maybe someone else can

>answer that for you.

>Heidi



>> >> Anyone know how advisable it is to give arnica montana homeo and

>external

>> > boneset to a 24-mo-old with a fractured clavicle?  I don't know if they

>> are safe for babies.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Arnica & Boneset for babies?

From: "Heidi Scholes" <hscholes1@earthlink.net>

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 11:00:51 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Heidi Scholes <hscholes1@earthlink.net> :



You are right of course, I spoke off the top of my head, should have checked

my book.



But wasn't Joe Pye Weed named after the NA healer who cured people of Break

Bone Fever?



Heidi



----- Original Message -----

From: "Joanie MacPhee" <macphee@net1plus.com>



> Eupatorium purpurea is more often called Joe Pye Weed.  Eupatorium

> perfoliatum is the species usually called Boneset.

>

> I think I pretty much agree with Heidi on everything except nomenclature.

> Joanie



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Arnica & Boneset for babies?

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 03:28:56 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



>But wasn't Joe Pye Weed named after the NA healer who cured people of Break

>Bone Fever?

>

>Heidi



According to John Lust in The Herb Book, Joe Pye used Eupatorium purpureum,

which became known as joe-pye weed, to cure typhus.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Arnica & Boneset for babies?

From: "Joanie MacPhee" <macphee@net1plus.com>

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 13:16:18 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by macphee@net1plus.com :



something like that...yes.



I just remember the Latin names of these two because Joe Pye has a

purpleness to it, and Boneset has perfoliate leaves..the stem pokes a hole

through the middle of kinda elongated diamond shaped leaves.  Though, there

are actually lots more species in the Eupatorium genus...I could get lost

delineating them all and lining them all up with common names...they are all

closely related and their properties often over lap..and they are all pretty

bitter in taste.



Elliot Freeman sent something in about the name Joe Pyeweed back about 3

years ago, when he was running his history Trivia quiz on herbs on this

list.  I Should look later and see if I still have that and the other

responses to it. Joanie



>You are right of course, I spoke off the top of my head, should have

>checked my book.

>But wasn't Joe Pye Weed named after the NA healer who cured people of Break

>Bone Fever?

>Heidi



>> Eupatorium purpurea is more often called Joe Pye Weed.  Eupatorium

>> perfoliatum is the species usually called Boneset.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Fw: Bilberry

From: "Simon Martin" <sm@otherwise.fsbusiness.co.uk>

Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 22:16:37 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Simon Martin <sm@otherwise.fsbusiness.co.uk> :



Don't think so. The anthocyanins are in the ripe berries. The leaves are

valued as a source of tannins.

Simon.



> > > Recently ordered bilberry from a different source and they sent the

> powdered

> > leaves, rather than the powdered berry.  Are the leaves as effective as

> the

> > berry for vision issues?

> >

> > Namaste,

> > Phyllis



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Fw: Bilberry

From: Pjcpinole@cs.com

Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2001 11:10:55 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by Pjcpinole@cs.com :



Many thanks for the information.

Blessings,

Phyllis



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Arnica and Boneset for babies

From: "rochelle" <rochelle@ntlworld.com>

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:06:24 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by rochelle <rochelle@ntlworld.com> :



<<Subject: Arnica & Boneset for babies?

From: paf@webzone.net

Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 13:31:14 -0600

X-Message-Number: 2



Anyone know how advisable it is to give arnica montana homeo and external

boneset to a 24-mo-old with a fractured clavicle?  I don't know if they are

safe for babies.



tia, Anita>>



Hi Anita ,



As a practising Licensed homeopath I would like to advise that giving Arnica

to the child is fine. If it is not too late you need to give Arnica 30 , one

pillule 3 times a day for the first couple of days as that will stop pain ,

bruising and shock. Follow it with Symphytum 6x ( Homeopathic Comfrey) a

couple of times a day for about 2 weeks. This will heal the fracture in half

the time.



Regards,

Rochelle



www.rochellemarsden.co.uk



---

Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Version: 6.0.231 / Virus Database: 112 - Release Date: 12/02/01



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Comfrey

From: "Victorian Scents Bath & Body" <victoria@usit.net>

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 12:50:52 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Victoria A. Treadway <victoria@usit.net> :



Hello,

I have searched in many places looking for live Comfrey plants.  Would

someone know a source in the US?

Thank you

Victoria



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Comfrey

From: Joan Russell <joanr@mindlink.net>

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 11:12:15 -0800

--------

Sent to the herblist by joanr@mindlink.net :



Victorian Scents Bath & Body wrote:



> I have searched in many places looking for live Comfrey plants.  Would

> someone know a source in the US?



Horizon Herbs (http://www.budget.net/~herbseed/Welcome.htm) sells roots,

and if you know comfrey at all, you would have a large plant in no time.

 Apparently you have order their catalog or phone them to order roots.....Joan



***********************************

joanr@mindlink.net

My Country Garden

http://www.mycountrygarden.net



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: RE: Comfrey

From: "Gardenthyme Lady" <dblan@netusa1.net>

Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2001 08:35:27 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by gardenthyme~lady <dblan@netusa1.net> :



Will this herb grow from seed?  I ordered some seed from Ritcher, haven't

received it yet.  I also ordered hop seed from them, and planted it some

time back ,but still no starts.  Someone said you have to start with a

plant!



Dee

"The Gardenthyme Lady"



Subject: Re: Comfrey



Sent to the herblist by joanr@mindlink.net :



Victorian Scents Bath & Body wrote:



> I have searched in many places looking for live Comfrey plants.  Would

> someone know a source in the US?



Horizon Herbs (http://www.budget.net/~herbseed/Welcome.htm) sells roots,

and if you know comfrey at all, you would have a large plant in no time.

 Apparently you have order their catalog or phone them to order

roots.....Joan



****



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Comfrey

From: "Victorian Scents Bath & Body" <victoria@usit.net>

Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 02:03:01 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Victoria A. Treadway <victoria@usit.net> :



Thanks for the Comfrey help Joan!  Is that the only way to get them is by

root?

~Victoria~



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Broken Clavicle in a Toddler

From: "Scott Carlton" <carlton@mcn.net>

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 21:40:43 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by Scott Carlton <carlton@mcn.net> :



I am wondering whether there would be a need to give a toddler or small

child any formulations to aid in healing a broken clavicle.  It seems this

might bring comfort to caregivers but bones heal fast in children unless

there are underlying health disorders.  If there is good nutrition and

emotional comfort as well as allowing the natural pain to be present, there

will be rapid healing.  The pain is necessary to restrict too much movement

as the bone heals.



The discussion of the formulations is interesting....and boneset has been

used to help with healing broken bones as well as breakbone fever.  It is

pretty strong stuff for a little one.  Better in my opinion to nourish the

bones with good food and allow for healing with less activity and careful

monitoring.



Best Regards to All,

Aliceann Carlton



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Joe Pye

From: Elfreem@aol.com

Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2001 08:24:26 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by elfreem@aol.com :



>  Elliot Freeman sent something in about the name Joe Pyeweed back about 3

>  years ago, when he was running his history Trivia quiz on herbs on this

>  list.  I Should look later and see if I still have that and the other

>  responses to it. Joanie



Indeed, Joe Pye was an Indian healer practicing in the New England 

area. Joe Pyeweed or Jopiweed (Eupatorium purpureum) was named 

after him after using it to produce sweating in the treatment of typhus. 

Reportedly, individuals were cured and that's how his name became

attached to the herb. 



Historically, jopiweed was also considered anti-syphilitic in addition to 

its other properties. Many text books fail to include this bit of information.



Regards,



Elliot



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Joe Pye

From: "Pamela Quayle" <herbgatherer@hotmail.com>

Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2001 15:26:32 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Pamela Quayle <herbgatherer@hotmail.com> :



> Indeed, Joe Pye was an Indian healer practicing in the New England

> area.

> Elliot



Do you have a reference for that story?  I have been looking for one for

quite awile and find the story, but not in anything that is old, always

looks more like lore.  Then I have seen other stories - for instance Joe Pye

was a colonist who learned to use the plant from the Indians - but thats not

convincing either.  Maybe noone really knows, but if you have something

solid I'd love to know.



I have found it interesting that when I look at the writings of the

naturalists and others who wrote of Native American uses for herbs in the

early days of New England that Joe Pye isn't listed.  There are several

references for E. perfoliatum or boneset.



Pamela



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Joe Pye

From: Elfreem@aol.com

Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 09:33:09 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by elfreem@aol.com :



> Do you have a reference for that story?  I have been looking for one for

>  quite awile and find the story, but not in anything that is old, always

>  looks more like lore.  Then I have seen other stories - for instance Joe 

Pye

>  was a colonist who learned to use the plant from the Indians - but thats 

not

>  convincing either.  Maybe noone really knows, but if you have something

>  solid I'd love to know.



I read the story of Joe Pye in several tertiary references ..the one I have 

in my library is American Indian Medicine by Virgil Vogel. He cites 

Stephen Williams "Report of the Indigenous Medical Botany of 

Massechusets" in Transactions of the American Medical Association, 

Volume II, 1849. pgs 863-927.



Elliot



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Joe Pye

From: "Pamela Quayle" <herbgatherer@hotmail.com>

Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 10:30:16 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Pamela Quayle <herbgatherer@hotmail.com> :



Thanks so much - that's the kind of dated reference I've been looking for.

May look for the Vogel book too.



> I read the story of Joe Pye in several tertiary references ..the one I

have

> in my library is American Indian Medicine by Virgil Vogel. He cites

> Stephen Williams "Report of the Indigenous Medical Botany of

> Massechusets" in Transactions of the American Medical Association,

> Volume II, 1849. pgs 863-927.

>

> Elliot



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: thyroid test/replacements

From: rja86@webtv.net (Renee and Jerry)

Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2001 21:41:22 -0800 (PST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by Renee <rja86@webtv.net> :



Hi everyone. Is anyone familiar with the iodine solution test to see if

one is hypothyroid/iodine defficient? I have all the symptoms of

hypothyroid, but blood test are normal so I thought I would try this

test. I bought the lugols iodine solution and rubbed it on my thighs and

stomach. (boy, didn't know how dark it would be.) Within 5 hours it had

faded (color) about 1/3rd. Within 12 hours it was faded about 90%. In 24

hours it was very faint. 

In the health food store I found a supplement called Thyriod and

L-Tyrosine complex (Enzymatic Therapy) Contains: vit. b12 100 mcg,

iodine (kelp) 200 mcg, magnesium 200 mg, zinc 6 mg, copper 300 mcg,

manganese 6 mg, L-tyrosine 248 mg, molybdenum 100mcg. and thyroid

substance (thyroxin-free 8x)?? (dont know what that is) The two problems

I have with this, is that it has mullti-glandular complex in it 70 mg.

(raw liver, lung, heart, etc.) in it, and I dont believe in taking

animal products I dont even eat meat or milk. Goes against my grain, and

trying to quit eggs and cheese. The other problem is I can't afford 20

to $30.00 a month for this. I Thought maybe I should try to find a dr.

that would prescribe synthroid, but I read that medicines work for your

thyroid and so it doesn't let the thyroid work naturally, similar to

laxatives to the colon. Well, maybe I will try the temperature test, I

think each morning take it and if below 97.8 for the three days, could

be hypothyroid? Any comments? Corrections? 

  Always welcome and thank you again for the learning process you've

given me. 

