

==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] advice please for breast implant

From: MARDI2GRAS@aol.com

Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 23:13:53 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by mardi2gras@aol.com :



a friend of mine recently had breast implants. (saline) one of them became 

inflamed, the breast itself not the scar. was on a course of cipro for 2 

weeks. seems to be improved. the muscle around the implant is too firm. I 

told her to massage, stretch chest with exercise, apply vit. E and calendula. 

It is still stiff and uncomfortable. Also she had a high SED rate, checked by 

blood work when on cipro. What else can I advise? Heard of vit K creme, but 

don't know much about it. Any herbal preparations, internal or external 

advised? Thanks in advance for your kindness.



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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Colon cleanse

From: greg patch <patch@berkshire.net>

Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 10:49:32 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Greg Patch" <patch@berkshire.net> :



>Sent to the herblist by jmission@indy.net :

>is addressing.  If her situation is more related to emotions - what about

>the Bach flower/flower essences remedies?

>j



>Thanks for the replies and I will advise Slippery Elm. Yes she does need

>Calm and the EFT techniques (see www.emofree.com)  that I have taught her

>Rochelle



>valarian 1pt      (nervine ..especially when there

>                   is a nervous component)



Herbally, smiling atcha Henriette, the emotional levels could be addressed

with Milky Oats - Avena sativa, Motherwort - Leonurus cardiaca, Skullcap -

Scutelaria lat. nervine restoratives and/or relaxants that would address

the emotional triggers.

I would go easy with Hops and Valerian, as they tend toward more

suppressive, herbs that sedate, not truely get to the source(s) of

emotional imbalance. Valerian can heighten emotional stress with many

people, ie., those  using "sleep drugs", hot conditions with inflammation,

also can be a dependence thing, suggest taking a break with it a few days

after 2-3 weeks, it is strong, and can accumulate within.



Regards,

Greg









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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Cinnamon during pregnancy

From: "Iram Rafiq" <iram@mjrafiq.freeserve.co.uk>

Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 18:37:49 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Iram Rafiq" <iram@mjrafiq.freeserve.co.uk> :



Hi.  My friend is 7 months pregnant and she's been craving cinnamon for the

past couple of months.  She has the raw sticks a lot each day.  I'm worried

that having so much cinnamon may not be good for her.  Could anyone help me

with this?  What are the harmful effects of cinnamon?



Thanks.



Iram





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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Cinnamon during pregnancy

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 20:57:39 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by "marcia v grossbard" <ngbard@juno.com> :







On Fri, 1 Mar 2002 18:37:49 -0000 "Iram Rafiq"

<iram@mjrafiq.freeserve.co.uk> writes:

> Sent to the herblist by "Iram Rafiq" <iram@mjrafiq.freeserve.co.uk> :

> 

> Hi.  My friend is 7 months pregnant and she's been craving cinnamon 

> for the

> past couple of months.  She has the raw sticks a lot each day.  I'm 

> worried

> that having so much cinnamon may not be good for her.  Could anyone 

> help me

> with this?  What are the harmful effects of cinnamon?

> 

> Thanks.

> 

> Iram

> 

Hi, Iram,



Here is one source of info on cinnamon:



http://www.botanical.com/botanical/mgmh/c/cinnam69.html



This is the Margaret Grieve site.



Mention is made of it being good for nausea and gas, and also preventing

hemorrhages from the womb.  If you are nervous, and she is intuitively

preventing problems, perhaps she should see her

ob/gyn, just in case intuition is not enough.



Marcia

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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Hemp

From: "gcwhite" <gcwhite@ntlworld.com>

Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2002 09:59:58 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Graham White" <gcwhite@ntlworld.com> :



Hi All



My hemp seed oil man told me that all hemp products (oil, fibre, seed cake

etc.) have been banned in the USA by the FDA (or some other set of initials)

recently.



Is this true?



Cheers



Graham White  B.Sc. (Herb. Med.), MNIMH.