And do you think the above supplement is good, has the T3 and T4, etc.?

Also, I have been told Armours was very good.

 One last comment, the pharmacist said that just taking iodine is not

enough to correct hypothyroid. 



Take good care and have a great day.



Love,  

Renee and Jerry



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: thyroid test/replacements

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 11:21:46 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Wed, 21 Mar 2001 21:41:22 -0800 (PST) rja86@webtv.net (Renee and

Jerry) writes: Hi everyone. Is anyone familiar with the iodine solution

test to see  if

 one is hypothyroid/iodine defficient? I have all the symptoms of

hypothyroid, but blood test are normal...



I recently learned of a test that you have to request called the TSH--

thyroid stimulating hormone.  If it is high, according to the nurse

practitioner who explained it to me, it means that a chemical messenger

to the brain is sending another to your thyroid to send more thyroid

products out.  This may be partial answers to WHY I PERSONALLY have a

certain kind of fatigue, overweight, water bloating and moderately high

blood pressure most of the time and  higher some of the time, and

managing the thyroid by any means might be very valuable.  btw my T3 and

T4 have always been WNL ( within normal levels).



For what it is worth, good luck and good health,

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: thyroid test/replacements

From: "Cylise (cyli)" <cyli@tiny.net>

Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 10:23:53 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by Cylise <cyli@tiny.net> :



> Sent to the herblist by Renee <rja86@webtv.net> :

> 

> Hi everyone. Is anyone familiar with the iodine solution test to see if

> one is hypothyroid/iodine defficient?



Not much can be done for/to the thyroid with herbs.  Try reading the newsgroup 

alt.support.thyroid.  You'll get a lot of information there.  Don't do anything 

suddenly.  If you're hypo, you've had a long time of it and it'll take time to 

change.  Leaping wildly at any promised help (and it's a temptation) can make 

you worse.  Take it slowly, maybe take a little kelp, avoid doing much soy, and 

don't believe much of what anyone who's selling a product for the condition 

tells you.  

---

rbc: vixen.  Fairly harmless.   Most of the time.



http://www.visi.com/~cyli



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: thyroid test/replacements

From: "Simon Martin" <sm@otherwise.fsbusiness.co.uk>

Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 13:20:07 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by Simon Martin <sm@otherwise.fsbusiness.co.uk> :



Sent to the herblist by Simon sm@otherwise.fsbusiness.co.uk



> > Hi everyone. Is anyone familiar with the iodine solution test to see if

> > one is hypothyroid/iodine defficient?



I have had this done. You get a standard iodine solution (from your

pharmacist) and 'paint' some on youtr skin using a Qti[p (or something).

Inside of the forearm is a good place. Wait and see how much is absorbed. If

you skin sucks it up, it MAY mean you are short on iodine...other tests

necessary, but it's a clue. There are more sophisticated versions available

with colour grading charts and so on.

Simon.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Antifungal Herbal Formulations

From: "Harun Kuloglu" <herbslaboratory@yahoo.com>

Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 10:05:57 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Harun Kuloglu <herbslaboratory@yahoo.com> :



Hi 

My name is Harun Kuloglu. I'm a veterinarin. I'm interested in herbal

treatment.Now I'm looking for antifungal herbal formulations with animals

and plants.



Best regards.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Antifungal Herbal Formulations

From: "Kerry's Herbals" <jclarke2@uswest.net>

Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 13:06:37 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by Kerry L. <jclarke2@uswest.net> :



Black walnut hull is an excellent antifungal. Tea tree essential oil also

works well. Goldenseal and Oregon Grape Root also have antifungal

properties.



Kerry

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.KerrysHerbals.com

Miracle Salve, herbal tinctures, essential oils and more!



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Antifungal Herbal Formulations

From: "LJS Doody" <ldoody@internetcds.com>

Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 11:35:30 -0800

--------

Sent to the herblist by LJS Doody <ldoody@internetcds.com> :



myrrh, indigo, poke root,calendula and daisy are good antifungals that

spring first to mind - and dont forget the garlic!!!



Lizzie



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Antifungal Herbal Formulations

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 17:50:05 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Thu, 22 Mar 2001 10:05:57 -0500 "Harun Kuloglu"

<herbslaboratory@yahoo.com> writes:

>

> Hi 

> My name is Harun Kuloglu. Now I'm looking for antifungal herbal

formulations with  animals...



I saw two excellent posts,already, and I add: small amounts of essential

oil of oregano, which is anti-fungal and has many other anti activities.

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Antifungal Herbal Formulations

From: "chris coughlan" <gherbalistco@hotmail.com>

Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 15:21:16 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by chris coughlan <gherbalistco@hotmail.com> :



>My name is Harun Kuloglu. I'm a veterinarin. I'm interested in herbal

>treatment.Now I'm looking for antifungal herbal formulations with animals

>and plants.



>>

This is a formula that I use in my practise with excellent. Anu kind of 

toplical dermatitis or sebaceous gland congestion.

-Take 1 pint of distilled water

Make a cold infusion over night with 2 oz. of symphytum off root(dry).

add 2 1/2 oz of fresh (or dry) Balm of Gilead buds and bring to a boil.

Add 3 oz. of Commiphora (Myrrha gum)

Simmer on low heat for 2-3 minutes, then remove from heat. let cool & 

strain.

Place 1 oz. Olive oil in a double boiler, standing in boiled water.

Add 1/2 oz. lanolin and 1/2 oz. beeswax(grated).

In a separate vessel add 3 Tablespoons (90ml) of infusion and 1 ml benzoin 

tincture.

When the beeswax and lanolin are melted in the olive oil add 

infusion/benzoin mixture. Stir until thickening occurs add 1 ml Melaleuca 

alternifolia essential oil(tea tree)

Place in a amber glass jar

Use as needed

This cream is a vulnerary, emollient, antiseptic, antifungal,and 

antibacterial preparation.

You should make some up and keep it in a first aid box!

A definite must!!



Chris Coughlan



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: The test for Hypothroidism

From: "Richard & Cyndi Ask" <ask@gtii.com>

Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 21:33:22 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Richard & Cyndi Ask <ask@gtii.com> :



THYROID Self Test



Hypothyroidism



Low thyroid output, known medically as hypothyroidism is proving

to be a culprit in many health problems Here is a list symptoms

that may involve hypothyroidism. Remember that hypothyroidism is

not the only problem that can cause some of these symptoms in the

body. so the fact that you have any particular symptom is not a

sure sign YOU have a thyroid problem. However, the more symptoms

you have (especially those highlighted with an asterisk *), the

more likely it is that you may hive thyroid problem.



Self Diagnosis

If you suspect you may have a low-functioning thyroid, take your

body temperature immediately awakening in the following manner.

Make sure the

thermometer is shaken down the night before and left within easy

reach. When you wake up get the thermometer and put it under your

armpit. stay

in bed, relax and leave the thermometer under your arm for 10

minutes.



Mouth readings may be too high because of possible throat

infection, hence the armpit is preferred For women, test on the

second or third day of menstruation to account for normal

temperature variations in women. In hypothyroidism, the body

temperature is below 97.S degrees F. You may wish to conduct the

test several days in a row to verify the results



Causes and Correction

Hypothyroidism may have several causes. the most common cause is

lack iodine in the diet. In this case, the solution is simply to

supply the body with iodine-rich herbs such as kelp, Irish moss,

Iceland moss, black walnut and dulse. In severe eases a thyroid

glandular or a chemical iodine supplement may be needed. In some

cases, digestion is poor and the body may have difficulty

absorbing nutrients needed tar thyroid function.



In these cases digestive enzymes will help. Certain foods

suppress thyroid function because of their high levels 0

cysteine, which absorbs

iodine ii' the intestines. (Cysteine is also needed for immune

system strength and artery health.) These foods include meat, raw

cabbage, raw broccoli, raw cauliflower raw brussel sprouts,

peanuts and soybeans.



Chronic stress of any kind also has a negative effect nit the

thyroid, and hence, good stress management practices and nervine

herbs like hops,

valerian, skull cap, chamomile, passion flower and lobelia may

also help.



SYMPTOMS OF HYPOTHYROIDISM

Hair, Skin and Nails

Acne/eczema! psoriasis

Cold skin

Lack of perspiration

Rough, dry or scaly shin

Thick skin early wrinkling of

skin, sallow complexion

Coarse or thin hair

Brittle or slow growing nails

Wounds heal slowly



WATER

Puffy feet and/or hands

water-logged tissues

Swollen upper eyelids



ENERGY

Drowsy

Excessive need to sleep

Irregular energy*

Frequent fatigue*



NERVOUS/EMOTIONAL

Irritability*

Nervousness

Depression

Frequent mood swings.

Personality changes

Apathy

Mental retardation

Insanity/neurosis

Hyperactivity

Irrational fears



WEIGHT/APPETITE

Difficulty losing weight*

Decreased appetite



CIRCULATION

Low body temperature*

Cold extremities at

normal temperatures

Heart enlargement

Poor circulation

Blood pressure problems

Heart problems



REPRODUCTIVE

Low sex drive/frigidity* Miscarriage

Infertility

Toxemia. in pregnancy

Excessive menstruation



OTHER PROBLEMS

Low resistance to disease

Get "tongue-tied easily*

Speech difficulties

Painful joints

Clumsy

Constipation

Poor memory

Hoarseness

Burning or tingling sensations Tension headaches



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Valerian

From: "JILL SIMMS-YINGLING" <jtsy10@hotmail.com>

Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 08:24:29 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by jill simms-yingling <jtsy10@hotmail.com> :



I spilled three "over the counter" Valerian capsules on the floor yesterday. 

   I picked them up and threw them away.   My cat happened by the spot they 

had dropped and immediately began acting as if she was in pure ecstacy, 

sniffing and rolling.   Experimented by dropping another capsule this 

morning...same reaction from both my cats.



Does anyone have any experience with Valerian and cats?



Thanks.



J



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: RE: Valerian

From: "Leppihalme, Miikkali" <leppihalme@quartal.com>

Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 10:36:29 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Miikkali Leppihalme <leppihalme@quartal.com> :



jill simms-yingling:

> I spilled three "over the counter" Valerian capsules

> on the floor yesterday. 

>    I picked them up and threw them away.   My cat

> happened by the spot they had dropped and immediately

> began acting as if she was in pure ecstacy, sniffing

> and rolling.   Experimented by dropping another capsule

> this morning...same reaction from both my cats.

> 

> Does anyone have any experience with Valerian and cats?



Oh, yes. Cats are known to go wild over Valerian. My lifemate's cats have

the same reaction. If I've even just handled Valerian, the cats are my best

friends and love my hands for hours after. However, don't let the cats eat

Valerian, because they can go crazy from it and in some not-too-enjoyable

ways.



-

M



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Valerian

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 08:59:31 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by May Terry <mterry@snet.net> :



JILL SIMMS-YINGLING wrote:



> I spilled three "over the counter" Valerian capsules on the floor yesterday.

>    I picked them up and threw them away.   My cat happened by the spot they

> had dropped and immediately began acting as if she was in pure ecstacy,

> sniffing and rolling.   Experimented by dropping another capsule this

> morning...same reaction from both my cats.

>

> Does anyone have any experience with Valerian and cats?



First time I bought it, it was a tincture.  I got home from shopping, and took

it out of the bag and set it on top of my computer monitor.  I went into another

room for less than a minute, and when I came out, my oldest cat (the one that

reacts most strongly to catnip) was rolling on the floor amidst broken pieces of

the bottle!  I think they react at least as strongly to valerian as to catnip.