Medical Herbalist

Bishop's Stortford & Buntingford

--------------------------------------------------------------------



gcwhite@ntlworld.com





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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Hemp

From: hkobayas <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu>

Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 00:28:57 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Hideka Kobayashi" <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu> :



<I've seen at an FDA web site that it is illegal, as of 1 Jan 2002, to sell

soap or lotion containing hemp oil.>



The ban has been extended til March. There is a question if the law will be 

(stringently) enforced or not.



My advisor has been working on the hemp issue in Illinois. The law to legalize 

cultivation of hemp (for scientific purpose only?) was passed last year, but 

it was vetoed by the govenor. The whole story sounded fairy complicated. I 

heard Police Department was very uspet about the whole incident.



I am not a pro or an anti for legalization of hemp cultivation. However, it 

doesn't make sense when poppy seed products that contain (very tiny amount of) 

morphine and its related compounds are readily available, while hemp products 

are banned because of similary tighny amount of THC.



Hideka Kobayashi

Dept. of Natural Resources and Environmental Sciences

1115 Plant Science Laboratory

1201 S. Dorner Dr.

Urbana, IL 61801





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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Hemp

From: Art Sackett <asackett@artsackett.com>

Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2002 03:12:38 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Art Sackett" <medherb@artsackett.com> :



On Sat, Mar 02, 2002 at 09:59:58AM -0000, gcwhite wrote:



> My hemp seed oil man told me that all hemp products (oil, fibre, seed cake

> etc.) have been banned in the USA by the FDA (or some other set of initials)

> recently.

> 

> Is this true?



Nope. It may soon be, but for now, it's not. You may wish to look 

around at http://www.votehemp.com/



-- 

----   Art Sackett   ----

PGP/GPG Public Key: asackett-pubkey@artsackett.com (autoresponder)



"Turn on, tune up, rock out."

-- Billy Gibbons



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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Hemp

From: "Aegis Enterprises" <aegisent@chartertn.net>

Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2002 13:41:05 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Aegis Enterprises" <aegisent@chartertn.net> :



I've seen at an FDA web site that it is illegal, as of 1 Jan 2002, to sell

soap or lotion containing hemp oil.



CoraLynn

ne TN



> > My hemp seed oil man told me that all hemp products (oil, fibre, seed

cake

> > etc.) have been banned in the USA by the FDA (or some other set of

initials)

> > recently.







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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Hemp

From: elementalclay@webtv.net (Roxanne Brown)

Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2002 14:48:53 -0600 (CST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Roxanne J Brown" <elementalclay@webtv.net> :



CoraLynne,

  I was unable to find the FDA site you mentioned about hemp oil being

illegal in the US.  Could you help me find the information?

  Thank you,

Roxanne



Roxanne J. Brown

Elemental Clay

http://www.cloudnet.com/~elemclay/

"One does not learn by speaking"





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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Hemp

From: "Aegis Enterprises" <aegisent@chartertn.net>

Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 00:31:45 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Aegis Enterprises" <aegisent@chartertn.net> :



Don't remember the url but will ask on the list I got it from.



CoraLynn

ne TN



> CoraLynne,

>   I was unable to find the FDA site you mentioned about hemp oil being

> illegal in the US.  Could you help me find the information?







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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Hemp

From: "Gardenthyme Lady" <dblan@netusa1.net>

Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 08:39:50 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by "GardenThyme~Lady" <dblan@netusa1.net> :



http://www.efn.org/~charlesg/links_b.html

Lots and lots of links here



Dee

"The Gardenthyme Lady"





--



Sent to the herblist by "Aegis Enterprises" <aegisent@chartertn.net> :



Don't remember the url but will ask on the list I got it from.



CoraLynn

ne TN



> CoraLynne,

>   I was unable to find the FDA site you mentioned about hemp oil being

> illegal in the US.  Could you help me find the information?











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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Hemp

From: "Aegis Enterprises" <aegisent@chartertn.net>

Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 21:29:14 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Aegis Enterprises" <aegisent@chartertn.net> :



Well, soap & lotions are exempt but the oil is not.  How do you make the

first without the oil?  Oh, well, we have a short reprieve, though.

http://www.drcnet.org/wol/206.html#deaban



CoraLynn

ne TN



> >   I was unable to find the FDA site you mentioned about hemp oil being

> > illegal in the US.  Could you help me find the information?







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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Hemp

From: Art Sackett <asackett@artsackett.com>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 00:19:24 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Art Sackett" <medherb@artsackett.com> :



On Sat, Mar 09, 2002 at 09:29:14PM -0500, Aegis Enterprises wrote:



> Well, soap & lotions are exempt but the oil is not.  How do you make the

> first without the oil?  Oh, well, we have a short reprieve, though.

> http://www.drcnet.org/wol/206.html#deaban



Well, if one considers a granted Motion to Stay as indicative of 

probable success (as it's supposed to be), then our reprieve may be 

longer than Asa Hutchinson would like: 



http://www.votehemp.com/PR/3-8-02_stay_granted.html



-- 

----   Art Sackett   ----

PGP/GPG Public Key: asackett-pubkey@artsackett.com (autoresponder)





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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Hemp

From: JCrobin838@aol.com

Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2002 16:35:38 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Jackie" <JCrobin838@aol.com> :



In a message dated 3/2/02 3:49:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, 

elementalclay@webtv.net writes:



> 

>  CoraLynne,

>    I was unable to find the FDA site you mentioned about hemp oil being

>  illegal in the US.  Could you help me find the information?

>    Thank you,

>  Roxanne

>  

This refers to eating the hemp mostly. 



Jackie



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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Hemp

From: "Aegis Enterprises" <aegisent@chartertn.net>

Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 10:26:46 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Aegis Enterprises" <aegisent@chartertn.net> :



well, supposedly the US military & other gov. agencies have banned the use

of hemp soap & lotion because you will test positive to THC under regular

use.  My dh works for TVA & the first of this year they gave all employees a

letter stating this stand & that testing positive for THC from soap use was

as bad as testing positive for heroin.



CoraLynn

ne TN



> I am not a pro or an anti for legalization of hemp cultivation. However,

it

> doesn't make sense when poppy seed products that contain (very tiny amount

of)

> morphine and its related compounds are readily available, while hemp

products

> are banned because of similary tighny amount of THC.







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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Hemp

From: Art Sackett <asackett@artsackett.com>

Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2002 18:02:52 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Art Sackett" <medherb@artsackett.com> :



On Sat, Mar 02, 2002 at 09:59:58AM -0000, gcwhite wrote:



8< snip >8



> My hemp seed oil man told me that all hemp products (oil, fibre, seed cake

> etc.) have been banned in the USA by the FDA (or some other set of initials)

> recently.



The good news:



http://www.votehemp.com/PR/3-8-02_stay_granted.html



-- 

----   Art Sackett   ----

PGP/GPG Public Key: asackett-pubkey@artsackett.com (autoresponder)





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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Colon cleanse

From: "rochelle" <rochelle@ntlworld.com>

Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2002 21:45:01 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by "rochelle" <rochelle@ntlworld.com> :



Thanks Greg for this very useful information.  I make up sleep Potions for

people and am always wary about using too much Valerian. I love Avena Sativa

though!!



Regards,

Rochelle



www.rochellemarsden.co.uk



---------------------------

Herbally, smiling atcha Henriette, the emotional levels could be addressed

with Milky Oats - Avena sativa, Motherwort - Leonurus cardiaca, Skullcap -

Scutelaria lat. nervine restoratives and/or relaxants that would address

the emotional triggers.

I would go easy with Hops and Valerian, as they tend toward more

suppressive, herbs that sedate, not truely get to the source(s) of

emotional imbalance. Valerian can heighten emotional stress with many

people, ie., those  using "sleep drugs", hot conditions with inflammation,

also can be a dependence thing, suggest taking a break with it a few days

after 2-3 weeks, it is strong, and can accumulate within.