I wonder if it's the same genes?



May

--

Let food be thy medicine.

                --Hippocrates



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Valerian

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 12:58:26 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Fri, 23 Mar 2001 08:59:31 -0500 May Terry <mterry@snet.net> writes:

> JILL SIMMS-YINGLING wrote:> 

>  My cat happened by the  spot they... Does anyone have any experience

with Valerian and cats?

> 

...  I think they react at least as strongly to valerian as 

> to catnip.  I wonder if it's the same genes?



Catnip and valerian are both calming to humans and both smell funny.  I

wonder if there are some common constituents for either the odor factors

or the calming factors or both?   AND where can one look it up?

Marcia

---



---

You are currently subscribed to herb as: hetta@saunalahti.fi



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Valerian

From: "B J Wyatt" <bjwyatt@accesstoledo.com>

Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:45:03 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Brenda J. Wyatt <bjwyatt@accesstoledo.com> :



Diane Stein (The Natural Remedy Book for Dogs and Cats), Juliette Bairacli

Levy (The Complete Herbal Handbook for the Dog and Cat), and Anitra Frazier

(The New Natural Cat) all have suggested valerian uses for both dogs and

cats related to the herb's calming (and other) properties.



Brenda



Brenda J. Wyatt

WomynWyse Herbs & Botanicals

womynwyse@accesstoledo.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Valerian

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 19:17:43 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by May Terry <mterry@snet.net> :



Marcia V Grossbard wrote:



> Catnip and valerian are both calming to humans and both smell funny.



Sure is a different kinda funny, though...All I know is that reaction to catnip

is a genetic trait, and I was wondering if anyone knows if the same receptors

in the brain are involved.



May

--

Let food be thy medicine.

                --Hippocrates



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Valerian

From: "Hideka Kobayashi" <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu>

Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 17:33:45 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Hideka Kobayashi <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu> :



Sorry, this is rather an old topic. I just could not post it through my

e-mail server.



<I spilled three "over the counter" Valerian capsules on the floor yesterday. I picked them up and threw them away. My cat happened by the spot they had dropped and immediately began acting as if she was in pure ecstacy, sniffing and rolling. Experimented by dropping another capsule this morning...same reaction from both my cats.



Does anyone have any experience with Valerian and cats?>



I don't have this experience, but it seems very possible. One species of

Actinidia (Actinidia polygana) literally causes euphoria for cats, and

this is attributed to cyclopentanoid monoterpenes (iridoids) like

iridomyrmecin in plants. And sedative effect of valerian is also

attributed iridoids. Yes, catnip also contains some iridoids. The list of

plants with iridoids can be found at:



http://www.life.uiuc.edu/plantbio/363/iridoidslides.html



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Valerian

From: "Kathy Bensinger" <kbensin@mail.state.tn.us>

Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 14:54:45 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by kbensin@mail.state.tn.us :



CAts love valerian probably more than catnip.  Don't leave a baggie around... Mine will jump up on the counter and chew through the bag to get to it.

KB



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: PAs absorbed dermally

From: "Pamela Quayle" <herbgatherer@hotmail.com>

Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 10:53:34 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Pamela Quayle <herbgatherer@hotmail.com> :



X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400

X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400

Message-ID: <OE24d6QR7j1HaKtKufV00003e8c@hotmail.com>

X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Mar 2001 15:56:02.0945 (UTC) FILETIME=[C30E4710:01C0B3B1]



A week or so ago someone - Elliot? - mentioned a study in Germany that

showed PA's can be absored topically from comfrey.  Is there a reference

where I could look up that study?



I mentioned it at an herb association meeting and got many more questions

than I could answer.  Many of us put comfrey into childrens salves.  Would

like more information before dropping it, having been assured for years that

it is safe topically.  I make one with comfrey, calendula and viola that I

love.  May try it this year with just the later two and see if it works as

well.



Pamela



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: comphrey topically

From: Elfreem@aol.com

Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 12:59:39 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by elfreem@aol.com :



> A week or so ago someone - Elliot? - mentioned a study in Germany that

>  showed PA's can be absored topically from comfrey.  Is there a reference

>  where I could look up that study?

>  

>  I mentioned it at an herb association meeting and got many more questions

>  than I could answer.  Many of us put comfrey into childrens salves.  Would

>  like more information before dropping it, having been assured for years 

that

>  it is safe topically.  



One expert toxicology researcher did not consider topical comphrey 

hazardous (Lancet 1980;2:1136-7) and his opinion was supported by

an animal study in which absorption was quite low ....0.1-0.4% of

a topical dose of 194mg of PA (Experientia 1982;38:1085-7). PAs

by the oral route showed up systemically 20-50 times the concentration 

compared with the dermal route. 



Considering that individuals have taken the tea for short periods without 

problems, I can't see how external use would be hazardous even for

kids. Children under 2-3 ...and particularly Infants might be a different 

story of course.



A woman I know and friend of the family (Bonnie) raised 3 kids in the 

mountains of Montana. When one of her kids had a bad accident (nearly 

bit off his tongue) a native American nearby wrapped his tongue with

comphrey and gave him comphrey tea to drink. Bonnie was amazed

that her boy healed in days ...and her native American friend was

equally amazed that she lived 100 miles from the neares small town

and didn't have a comphrey patch in her back yard.



I would use comphey externally in children over 2-3 and not give it

a second thought. For children under 2-3 and infants, I understand there 

is a PA-free form of comphrey available from Herb Pharm ...just a

thought if you wanted to go the extra mile.



Elliot



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: comphrey topically

From: "Pamela Quayle" <herbgatherer@hotmail.com>

Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:09:40 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Pamela Quayle <herbgatherer@hotmail.com> :



> Considering that individuals have taken the tea for short periods without

> problems, I can't see how external use would be hazardous even for

> kids. Children under 2-3 ...and particularly Infants might be a different

> story of course.

>



It's my understanding that the PA's are accumulative in the body and so over

many years could cause damage.  Is this true?



I wouldn't hesitate to use it short term when it's healing power were really

needed.  But am considering discontinuing use in salves for emollient

action.  I have made one for years that I love with comfrey, calendula and

viola.  May just try the calendula and viola together this year.



 Using comfrey to heal deep cat scratches per a friend's recommendation was

my first experience with herbs - very impressive.  The herb that drew me

into the herbal path.



Pamela



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: comphrey topically

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 09:14:53 +0300

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"Pamela Quayle" <herbgatherer@hotmail.com> wrote to

herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>It's my understanding that the PA's are accumulative in the body and so over

>many years could cause damage.  Is this true?



I've certainly never heard that one, no.



However, comfrey _is_ toxic to your liver, and _does_ cause

veno-occlusive disease if you use enough of it.



Germans say to use Symphytum tuberosum L., as that one has low

alkaloids. S. officinale can be used externally short-term if the skin

is intact. Heh. Where would you use Symphytum on intact skin?



Calendula is just as effective, as is Plantago, and neither contain

pyrrolizidine alkaloids.



Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland     http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, pics, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: comphrey topically

From: Herbmednurse@aol.com

Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:20:23 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by herbmednurse@aol.com :



In a message dated 3/24/01 3:13:01 PM, herbgatherer@hotmail.com writes:



<< It's my understanding that the PA's are accumulative in the body and so 

over



many years could cause damage.  Is this true? >>



weren't most of the studies done on the root - which has a higher PA content, 

then the leaves?

phebe



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: comphrey topically

From: "Kerry's Herbals" <jclarke2@uswest.net>

Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 17:16:46 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by Kerry L. <jclarke2@uswest.net> :



All this talk about the toxicity of comfrey has me really doubtful. It was

helpful for me to run over to Henriette's Medicinal Herb FAQ and reread the

section on comfrey and toxicity to remind myself the difference between

comfrey as a whole herb and the isolated PAs.



http://www.ibiblio.org/herbmed/mediher3.html#c2_1_16



Kerry



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: comphrey topically

From: "Kerry's Herbals" <jclarke2@uswest.net>

Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 17:22:47 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by Kerry L. <jclarke2@uswest.net> :



Also, I'm curious about a comparison regarding the dangers of comfrey to the

liver and the dangers of, oh...say...Tylenol. After all, Tylenol in very

large quantities can cause liver damage, as well. Yet it's routinely

recommended for infants and children for the smallest of ailments. Some

parents give Tylenol to their infants as often as a couple times a month,

I'm sure. Yet why no outcry about how potentially toxic Tylenol is to the

liver, nor any discussion about banning Tylenol from our drugstores.



Are you sure we're (collectively) not being duped by the medical mainstream?

Could it be possible that all the concern about comfrey is simply alarmist,

and that comfrey the plant used as a whole is simply NOT the same as PAs

injected in large quantities into mice? Or are there newer studies with

which I'm not familiar that others are referring to?



Kerry



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: comphrey topically

From: "Pamela Quayle" <herbgatherer@hotmail.com>

Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 20:51:16 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Pamela Quayle <herbgatherer@hotmail.com> :



> Are you sure we're (collectively) not being duped by the medical

mainstream?

> Could it be possible that all the concern about comfrey is simply

alarmist,

> and that comfrey the plant used as a whole is simply NOT the same as PAs

> injected in large quantities into mice? Or are there newer studies with

> which I'm not familiar that others are referring to?

>

No doubt the warnings are based on thin evidence and the dangers

exaggerated.  There probably are a lot more dangerous over the counter

drugs - I,  for one, never use Tylenol.



But, even if PA's don't cause overt liver disease they may add to other

conditions that lead to liver problems.  That's what concerns me if they are

accumulative in the body. I heard that from a practicing herbalist teacher

at a conference, but haven't seen it in other places.



If that's true it is an herb I would rather use only when it is really

needed.  If PA's are absorbed topically and are accumulative there are other

things that will work as well to heal those garden and herb damaged

cuticles - which is where I'm using a lot of it now.



Pamela



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: comphrey topically

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 09:15:19 +0300

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"Kerry's Herbals" <jclarke2@uswest.net> wrote to

herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>All this talk about the toxicity of comfrey has me really doubtful. It was

>helpful for me to run over to Henriette's Medicinal Herb FAQ and reread the

>section on comfrey and toxicity to remind myself the difference between

>comfrey as a whole herb and the isolated PAs.

>

>http://www.ibiblio.org/herbmed/mediher3.html#c2_1_16



Thing is, that one needs updating. I just haven't gotten around to it

yet.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland     http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, pics, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: comphrey topically

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 22:53:29 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Sat, 24 Mar 2001 



Several posts.

First, what are PA's and what are their impact on human health.



second, Tanacetum Vulgare used to be carried in dry form in drugstores

that would also carry lavender flowers and rose petals, and in the 60's

when I read about tansy in an old herbal as a tea beneficial to what was

only excessively painful menstruation, and went to this store and

requested it, I was told," tansy's a poison".   I read in a later herbal

that it extracts lead salts from the earth.  Lead tends to be cumulative.



I also read that larger amounts of parsley would have lead salts in an

amount that could measured if extracted.



I think that constituents are important, and whether they are truly

bio-available is equally important.   Another consideration is what is

available from the soil and air surrounding the plant.   Constituents of

valerian and catnip, vis-a-vis the cats that went ape over a broken

valerian pill, include vitamins and minerals in a "complex" of many

constituents including some that we might not be interested in if

extracted in concentrated high dosage.



  If PA's are absorbed topically and are accumulative...

Are they truly that bio-available from a poultice? an ointment? a

compress made from a tea?  And would it truly accumulate if used

frequently enough to maintain healing of skin problems?



This is an interesting thread.  Given a ruling out of comfrey, what do

you all suggest as alternatives?

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: nervous exhaustion

From: "Sandra Oliveira Almeida" <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt>

Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:15:28 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by sandra <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt> :



Hello,

A year ago I became more and more upset, nervous, sleeping to much, always

tired, with a lots of blanks in my memory. Since I couldn't stop working (I

support my home alone), I kept saying to myself that I was only tired. But

now I went to a doctor, and after running some tests he concluded that I was

in a some-what deep nervous exhaustion. He prescribed several pills for

depresion, bur I do not agree with those.

So, I bought St John's Wort, because I learned here that was a good choice,

but in the bottle there is a warning, saying it's just for mild depressions.

Is it true, is there anything else I can take?

I didn't want those chemical pills at all, and I'm willing to make an effort

to fight this.

Could someone on this list help me?

Thank you,

Sandra



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: nervous exhaustion

From: "Sandra Oliveira Almeida" <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt>

Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 21:05:44 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by sandra <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt> :



"Memory has been enhanced with gingko for some people, but can you

tolerate a blood thinner, or is your MD putting you on one like Coumadin?

WHATEVER YOU DO, DON'T USE BOTH.   Some form of rosemary may also be

helpful.  However, if you are already on prescription meds, this would be a

culinary flavoring or seasoning for you."



Marcia:



Thank you very much. I refused to get any medication, and for my lungs I

took hot milk with garlic and eucalyptus's honey (worked fine). So, I can

follow your advices without any problem. My doctor didn't ask for a thyroid

test. I feel very sleepy and tired all day long, but I believe that

anti-depressants can't be the solution. I trust in Nature, all along...I

just don't know what she as to offer me!

A thank-you hug from

Sandra



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: nervous exhaustion

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 07:48:28 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by May Terry <mterry@snet.net> :



Sandra Oliveira Almeida wrote:



> Thank you very much. I refused to get any medication, and for my lungs I

> took hot milk with garlic and eucalyptus's honey (worked fine). So, I can

> follow your advices without any problem. My doctor didn't ask for a thyroid

> test. I feel very sleepy and tired all day long, but I believe that

> anti-depressants can't be the solution. I trust in Nature, all along...I

> just don't know what she as to offer me!



Hi Sandra,



I think that you need to get a better diagnosis than "nervous exhaustion".

"Sleepiness", per se, is not usually a symptom of depression, and I believe

that anti-depressants should be used only in case of fairly severe depression.

Have you lost or gained a significant amount of weight?  Do you cry a lot, have

trouble concentrating, sleep poorly even though you're exhausted?  Do you have

trouble enjoying the things you've always enjoyed?  Do you feel hopeless and

worthless?  These are symptoms of depression.



If I were you, I would research herbal treatments for fatigue (possibly chronic

fatigue syndrome).



May

--

Let food be thy medicine.

                --Hippocrates



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: nervous exhaustion

From: "Sandra Oliveira Almeida" <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt>

Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 13:58:18 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by sandra <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt> :



"Have you lost or gained a significant amount of weight?  Do you cry a lot,

have trouble concentrating, sleep poorly even though you're exhausted?  Do

you have trouble enjoying the things you've always enjoyed?  Do you feel

hopeless and worthless?  These are symptoms of depression.

If I were you, I would research herbal treatments for fatigue (possibly

chronic fatigue syndrome).

May"



Dear May:

Those are my symptoms, and I've gained a huge amount of weight......that's

why doctor prescribed those "things" but I prefere an herb treatment.

Hug,

Sandra



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: nervous exhaustion

From: "Amy Cook" <acook@in4web.com>

Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 08:28:37 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Amy Cook <acook@in4web.com> :



I agree re: the questionability of this diagnosis.  You may want to find

another doctor/practitioner because this one sure isn't listening to you nor

is s/he trying to find the cause of your problem.



I would get a complete work-up with someone that is holistic.



Amy



> Hi Sandra,

>

> I think that you need to get a better diagnosis than "nervous exhaustion".

> "Sleepiness", per se, is not usually a symptom of depression, and I

believe

> that anti-depressants should be used only in case of fairly severe

depression.

> Have you lost or gained a significant amount of weight?  Do you cry a lot,

have

> trouble concentrating, sleep poorly even though you're exhausted?  Do you

have

> trouble enjoying the things you've always enjoyed?  Do you feel hopeless

and

> worthless?  These are symptoms of depression.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: nervous exhaustion

From: "Sandra Oliveira Almeida" <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt>

Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 14:17:49 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by sandra <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt> :



"I would get a complete work-up with someone that is holistic.

Amy"

Thank you Amy, but.........no Holistic practioneers, either, in

Portugal......I'm searching the net, now



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: nervous exhaustion

From: "Amy Cook" <acook@in4web.com>

Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 08:38:46 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Amy Cook <acook@in4web.com> :



Oh, sorry--didn't realize you were in Portugal.

I have a friend that periodically lives in Portugal.  She used to visit a

Chinese doctor in Lisbon.  Would you be interested in my finding out the

doctor's name?

Are you in Lisbon?



Amy

----- >

> "I would get a complete work-up with someone that is holistic.

> Amy"

> Thank you Amy, but.........no Holistic practioneers, either, in

> Portugal......I'm searching the net, now

>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: nervous exhaustion

From: "cyli@visi.com" <cyli@tiny.net>

Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 07:17:03 -6

--------

Sent to the herblist by Cylise <cyli@tiny.net> :



>. My doctor didn't ask for a thyroid

> test. I feel very sleepy and tired all day long, but I believe that

> anti-depressants can't be the solution.



Your doctor may not have, but you should.   If you're unwilling to ask for one, 

try a little kelp?  The sleepiness and weight gain with associated mental 

effects makes it sound like something that should be ruled out or in for sure.  

Be sure you get a printout of your results and then go to alt.support.thyroid 

and find the references that'll let you check them against various 'normal' 

ranges for yourself.

---



I only answer my mail on an average of every

two or three months.  Do not despair.  Patience helps.



rec.backcountry vixen



http://www.visi.com/~cyli



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: re:nervous exhaustion

From: "NIAMH MCGINLEY" <niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk>

Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 21:15:15 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by Niamh <Niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk> :



Sandra,



I think you need some green oat straw (Avena sativa) to build up your

nervous system. If you have a juicer you can grow them yourself and juice

them as a long term measure. Otherwise you need to get a very good quality

tincture made from the green fresh oatstraw moreso than the milky seeds,

although they will help too. Add oats to your diet. The Bach flower remedy

Olive seems appropriate for mental and physical exhaustion. Put 4 drops in a

dropper bottle with spring water and a splash of brandy to preserve it and

take 4 drops 4 times daily. If all this followed a trauma of any

description, add 4 drops of Star of Bethlehem to the same dropper bottle and

the dosage of the mix will still be 4 drops x4. If you feel you still need

them, repeat, or maybe these issues will have resolved and you may feel

other issues are blocking you and you can alter the remedies accordingly.

The remedies are a wonderfully subtle way of resolving things, and you

will probly look back after a few months and realise there has been a change

in you you hadn't even noticed.



SJW is a wonderful plant and marvellous nervous restorative that may or may

not be for you. Try it slowly slowly and listen to your body. Get some seeds

if it doesn't grow wild near you and build a relationship with it, some

things you can never learn from a book.



Good Luck on your journey.



Love,

Niamh



>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Symphytum spp. & PA's

From: "chris coughlan" <gherbalistco@hotmail.com>

Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 03:41:45 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by chris coughlan <gherbalistco@hotmail.com> :



Hi there,

There is so much concern with the Pyrrolizidine alkaloids in Symphytum spp. 

I recommend everybody to read two articals published by the European Journal 

of Herbal Medicine(www.ejhm.co.uk). They can be found under the materia 

medica heading. The first is called "Herbs containing Pyrrolizidine 

Alkaloids" by Alison Denham (Vol 2:3 1996)and the second is "In Defence of 

Comfrey" Margaret Whitelegg (Vol 1:1 1994. I am sure that after reading 

these artical there may less questions. I hope that this may help.

By the way I think that everyone should have Comfrey(Smyphytum off.) growing 

in the back yard. Its one of my top herbs.



Chris Coughlan



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Symphytum spp. & PA's

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 23:01:07 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Sun, 25 Mar 2001 03:41:45 -0000 "chris coughlan"

<gherbalistco@hotmail.com> writes:

> Sent to the herblist by chris coughlan <gherbalistco@hotmail.com> :> 

> Hi there, There is so much concern with the Pyrrolizidine alkaloids in 

> Symphytum spp. ...



Thank you for answering my question about "what are PA's?".



Another question for the list is could it be that part of the alkaloid of

the coffee beverage is in the form of a complex of pyrrolizidine

alkaloids, and could that be one of the unspoken issues of coffee?



I enjoyed your post.

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Fw: nervous exhaustion

From: "Sandra Oliveira Almeida" <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt>

Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 15:27:10 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by sandra <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt> :



"As an example deficiency of 'blood' in chinese medicine can create

confusion as the spirit is scattered. a visit to the chinese herbalist may

be useful  to know exactly the best herbs for you.

Andrew"



Andrew:

I'm writting from Portugal and we don't have any chinese herbalist. In fact,

even a common herb medicine in other countrys is far away more expensive

than a chemical one in this country. The results that came from my tests

were based in the huge amount of serious problems in my life, cardiac

deficiencys, lung problems and so on. The symptons were feeling so tired

that even cross my living room felt like crossing the Hymalaias, sleeping so

deep that even a band could wake me, and for 12 hours, and awake sleepy and

tired, always hungry (not the thought, I'm gonna have a little snack, but

feeling my stomach grauurr), and blanks in my thoughts forgeting even simple

things.

So, I refused those (yack) pills and bought SJW. Is it right, or should I

take anything else stronger?

Thank you

Sandra



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Fw: nervous exhaustion

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 12:38:29 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



 Sent to the herblist by sandra <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt> :



> I'm writting from Portugal and we don't have any chinese herbalist. 

> In fact, even a common herb medicine in other countrys is far away more



> expensive... huge amount of serious problems in my life, > cardiac

> deficiencys, lung problems and so on. The symptons were feeling so 

> tired...



SJW is VERY calming, and when I use things like that for exhaustion, I am

very tired from the CALMing   Your heart may need some form of hawthorn

berries or hawthorn berry extract and possibly Coenzyme Q-10 and probably

some form of vitamin E.  Your nervine ( which I feel from your post is

what you are using the SJW for) can be some form of Garlic and Onions.

Your lungs may need mullein and and slippery elm, or if it is more like a

cold you may need zinc with some form of elder, and if it is like the

beginnings of a serious coughing cold you may need echinacea.



You should be aware that "could be" or "may be" indicate MAYBE

possibilities and are not directives, and getting some help from an

alternative health practitioner is a serious goal and/or checking

everything you read from the list people in good books and websites is

NECESSARY.



Memory has been enhanced with gingko for some people, but can you

tolerate a blood thinner, or is your MD putting you on one like Coumadin?

WHATEVER YOU DO, DON'T USE BOTH.   Some form of rosemary may also be

helpful.  However, if you are already on prescription meds, this would be

a culinary flavoring or seasoning for you.