Regards,

Greg











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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Berberis/Chelidonium

From: "rochelle" <rochelle@ntlworld.com>

Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2002 21:47:19 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by "rochelle" <rochelle@ntlworld.com> :



Having just ordered some Chelidonium I would love a simple differential when

thinking in terms of Liver problems. I am aware that Berberis is also a

kidney herb but I note it can also be used for liver.



Regards,



Rochelle

www.rochellemarsden.co.uk





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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Lobelia

From: "rochelle" <rochelle@ntlworld.com>

Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2002 21:53:19 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by "rochelle" <rochelle@ntlworld.com> :



The last query today - honestly. I received some Lobelia HT today and it was

sooo different from the stuff I usually get from the homeopathic supplier I

deal with and it is sold to me from them as HT. The liquid I got today was a

reddish colour and tasted nice!!! The stuff I usually get is clear and

tastes horrid. I suspect that the tincture from the homeopathic supplier is

really a 1x MT. I usually give it to patients as a Ventalin substitute and

firstly dilute is 100% and say take 2 drops on the tongue. Now I am

wondering just how to prescribe this reddish herbal tincture. I would want

to use it as a lung tonic and as a substitute for Ventalin in a mild

asthmatic or wheezing case.



regards, Rochelle

www.rochellemarsden.co.uk





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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Good medium for an insect repellent, Pennyroyal EO dangers

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 11:35:52 -0600

--------

Hi, I hope we've moved to the new list, the date March 1st seems to stick in

my mind, but I couldn't confirm that with anything.



I'm thinking of formulating an insect repellent spray using essential oils.

I'm wondering what the best medium would be. Do you think a straight

ethanol/water mixture, or would ethanol/water/carrier oil be better? I'm

thinking a carrier oil might help prevent the essential oils from

evaporating quickly after it's been sprayed on. Obviously whatever I use,

shaking well before each use is going to be crucial.



Also, do you feel the dangers of using pennyroyal essential oil externally

while pregnant are overstated?



TIA



Kerry





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Good medium for an insect repellent, Pennyroyal EO dangers

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2002 22:00:28 +0200

--------

"Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com> wrote to <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>:



> I'm thinking of formulating an insect repellent spray using essential oils.

> I'm wondering what the best medium would be. Do you think a straight

> ethanol/water mixture, or would ethanol/water/carrier oil be better? I'm

> thinking a carrier oil might help prevent the essential oils from

> evaporating quickly after it's been sprayed on. Obviously whatever I use,

> shaking well before each use is going to be crucial.



I dunno; I just (well, yesterday, in fact) made an insect-repellent salve. It's

guaranteed for horseflies, but should work against skeeters, too.



oil:                  sesame oil, cold-pressed (nice scent, which does its bit

                      against mosquitoes)

main herb:            yarrow flowers (that's for the horseflies)

secondary herb:       lavender flowers (that's for the skeeters)

what else to put in:  meadowsweet wouldn't hurt; a blend I made a few years ago

   was sesame oil, lavender flowers, and meadowsweet. Kept mosquitoes away

   for an hour or so at a time, then you had to reapply. That's about how long

   OFF keeps'em off, over here, and this one does it with no scary chemicals.

   Cool!



Also, I'm happy to report that I've found a local supplier of certified organic

beeswax; I've bought exclusively from them for the last two years or so. Like,

wow. Certified organic means there are _no_ non-organic fields in their area.

They have a few hundred hives. Cool people; they popped in for a visit last

fall, too. And they live next door to the lady who drew the funny pictures for

my herb books... about 500 km away from here.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi           Henriette Kress            Helsinki, Finland   

Over 30 MB herbal .html files (FAQs, classic texts, articles, links), plus

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Good medium for an insect repellent, Pennyroyal EO dangers

From: HerbalSW@aol.com

Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 15:40:08 EST

--------

Witchazel is also an excellent "carrier" mixed with water and whatever oils 

you want to use (citronella, lavender, etc.)