If your thyroid work-up was only T3 and T4 which turned up normal, TSH

gives valuable info to ANY health practitioner, and if you can, you

should request it, because changes can take place that would give you

some of the profile you present.



Good luck and good health to you and yours,

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Nervous Exhaustion

From: "Scott Carlton" <carlton@mcn.net>

Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 10:03:10 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by Scott Carlton <carlton@mcn.net> :



Hello Sandra--



This is a classic vata vitiation problem....(that is too much movement,

dryness, too much stimulation beyond the body and mind's ability to process

and remain clear).  You may have experienced times when your thoughts and

body felt like they were simply "spinning"  There would be times when you

felt very anxious and times when you felt numb and unable to move perhaps.

Concentration is very difficult and thoughts are like Swiss cheese.  So,

some remedial steps are:



1) as predictable a daily routine as you can muster especially getting up

and going to bed at the same time daily, eating at the same times daily.



2) Water...warm and with soothing oils are important....get up early enough

for a warm shower or bath, soak your feet at night in warm water, a few

drops of sesame or sweet almond oil and an essential oil such as lavender or

clary sage...just a little EO...too much will nauseate you.



Walk in a natural area...preferably with filtered sunlight...too bright will

irritate you and too hot will tire you.  Try putting bare feet on the ground

for several minutes if it's not frozen tundra or full of snow.



Keep your work area as peaceful and organized as possible...it will help

your brain feel a little more orderly.



Wear soft and comfortable clothes as much as possible....salmon, lavender,

blues and greens with some yellow will soothe irritation and energize

without overwhelming you.



Food should be fresh every day, small amounts spread over three meals...not

later than 6 p.m. at night.  Use ghee, some salt, cumin, fennel, cardamom,

pepper (a little), ginger.  Avoid raw foods for a while...too hard to digest

for tired digestive system which is depleted.



Medicinal herbs that will help include Jatamansi (an Indian version of

valerian that leaves the mind a little more clear than valerian),

ashwagandha, shatavari, Gotu kola (no it doesn't have caffeine in spite of

the kola word).  Cinnamon is good for digestion (small amounts) and may be

better tolerated than ginger.  You will find the anxious depression will

lift with these herbs which are nurturing.  The St. John's Wort might be

helpful depending on your constitution...it is somewhat "hot" in energy but

that might be helpful unless your nerves are "burned out" from too much

adrenaline due to a frantic lifestyle.



Avoid caffeine and other stimulants.  Take time to sit in quiet a few

minutes 3 or 4 times a day.  Don't use energy drinks or lots of sugar even

if you crave it.  If sugar cravings are irresistible, get some powdered neem

or dandelion root and touch a bit to your tongue during the worst craving

periods.  Bitter extinguishes sweet cravings almost instantaneously.  Drink

warm water throughout the day...just nice fresh warm water as well as herbal

teas such as chamomile.



If your immune system is on empty, a tea made of jasmine flowers, a little

mint, hibiscus, and schizandra berries will help it rebuild.  Add honey to

the tea for additional support.



We all seem to get caught in a treadmill that goes too fast at times.  Best

wishes to you.



Aliceann Carlton



----- Original Message -----

From: Sandra Oliveira Almeida

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2001 11:15 AM

Subject: nervous exhaustion



Sent to the herblist by sandra <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt> :



Hello,

A year ago I became more and more upset, nervous, sleeping to much, always

tired, with a lots of blanks in my memory.



<Snip>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Nervous Exhaustion

From: "Sandra Oliveira Almeida" <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt>

Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 21:25:07 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by sandra <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt> :



"You may have experienced times when your thoughts and body felt like they

were simply "spinning"  There would be times when you felt very anxious and

times when you felt numb and unable to move perhaps.

Concentration is very difficult and thoughts are like Swiss cheese.  So,

some remedial steps are:



 Aliceann Carlton"



Thank you so much. Thats exactly what I feel!! I'm gonna follow all your

advices.

Hugs,

Sandra



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Nervous Exhaustion

From: "Sandra Oliveira Almeida" <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt>

Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 21:31:46 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by sandra <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt> :



"Medicinal herbs that will help include Jatamansi (an Indian version of

> valerian that leaves the mind a little more clear than valerian),

> ashwagandha, shatavari, Gotu kola (no it doesn't have caffeine in spite of

> the kola word"

Is there any site that sells these herbs online?

In Portugal we just can find Gotu kola, so I have to buy them online.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Nervous Exhaustion

From: "Scott Carlton" <carlton@mcn.net>

Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 07:28:41 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by Scott Carlton <carlton@mcn.net> :



Yes, Bazaar of India (www.bazaarofindia.com) carries many formulations and

bulk herbs online (nci).



If you have access to unsalted fresh butter you can make the ghee yourself,

just heat the butter slowly for 20 minutes to half and hour until the solids

are clumped at the bottom and it is a golden color.  Let it cool for a few

minutes and strain through a fine sieve.



If you make a decoction of gotu kola and add it to ghee then simmer away the

water from the decoction, the resulting formula will be Brahmi ghee, a

primary rejuvenative in clearing the mind in Ayurvedic practice.  Half a

teaspoon three times a day should help with energy and clearer thinking.



As far as the discussion of thyroid deficiency vs. depression is concerned

it's chicken or eggs.  If there is a primary thyroid deficiency,  that can

be determined through thyroid tests.  A malfunctioning thyroid promotes

lethargy and weight gain, but generally is marked by slowed or even stopped

thinking.



Depression shows up in many forms,  and there is such a thing as "nervous

exhaustion" even if it is a term that has fallen from favor in a day and age



of diagnoses based on organ or system malfunctions. Most of the folks I see

at the mental health clinic here in Montana are truly exhausted from demands

on their lives and have an agitated type depression.  Medication can help,

but lifestyle changes and good nutrition are a more long term way of healing

this.



The reason ghee is so successful in treating this type of condition is that

it works directly on the nervous system and is easily digested and utilized.

In your part of the world, olive oil will be a help as well.  Both assist

with weight management and with cholesterol because they improve digestive

energy along with a light but nourishing diet.



If I remember right from living in Algeria, you may have access to fresh bay

leaves, mint, cardamom, cilantro, cinnamon, and clove.  A melange of these

used in cooking with some hot pepper is excellent for digestion....such as

in couscous.  Seems that beef is not a great choice for nourishment now due

to health risks, but a chicken and vegetable combo would be.



Best of luck to you and enjoy the spring.  My mother-in-law lived in

Portugal for many years.  She still longs to return.



Aliceann



----- Original Message -----

From: Sandra Oliveira Almeida

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Sent: Sunday, March 25, 2001 1:31 PM

Subject: Re: Nervous Exhaustion



Sent to the herblist by sandra <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt> :



<Clip>

Is there any site that sells these herbs online?

In Portugal we just can find Gotu kola, so I have to buy them online.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: comfrey

From: Elfreem@aol.com

Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 17:59:19 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by elfreem@aol.com :



I think Kerry and Pam are on the right track....



Kerry writes:

<<Also, I'm curious about a comparison regarding the dangers of comfrey to the

liver and the dangers of, oh...say...Tylenol. After all, Tylenol in very

large quantities can cause liver damage, as well. Yet it's routinely

recommended for infants and children for the smallest of ailments. Some

parents give Tylenol to their infants as often as a couple times a month,

I'm sure. Yet why no outcry about how potentially toxic Tylenol is to the

liver, nor any discussion about banning Tylenol from our drugstores.

>>



Pam writes:

<<No doubt the warnings are based on thin evidence and the dangers

exaggerated.  There probably are a lot more dangerous over the counter

drugs - I,  for one, never use Tylenol.

>>



Phebe writes:

<<

weren't most of the studies done on the root - which has a higher PA content, 

then the leaves?

>>



Studies were done on the leaf and the root so that alone doesn't justify 

using the leaf ..but not the root. The concentrations of PAs in comfrey 

appear to vary. One reference indicates the roots have 10-20 times to 

concentration of PAs that are in the leaves (James Duke).



Other sources range from 3mg/kg PAs in the leaves to 87mg/kg in

young leaves by the same investigator ..to concentrations of 200 mg/kg 

to 1800 mg/kg by another researcher (no differentiation between young 

and old leaves). 



The amounts of PAs in the roots also vary from 450 to 5990 mg/kg, 

averaging 1700 mg/kg from one investogator ...to 2500 to 2900 mg/kg in 

another ...and 700-1700 mg/kg in yet another (thanks to Chris for 

mentioning the Eur J Herbal Med web site).



That being pointed out, I still would not hesitate using comfrey

externally for children over 2 to 3 ..and even orally in adults for a

short period of time. Using comfrey routinely over a longer period of

time should be done with caution. It appears that the FEW reports 

of toxicity on comfrey have indeed been done with continuous use 

over a long period of time ...and in some cases high amounts

(10 cups and a handful of tablets per day).



The analogy between tylenol and comfrey is a good one and I hope

to use it sometime soon when discussing comfrey with my allopathic

friends. Thanx to everyone that contributed information.



Elliot



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: SJW and Sun Sensitivity

From: paf@webzone.net

Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 15:36:08 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by paf@webzone.net :



I know one person who thinks her sensitivity to sunlight last spring was

probaby due to taking St. John's Wort.  Is this one of the side effects of

SJW therapy?

tia,

Anita



--



paf@webzone.net



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW and Sun Sensitivity

From: "Sharon  Herr, RD" <sherr@NYCAP.rr.com>

Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:50:16 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Sharon Herr, RD <sherr@NYCAP.rr.com> :



Hi Anita,



In one study, 50 people took SJW for 15 days.  There was a slight, but

significant increase in solar and UVA light sensitivity with a dosage of

3600mg SJW extract/11.25 mg hypericin, which is about 4 times the amount

commonly taken.  The effect could be compensated for by decreasing sun

exposure by 21%.  (Brockmoller J, Reum T, Bauer S,  et al. Hypericin and

pseudohypericin: pharmacokinetics and effects on photosensitivity in humans.

Pharmacopsychiatry. 1997 Sep;30 Suppl 2:94-101.)  What this study doesn't

tell us is what happens if SJW is combined with drugs that increase the risk

of photosensitivity (such as amitriptyline and doxycycline).  People with

diseases that can be made worst by sun exposure, such as those with lupus,

should be especially careful.



Sharon Herr

sharon@onlineRD.com



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: RE: SJW and Sun Sensitivity

From: "Leppihalme, Miikkali" <leppihalme@quartal.com>

Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:19:53 +0300

--------

Sent to the herblist by Miikkali Leppihalme <leppihalme@quartal.com> :



Sharon Herr

> In one study, 50 people took SJW for 15 days.  There

> was a slight, but significant increase in solar and UVA

> light sensitivity with a dosage of 3600mg SJW

> extract/11.25 mg hypericin, which is about 4 times 

> the amount commonly taken.  The effect could be

> compensated for by decreasing sun exposure by 21%.

-snip

> What this study doesn't tell us is what happens if

> SJW is combined with drugs that increase the risk

> of photosensitivity (such as amitriptyline and doxycycline).  



You write that the study was made with "3600mg SJW extract/11.25 mg

hypericin". From this I understand that the extract was "standardized" ie.

boosted enough for it to contain 11.25 mg hypericin per dose. If this is the

case, the study doesn't tell us much about the herb.



-

M



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW and Sun Sensitivity

From: "Sharon  Herr, RD" <sherr@NYCAP.rr.com>

Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 08:53:28 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Sharon Herr, RD <sherr@NYCAP.rr.com> :



> Sent to the herblist by Miikkali Leppihalme <leppihalme@quartal.com> :

> From this I understand that the extract was "standardized" ie.

> boosted enough for it to contain 11.25 mg hypericin per dose. If this is

the

> case, the study doesn't tell us much about the herb.

>

> -

> M



Hi M,



In this study different doses (with standardized hypericin) where given and

light sensitivity was tested.  The only dose that showed light sensitivity

was 3600mg SJW, lower doses didn't show any detectable sensitivity.  I am

not knowledgeable in the supplement industry's standardization procedures,

so I am unable to comment on this.  What this study does tell us is that if

SJW is taken in amounts currently recommended (hopefully what is on the

label reflects the contents, or better yet grown your own) light sensitivity

should not be an issue, except for those who are very light sensitive or on

drugs that increase light sensitivity.  Scientist are accustomed to studying

things that remain constant and can be reproduced.  It doesn't mean that

science can not help us, it just means we need to realize the limitations.

The bigger question is how do we communicate to researchers that all the

component of herbs act synergistically and that taking one component in

isolation (or standardizing one component) may not reflect the true

character of the herb.



Sharon



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re:  SJW and Sun Sensitivity

From: "Scott Carlton" <carlton@mcn.net>

Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2001 22:47:25 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by Scott Carlton <carlton@mcn.net> :



The issue of SJW and sun sensitivity can be picked apart 'til the cows come

home regarding components of the plant and components of those ingesting it.

Some livestock have dropped dead from SJW, some people have bad reactions to

it too.  Yet it is a very helpful herb as well.



If your constitution is on the hot side (pitta type), SJW is not a good

choice for treating depression...first because of aggravating pitta which

includes rashes to the point of excoriating dermatitis as well as

aggravation of conditions such as lupus, rheumatoid arthritis, hemorrorhagic

menstrual cycles, hot flashes, rage reactions etc.  Secondly,

Pitta type depression needs cooling and calming, so herbs and foods as well

as lifestyle promoting quieting the senses and mind are in order...which is

not SJW.



If you live in a hot climate with extreme sun exposure in your daily

life....don't use SJW for the same reasons...aggravation of the hot

qualities rather than balance of them.



Vata folks can usually use SJW as long as hydration is good and sun exposure

is not extreme...use the plant not the extract.  Kapha folks can usually use

SJW with good results as the hot qualities penetrate their lethargy and cold

type depressive symptoms.



So, constitution and geographic location along with lifestyle are accurate

indicators of tolerance and benefit in most cases.   The light blonde person

with blue eyes, fair skin that burns easily and a tendency to overheat

easily is going to have problems with SJW...better to use Gotu Kola or

similar western nervines that do not dull the mind.



The chemical analysis is interesting enough but not much use in determining

indications for use or in deciding what herbs to balance and support the

primary ones in my experience.



Regards to All,

Aliceann



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: R: SJW and Sun Sensitivity

From: "marco valussi" <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 09:34:43 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it> :



<<The light blonde person

with blue eyes, fair skin that burns easily and a tendency to overheat

easily is going to have problems with SJW...>>



perhaps it would be farer (to SJW) to say that 'the light blonde person with

blue eyes, fair skin that burns easily' is more likely to have a reaction to

SJW.  'Going to have problems with' is a phrase that seems to imply a

certainty over epidemiological data that simply isn't there.  In fact, if we

were to go with the epidemiology of SJW-related phototoxic cutaneous

reactions we would recognize that the number of cases of bad reactions

(using therapeutic dosages of herb, not megadoses of extract for anticancer,

anti-HIV reasons) is statistically irrelevant if compared with the sheer

number of prescriptions per year in Europe and in USA over the last 3

decades.  And a major part of these prescriptions were for light blonde,

blue eyed, fair skinned individuals (Germany and northen Europe) without any

relevat incidence of side effects.  In fact the safety data on SJW are

incrdibly strong, and we are discussing peripheral (albeit important)

matters related to very high dosages or increased hepatic metabolism of some

pharmaceuticals (which calls for scrupolous anamnesis, attention to past

medical history and medicines in use on the part of the therapist, but is

not necessarily an inherently bad thing, and could be in fact be used

positively if only by recuperating the half forgotten notion of SJW as a

liver herb).



As for SJW being controindicated in warm-hot constitution types, this has

been discussed before, but I like some further comments on this.  I

personally do not feel SJW as a hot remedy, although perhaps is warmer than

neutral, and I hear very different opinions amongst practitioners.

Certainly it wasn't always considered a warm remedy in Galenic medicine.



Thank you



marco



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW and Sun Sensitivity

From: "Scott Carlton" <carlton@mcn.net>

Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 08:14:41 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by Scott Carlton <carlton@mcn.net> :



Hello Marco,



Point taken regarding the safety of SJW.  I am a supporter of its use as I

thought I made clear in previous posts.  I also indicated many more likely

reactions if pitta is aggravated than the skin type.  The term "reaction" is

a good one over "problems".



Use in Northern Europe is a good plan, because if you are blonde, blue eyed

and fair skinned but live in the northern hemisphere in areas such as

Europe, the sun is not as intense.  In some Mediterranean areas in the

summer I'd be less likely to suggest it but wouldn't necessarily rule it

out.  A combination of Jasmine and Hibiscus with SJW would be a balancing

combination in such conditions.....but use in the Southwest US or here in MT

in the summer is not as good an idea if there is extensive exposure to

sunlight.



In fact, the Ayurvedic attributes of SJW listed by David Frawley are that it

is bitter and pungent in taste, cooling in digestive effect, and pungent in

post-digestive effect.  He also includes it as a cooling nervine.  My

experience personally and in mental health practice with those who use it,

is that it is hotter (or warmer) than cooler in effects mentally and

physically.  It is the pungent effect that seems to aggravate those who are

susceptible.



Many people who are fair skinned can use it successfully.  My point is that

one should look to risks as well as benefits in determining use, which can

be done with common sense examination of contributing factors more than

through detailed chemical constituent analysis.



The same dilemma exists regarding the use of SSRIs.....the effect of

increasing serotonin can seem unpredictable, unless one looks to the

underlying constitution, mental type (sattvic, rajasic, tamasic),

disturbance, and geographic location and time of year.



I use SJW during the winter...as an infusion with sage which make a nice

combination.  Beginning this time of year, I switch to another type of

nervine which is less likely to be aggravated by intense sun exposure.



Best Regards,

Aliceann



<Multiple SNIPS to save space>



Sent to the herblist by Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it> :



perhaps it would be farer (to SJW) to say that 'the light blonde person with

blue eyes, fair skin that burns easily' is more likely to have a reaction to

SJW.



In fact the safety data on SJW are

incrdibly strong,



As for SJW being controindicated in warm-hot constitution types, this has

been discussed before, but I like some further comments on this.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re:  SJW and Sun Sensitivity

From: Herbmednurse@aol.com

Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 14:00:04 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by herbmednurse@aol.com :



In a message dated 3/30/01 8:12:09 AM, carlton@mcn.net writes:



<<  Secondly,



Pitta type depression needs cooling and calming, so herbs and foods as well



as lifestyle promoting quieting the senses and mind are in order...which is



not SJW.



 >>

Aliceann,

what herbs and foods do you recommend for cooling?

phebe



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW and Sun Sensitivity

From: "Scott Carlton" <carlton@mcn.net>

Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 22:25:23 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by Scott Carlton <carlton@mcn.net> :



----- Original Message -----

From: Herbmednurse@aol.com

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Sent: Friday, March 30, 2001 12:00 PM

Subject: Re: SJW and Sun Sensitivity



Sent to the herblist by herbmednurse@aol.com :



In a message dated 3/30/01 8:12:09 AM, carlton@mcn.net writes:



<<  Secondly,



Pitta type depression needs cooling and calming, so herbs and foods as well



as lifestyle promoting quieting the senses and mind are in order...which is



not SJW.



 >>

Aliceann,

what herbs and foods do you recommend for cooling?

phebe



Hi Phebe---



Herbs that are helpful include Gotu Kola, rose, sandalwood, skullcap,

jatamansi, bhringaraj (eclipta alba), hops, hibiscus, jasmine andwhite lily

root...as well as standard type bitters in appropriate quantities such as

gentian, aloe gel, dandelion, .



Dietary herbs would include coriander, mint, dill,  and fennel among others.



For Pitta, much of the cooling effect can be achieved through avoiding use

of stimulants and hot and spicy foods, too much visual activity, too much

high aerobic exercise, too much mental and emotional disturbance....hard to

do in the US.  Diet ideally is vegetarian type, with a little use of chicken

or light fish.  Avoid red meat (well most of us are wary of red meat right

now anyway).  Ghee is very helpful...add it to basmati rice and mung beans

(steamed) with a mix of cooling herbs.



Sitting in natural surroundings part of every day in quiet meditation to

bring silence to the mind is most important.  Oil massage with coconut oil

medicated with rose powder, sandalwood, or gotu kola will soothe aggravated

pitta and pitta type depression....decreasing rageful and irritable

emotional states.  Massage technique should be moderate with no deep

pressure or intense deep muscle work.  The prime energy centers (mahas)

should be balanced before completing the massage (lower abdomen center,

heart center and third eye center).  Technique is important to prevent

overstimulation and to support the quiet mind.



That's more information than most will want in a list post.  my apologies

for the length.  Please e-mail me privately if anyone would like further

resources about this.



Namaste,

Aliceann



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW and Sun Sensitivity

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 07:08:12 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



>Aliceann,

>what herbs and foods do you recommend for cooling?

>phebe

>

>Hi Phebe---

>

>Herbs that are helpful include Gotu Kola, rose, sandalwood, skullcap,

>jatamansi, bhringaraj (eclipta alba), hops, hibiscus, jasmine andwhite lily

>root...as well as standard type bitters in appropriate quantities such as

>gentian, aloe gel, dandelion, .



Aliceann,



Is this white lily root Nymphaea odorata, listed in John Lust's Herb Book as

white pond lily?  I posted a question on this herb on newsgroup

alt.folklore.herbs just a few days ago.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW and Sun Sensitivity

From: "Scott Carlton" <carlton@mcn.net>

Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 07:43:03 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by Scott Carlton <carlton@mcn.net> :



Yes, it is Nymphaea odorata.  It has similar properties to Lotus root which

is also a choice if available.



Regards,

Aliceann



----- Original Message -----

From: Thomas Mueller

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 5:08 AM

Subject: Re: SJW and Sun Sensitivity



Sent to the herblist by tmueller@bluegrass.net :



>Aliceann,

>what herbs and foods do you recommend for cooling?

>phebe

>

>Hi Phebe---

>

>Herbs that are helpful include Gotu Kola, rose, sandalwood, skullcap,

>jatamansi, bhringaraj (eclipta alba), hops, hibiscus, jasmine andwhite lily

>root...as well as standard type bitters in appropriate quantities such as

>gentian, aloe gel, dandelion, .



Aliceann,



Is this white lily root Nymphaea odorata, listed in John Lust's Herb Book as

white pond lily?  I posted a question on this herb on newsgroup

alt.folklore.herbs just a few days ago.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: SJW & Sun Sensitivity, part II

From: paf@webzone.net

Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 15:52:34 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by paf@webzone.net :



Okay, okay, so I looked it up.  Penelope and Michael Tierra both say SJW

may cause sun sensitivity or dermititus.  I guess I should've known.  It

apparently does not affect some people that way.



--



paf@webzone.net



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW & Sun Sensitivity, part II

From: "Richard & Cyndi Ask" <ask@gtii.com>

Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 17:28:33 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Richard & Cyndi Ask <ask@gtii.com> :



For this to happen they would have to take bushel

full.......if you read the old herb books you do not find

this side effect.......the research study that lead to

this conclusion feed cows a ton of SJW



My conclusion....as with anything in life

use it reasonably



Richard



----- Original Message -----

From: <paf@webzone.net>



> Sent to the herblist by paf@webzone.net :

>

> Okay, okay, so I looked it up.  Penelope and Michael Tierra

both say SJW

> may cause sun sensitivity or dermititus.  I guess I should've

known.  It

> apparently does not affect some people that way.

>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW & Sun Sensitivity, part II

From: "Phosphor" <phosphor@hotkey.net.au>

Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 08:34:34 +0300

--------

Sent to the herblist by Phosphor <phosphor@hotkey.net.au> :



  > For this to happen they would have to take bushel

> full.......if you read the old herb books you do not find

> this side effect.......the research study that lead to

> this conclusion feed cows a ton of SJW



there is a problem for the estimated 8% of caucasian population which s

deficient in the liver enzyme CYP2D6, which metabolizes SSRIs. The result

will be a excessive buildup of serotonin. i suppose this may have something

to do with sun sensitivity, since the reverse applies, ie sunlight promotes

serotonin, but i' m not sure. What it can do is cause depression, so people

taking SJW for that could end up worse off.



Andrew



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW & Sun Sensitivity, part II

From: "Simon Martin" <sm@otherwise.fsbusiness.co.uk>

Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 13:12:50 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by Simon Martin <sm@otherwise.fsbusiness.co.uk> :



For similar genetic-biochemical reasons, another thing to throw into the pot

is blood type. People of type O blood may be more likely to have adverse

reactions to SJW, according to Dr Peter D'Adamo (LIve Right For Your Type,

Putnam, 2001, p131-132, plus info on the website at www.dadamo.com ).

Simon.



> Sent to the herblist by Phosphor <phosphor@hotkey.net.au> :

> >

> there is a problem for the estimated 8% of caucasian population which s

> deficient in the liver enzyme CYP2D6, which metabolizes SSRIs. The result

> will be a excessive buildup of serotonin. i suppose this may have

something

> to do with sun sensitivity, since the reverse applies, ie sunlight

promotes

> serotonin, but i' m not sure. What it can do is cause depression, so

people

> taking SJW for that could end up worse off.

>

> Andrew

>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: RE: SJW & Sun Sensitivity, part II

From: "Leppihalme, Miikkali" <leppihalme@quartal.com>

Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 09:31:26 +0300

--------

Sent to the herblist by Miikkali Leppihalme <leppihalme@quartal.com> :



Richard on SJW amd sun-sesitivity:

> if you read the old herb books you do not find

> this side effect.......the research study that

> lead to this conclusion feed cows a ton of SJW



A year or so back I amused myself reading through some research studies on

SJW. Also the topic was discussed extensively on this list a year or two

back. In the light of that information it seems to me that if you really

want the sun-sensitivity side-effects, you have to either take a bushel full

of SJW, as you pointed out, or take pure hypericin or standardized SJW

extract instead of SJW, which is nothing an herbalist would do, in my

not-so-humble opinion.



-

M



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: R: SJW & Sun Sensitivity, part II

From: "marco valussi" <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:30:00 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it> :



SJW sun-sensitivity is so rare it shouldn't worry anyone using the plant (as

opposed to synthetic or isolated hypericine and hypericine-like molecules).

In fact the cases of human sensibilization using SJW are very sparce.

There are cases of photosens. using hypericin and synthetic hypericine in

conj with UV-A and UV-B (Anderson et al (1992) Testing is not enough: do IDU

know their serostatus? abstract, Proceedings of the VIII Int Conf on AIDS,

Amsterdam.  Brochmoller et al (1997) Hypericina and pseudohypericin:

pharmacokinetics and effects on photosensitivity in humans.

Pharmacopsychiatry, 30 (Suppl 2), 94-101).



Woelk et al ((1994) Benefits and risks of the Hypericum extract LI 160: drug

monitoring study with 3250 patients.  J Geriatr Psychiaty Neurol, 7 (Suppl

1), S34-38) did not find one case of phototox analysing 3250 cases of

consumption of SJW.



Ernst (et al. (1998) Adverse effect profile of the herbal antidepressant SJW

(Hypericum perf) Eur J Clin Pharmacol, 54 (8): 589-94) in a systematc review

declares that the cases of phototox are rare, but then gives no data.



People with AIDS using long term high levels of hypericin (2 ml intravenous)

and SJW (12 tablets of standardised extract per day) did not show side

effects (Vonsover et al (1996) HIV-1 virus load in the serum of AIDS

patients undergoing long term therapy with hypericin.  Int Conf AIDS (Jul

7-12) 11(1):120. Abstract No. Mo.B.1377).



One study showed phototox at hypericin levels of 0.5 mg/kg (Mcauliffe et al

(1993) A Phase I dose escalation study of synthetic hypericine in HIV

infected patients.  Nat Conf Hum Retroviruses Relat Infect (1st), 12-6: 159)



Finally, Bernd (et al (1999) Phototoxic effects of Hypericum extract in

cultures of human keratinocytes compared with those of psoralen.  Photochem

Photobiol, 69(2):218-221) concluded that the plasma levels of hypericin in

case of therapeutic use are too low to cause phototoxicity.



Obviously this does not mean care should be used with patients with fare

skin, using high dose of SJW and working in the sun all day.



Hope this is of help



Marco



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW & Sun Sensitivity, part II

From: "Pamela Quayle" <herbgatherer@hotmail.com>

Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 06:25:17 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Pamela Quayle <herbgatherer@hotmail.com> :



>

> SJW sun-sensitivity is so rare it shouldn't worry anyone using the plant



I was recently asked about SJW and ocular damage.  I have never heard any

negative reports of sun sensitivity directly effecting the EYES with SJW

use.



Does anyone have any information on this?  The person who asked didn't have

any basis - just "I heard".



I'm beginning to feel like an alarmist lately trying to understand all the

ideas floating around about my favorite herbs.  Yet "erring on the side of

caution"  is still the route I wish to take - as long as there is some basis

for it.



Pamela



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Echinacea

From: "C'Anne" <excargo@onemain.com>

Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 13:36:57 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by excargo@onemain.com :



Would a tincture of Echinacea made from spring-dug roots be effective? I was

away from my home last fall, so couldn't dig them up then.  If not, is there

a good source for roots I could use now or, failing that, a source of

prepared tincture for a lesser cost than healthfood store prices?  Between

my friends and I, we use a lot of it.



C'Anne



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: St. John's wort

From: "Hideka Kobayashi" <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu>

Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 17:40:16 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Hideka Kobayashi <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu> :



<there is a problem for the estimated 8% of caucasian population which s

deficient in the liver enzyme CYP2D6, which metabolizes SSRIs. The result

will be a excessive buildup of serotonin.>



Sorry, I am not sure if I understood this or not. Are you referring to

breaking down of hyericin or serotonin? The confusing thing is, a group of

Canadian scientists have isolated serotonin and melatonin from St. John's

wort in vitro. There have been too many chemicals (hypericin, hyperforin,

procyanindins, melatonin, serotonin, and xanthones) attributed to the

antidipressant activity in St. John's wort.



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: St. John's wort

From: "Phosphor" <phosphor@hotkey.net.au>

Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:06:26 +0300

--------

Sent to the herblist by Phosphor <phosphor@hotkey.net.au> :



  > <there is a problem for the estimated 8% of caucasian population which s

> deficient in the liver enzyme CYP2D6, which metabolizes SSRIs. The result

> will be a excessive buildup of serotonin.>

>

> Sorry, I am not sure if I understood this or not. Are you referring to

> breaking down of hyericin or serotonin?



hypericin and I suppose whatever other chemicals act as SSRIs.



Andrew



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: re: SJW & Sun Sensitivity

From: paf@webzone.net

Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2001 08:31:12 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by paf@webzone.net :



Below is a report from one who was sun-sensitive while on SJW.  She is a

very fair-skinned blonde of German-Irish-English extraction.  Blood type of

her parents is "O", so probably hers is, as well (the Irish-English parent

is on SJW without sun-sensitivity problems).

-Anita



>I took Nature's Resource 300mg extract, in capsules. The bottle says it

>has .9mg hypericin per capsule also. I took 2 at a time, per day, in the

>evening. I have never taken more than 4 capsules in a day.  I am fair

>enough that I tend to burn after 45 min in the sun normally, but while I

>was taking SJW I got a sun rash on my hands and arms with as little as 10

>min exposure despite wearing 15-30spf sunscreens. The rash appeared about

>4 hours after exposure, so it took me a long time to figure out it was sun

>related. I wasn't taking anything else that I can recall at the same time,

>except chlorphenirmine (sp?). I am sure I don't have lupus since the rash

>drove me to the Dr. to check for that.



--



paf@webzone.net



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW & Sun Sensitivity

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 12:03:09 +0300

--------

Sent to the herblist by Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



paf@webzone.net wrote to herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu:



>Sent to the herblist by paf@webzone.net :

>

>Below is a report from one who was sun-sensitive while on SJW.  She is a

>very fair-skinned blonde of German-Irish-English extraction.  Blood type of



>her parents is "O", so probably hers is, as well (the Irish-English parent

>is on SJW without sun-sensitivity problems).



>>I took Nature's Resource 300mg extract, in capsules. The bottle says it

>>has .9mg hypericin per capsule also. I took 2 at a time, per day, in the



You'll find lots of these. Now show me the exceedingly few that burn

more easily after having taken non-standardized herbalist-made (or

self-made) quality tinctures.



You'll have to look _really_ hard to find those. 



Why does standardized extract give far more reports of easy sunburn? 

One possibility is adulteration. Hypericin, the single constituent, does

give you sun sensitivity. Hypericum, the herb, does not. 



The cheapest Hypericum on the market is Chinese, which contains no

hypericin at all -- unless, of course, it's been added. As it's still

offered (I get lots of herb-related spam, in addition to the rest of

them; the Chinese usually send long lists of their herbal selection) 

I expect that some of the more dishonest (or less informed) companies

still buy it. Where does that end up? Check your standardized Hypericum

extract, brand El Cheapo.



The best Hypericum tinctures on the market are made from flowering tops,

not from the whole plant. They're not cheap, as there's work involved.



By the way, I just heard on another list that Hypericum crops have been

pretty much decimated by a disease. Treasure your wild stands, and make

your own tinctures and oils. Prices will go up, if they haven't done so

yet.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi     Helsinki, Finland     http://ibiblio.org/herbmed

Medicinal and Culinary herbFAQs, pics, database, neat stuff, archives...



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW & Sun Sensitivity

From: Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net>

Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 08:34:02 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net> :



Henriette wrote:

>By the way, I just heard on another list that Hypericum crops have been

>pretty much decimated by a disease. Treasure your wild stands, and make

>your own tinctures and oils. Prices will go up, if they haven't done so

>yet.



Now wouldn't you know that it would take cultivation to really get rid of SJW.

When I lived in the north west, before SJW was popular it was 

considered a noxious weed, so noxious in fact they imported beetles 

to help destroy it, and yep you could find the beetles on the plants 

but the plants looked not worse for the wear. This was all to protect 

cattle, but I have never seen a cow that would eat it if there was 

other graze around. Out on the hills and fields the SJW clumps were 

left alone, everything else except thistle would be eaten around it.

How sad to hear the cultivated crops are doing badly, can mean that 

you won't find much in the wild either. Sharon in Tucson



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW & Sun Sensitivity

From: "Pamela Quayle" <herbgatherer@hotmail.com>

Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 07:49:22 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Pamela Quayle <herbgatherer@hotmail.com> :



so noxious in fact they imported beetles to help destroy it,



> How sad to hear the cultivated crops are doing badly, can mean that

> you won't find much in the wild either. Sharon in Tucson

>

The beetles that were imported to the Northwest are also here in New

England.  Don't know if they were also released here or migrated.  They

definitely eat the plants here, but there life cycle seems short and the

plants rebound.  I walk around with a five gallon bucket and shake the top

of the plant so they drop into the bucket - seems they don't fly in that

feeding stage.  I suspect that they spread anthracnose from the soil (where

it is always present) onto the plant.



The cultivated plants are very prone to anthracnose - a fungal disease.  I

believe that SJW doesn't care to be tamed into cultivation- the plants that

pop up on their own in my wild garden area do okay, but the ones I have

planted in masses have contacted anthracnose every time.  In the wild they

are usually in just the opposite conditions of cultivated fields -

disturbed, rocky areas.



I also find mullein much happier doing its own thing.



Pamela



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Apology for Double Posting

From: "Scott Carlton" <carlton@mcn.net>

Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 07:40:40 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by Scott Carlton <carlton@mcn.net> :



My apologies for a double posting today.  I had received a bounce notice

indicating a format error so re-posted even though I couldn't find the

error.  Seems like the bounce was intended for another submission from

someone else.



Best Regards,

Aliceann



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW

From: Elfreem@aol.com

Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 13:10:09 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by elfreem@aol.com :



>  Sorry, I am not sure if I understood this or not. Are you referring to

>  breaking down of hyericin or serotonin? The confusing thing is, a group of

>  Canadian scientists have isolated serotonin and melatonin from St. John's

>  wort in vitro. 



Do you have more information on this? ...which Canadian scientists,

and where did they report their findings? thanx



Elliot Freeman



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Fw: Herbs for Mental Health

From: "Melanie Comito" <melanie_comito@wn.com.au>

Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 16:56:20 +0800

--------

Sent to the herblist by Melanie Comito <melanie_comito@wn.com.au> :



Greetings all



I am new to the list and so I'm hoping I'm not out of line jumping in feet

first.



I am seeking information of herbs which may be used in the treatment of

ADD, ADHD & Bi-polars.  Specifically, I would like to know any risks of

clashing with the drugs commonly prescribed for such disorders.



I have had many requests from people who know I have a keen interest in

herbs

for this sort of information. In addition I am ADHD myself with Depression

also

running in my family.



Any suggestions would be most welcome.



Blessings



Melanie



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: SJW/5-HTP/SAM-E

From: rja86@webtv.net (Renee and Jerry)

Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 08:52:17 -0800 (PST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by Renee <rja86@webtv.net> :



Can someone give me their opinion as to which of these is the most

efficient for the mojority of people.  I know our chemical makeup is all

different though.  Since SJW is a sedative also, I would probably have

to take at night.  The 5-HTP precursor to serotonin with tryptophan

seems more like an SSRI, which have helped me in the past.  I don't know

anything about SAM-E, except that people with  bipolar shouldn't take

it, as it could make a manic phase worse.   I have problems sleeping,

and need the energy during the day, and have a mild, chronic depression.

Thank you in advance for any advice you can share with me and the list.



Happy Springtime!!



Love,  

Renee and Jerry



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW/5-HTP/SAM-E

From: "Richard & Cyndi Ask" <ask@gtii.com>

Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 12:15:14 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by Richard & Cyndi Ask <ask@gtii.com> :



SJW was the first herb I was introduced to.

It is recommended to be taken three times a day for depression.

It also takes 6-8 weeks to build up in your blood.

It is also anti viral.



I have a client who is a minor bi polar and takes SAM-E very

successfully.



Most seritonin is made in the colon so if you have a clean

balanced colon you will make what you need.



If sleep is real issue I would suggest a combination of hops,

valerian and passion flower.



Richard



> Sent to the herblist by Renee <rja86@webtv.net> :

>

> Can someone give me their opinion as to which of these is the

most efficient for the mojority of people.  I know our chemical

makeup is all different though.  Since SJW is a sedative also, I

would

probably have to take at night.  The 5-HTP precursor to serotonin

with

tryptophan seems more like an SSRI, which have helped me in the

past.  I

don't know anything about SAM-E, except that people with  bipolar

shouldn't take it, as it could make a manic phase worse.   I have

problems

sleeping, and need the energy during the day, and have a mild,

chronic

depression>



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: SJW/5-HTP/SAM-E

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 12:27:41 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



> Sent to the herblist by Richard & Cyndi Ask <ask@gtii.com> :> 

> SJW was the first herb I was introduced to.

 It is also anti viral.

 Is there other information on this antiviral factor, another source?



takes SAM-E very successfully.

What is SAM-E?



 Most seritonin is made in the colon so if you have a clean balanced

colon you will make what you need.  

Can you name a source for this info?

> 

> If sleep is real issue I would suggest a combination of hops,

> valerian and passion flower.

sounds effective..



.  The 5-HTP precursor to serotonin  with  tryptophan seems more like an

SSRI, which have helped me in the > past. 



What is 5-HTP?

What is SSRI?

Where can I read about these?



When there are sufficient gaps in my information, listening/reading is

like playing with a bran-new lesson in a foreign language.   It is a

fascinating puzzle, but was I supposed to understand more of what you are

saying?



Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Marcia/SSRI/SAM-E

From: rja86@webtv.net (Renee and Jerry)

Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 10:15:10 -0800 (PST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by Renee <rja86@webtv.net> :



  Marcia, SSRI is Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor and is an

antidepressant.



This is what I got on SAM-E:

  new treatment option for depression, arthritis, and perhaps, some

liver disorders. SAMe contains a compound that all living cells produce.

The compound -- an important player in a molecular process called

methylation -- helps neighboring organs and tissues by transfering one

molecule, which contains a package of four atoms, to an adjacent

molecule. This transfer changes the shape of both molecules and affects

several physical processes, including the regulation of some hormones

and the neurotransmitters serotonin, melatonin, dopamine and adrenaline

(important regulators of mood).



Happy Springtime!!



Love,  

Renee and Jerry



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Marcia/SSRI/SAM-E

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 15:39:20 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



> Sent to the herblist by Renee <rja86@webtv.net> :> 

>   Marcia, SSRI is Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor and is an

> antidepressant.



Thank you. Additionally do you think the Herbal PDR might use this SSRI

acronym on an herbal category list, or do you  (anyone lurking with

knowledge) feel that this category becomes allopathic by dint of the fact

that it is too extracted to be related herbally to any botanical it may

have come from?  If there are herbs that do some of this in a small way,

might someone come up with a mild but effective combination? I am

interested personally, because winter gets me down.



...   new treatment option for depression, arthritis, and perhaps, some

> liver disorders, SAMe contains a compound that all living cells 

> produce...molecular process called  methylation -- helps neighboring

organs and tissues... and affects... the regulation of some  hormones,...

serotonin, melatonin, dopamine and adrenaline (important regulators of

mood).



That is amazing!  Thank you for sharing. Happy Springtime!!

Good luck and good health to you and yours,

Marcia

---



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Serotonin biosynthesis in SJW

From: hkobayas <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu>

Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 13:02:05 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by Hideka Kobayashi <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu> :



Here's the info on this. This came out last year, and authors previously 

reported the presence of serotonin in plants (1998?). The paper on biological 

acitivity of SJW procyanidin came out 1999. The one on xanthones came out last 

year. I am not in my office, so cannot get all the citation.



Plant Cell Reports

ISSN: 0721-7714 (printed version)

ISSN: 1432-203X (electronic version)



Abstract Volume 19 Issue 7 (2000) pp 698-704 

Tryptophan is a precursor for melatonin and serotonin biosynthesis in in vitro 

regenerated St. John's wort (Hypericum perforatum L. cv. Anthos) plants

S. J. Murch, S. KrishnaRaj, P. K. Saxena

Department of Plant Agriculture, Biotechnology Division, Edmund C. Bovey 

Complex, University of Guelph, Guelph, Ontario, Canada, N1G 2W1 Fax: 

+1-519-7670755 e-mail psaxena@uoguelph.ca

Received: 9 November 1999 / Revision received: 16 December 1999 / Accepted: 21 

December 1999

Communicated by: L. C. Fowke

Evidence of a pathway for the biosynthesis of the mammalian neurohormones 

melatonin and serotonin in in vitro regenerated plantlets of St. John's wort 

(Hypericum perforatum cv. Anthos) is presented. Isotope tracer experiments 

were performed on plantlets regenerated from thidiazuron-induced stem explants 

and grown on MS basal medium for 2 months. Radiolabel from 14C-tryptophan was 

recovered as 14C-indoleacetic acid, 14C-tryptamine, 14C-5-hydroxytryptophan, 

14C-serotonin and 14C-melatonin in the treated St. John's wort plantlets. 

Chromatographic peak identity was confirmed by high performance liquid 

chromatography-mass spectrometry-mass spectrometry and quantification of 

melatonin by radioimmunoassay. Significantly more radiolabel was recovered in 

serotonin relative to melatonin under low light conditions with this ratio 

being reversed under increased lighting, indicating that the rate of flow 

through this biosynthetic pathway is regulated, at least in part, by light.



Hideka Kobayashi

Dept. of Natural Resources 

and Environmental Sciences

1115 Plant Science Laboratory

1201 S. Dorner Dr. 

Urbana, IL 61801



==========

To: herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu

Subject: Re: Serotonin biosynthesis in SJW

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 15:51:44 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by marcia v grossbard <ngbard@juno.com> :



On Sat, 31 Mar 2001 13:02:05 -0600 hkobayas <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu>

writes:

> Sent to the herblist by Hideka Kobayashi <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu> 

> :

> 

> Here's the info on this. This came out last year, and authors 

> previously  reported the presence of serotonin in plants (1998?). 

Amazing!  Perhaps this is happening in a small way in more plants, some

of which may be more familiar.

There was some writing in the past on bolted lettuce having a mild either

sedative or slightly soporific effect.  May one suppose that serotonin is

a factor?



> Plant Cell Reports

> ISSN: 0721-7714 (printed version)

> ISSN: 1432-203X (electronic version)

 Is there a website to access this kind of info?



I don't think the electronic list genie will let me quote all that

followed,

but I would like to get hold of as many of these articles and/or

abstracts as I can.   I hate to delete so much good meaty email, but I

must select:

  

Significantly more radiolabel was  recovered in  serotonin relative to

melatonin under low light conditions with this  ratio  being reversed

under increased lighting, indicating that the rate of  flow  through this

biosynthetic pathway is regulated, at least in part, by  light.



This is fascinating.  Thank you for sharing.

btw, I am saving this email in a separate file.



Marcia

---