Catherine M. Wood, LCSW, CADC, ADS

Eagle Spirit Healing Center

Where Your Spirit Learns To Soar

www.eaglespirithealingcenter.com

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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Good medium for an insect repellent, Pennyroyal EO dangers

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 17:28:35 -0600

--------

When you say witch hazel, do you mean commercial witch hazel, or an infusion

of witch hazel, or tincture of witch hazel? Does commercial witch hazel

contain alcohol (which I feel is important for preservative value)?



Kerry



-----Original Message-----



Witchazel is also an excellent "carrier" mixed with water and whatever oils

you want to use (citronella, lavender, etc.)



Catherine M. Wood, LCSW, CADC, ADS





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Good medium for an insect repellent, Pennyroyal EO dangers

From: Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Mon, 04 Mar 2002 08:44:21 +0100

--------

Kerry & Jack wrote:

> 

> Hi, I hope we've moved to the new list, the date March 1st seems to stick in

> my mind, but I couldn't confirm that with anything.

> 

> I'm thinking of formulating an insect repellent spray using essential oils.

> I'm wondering what the best medium would be. Do you think a straight

> ethanol/water mixture, or would ethanol/water/carrier oil be better? I'm

> thinking a carrier oil might help prevent the essential oils from

> evaporating quickly after it's been sprayed on. Obviously whatever I use,

> shaking well before each use is going to be crucial.



Have you thought about using a Tween to disperse the eos in the water medium?

Secondly, Eucalyptus eo can be in theory useful to decrease evaporation time

of other eos.

 

> Also, do you feel the dangers of using pennyroyal essential oil externally

> while pregnant are overstated?



Well, it depends on what claims you are referring to. In general I think they

are slightly overstated, although I know this is a delicate subject.  It

mainly depends on the amounts used, on the area of skin involved and on the

site of application.  EOs skin absorption isn't that easy as it is usually

stated, and the majority of the eos which are described as increasing uterine

contractions are in reality uterine relaxant; the reason why large amounts of

pennyroyal extracts can be dangeroud to the foetus is that large amout of

pennyroyal extract can be dangerous to the mother.

And the main culprit, pulegone, is permitted in food at levels comparable to

those bioavailable after a skin application.



But do not use if you do not feel safe, there are many other alternatives



Cheers

Marco

> 

> TIA

> 

> Kerry

> 

> _______________________________________________

> Herb mailing list

> Herb@lists.ibiblio.org

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-- 

Marco Valussi BSc (Hons.) Herbal Medicine

Medical Herbalist

Vicolo Santa Cecilia 7

37121 Verona

Italy





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Good medium for an insect repellent, Pennyroyal EO dangers

From: HerbalSW@aol.com

Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2002 07:47:43 EST

--------

commercial witch hazel



Catherine M. Wood, LCSW, CADC, ADS

Eagle Spirit Healing Center

Where Your Spirit Learns To Soar

www.eaglespirithealingcenter.com

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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] ADMIN: Have you packed? We're moving!

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2002 21:09:19 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Henriette Kress" <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



Hi all,



OK, everybody who was on the list on Feb 26 should be both on the old and the

new one, with digest and nomail sorted out. Sorry, there are no "index digests"

on mailman.



I'll shut down the old list once I'm sure the new one works as it should.



==============================



Some of you have sent me mail saying you didn't get the "welcome" message from

the new list. I don't know what happened, but here's the gist of that message:



==============================



The Move:



The sysadmins at ibiblio.org (who also run the lyris server) tell me that Lyris

has had more and more corruptions in the databases. They want to move all Lyris

lists to mailman, an open source -based mailing list software. 



I copied the full subscriber list from the old one to the new one, but had to do

things like "digest" and "nomail" by hand. So if you've been on digest lo these

years, and get full mail all of a sudden, it's all my fault, and you may

spoon-feed me disgusting herbal teas until your honor has been satisfied.



==============================



Addresses, commands and such.



To post to the new list, send your messages to:



  herb@lists.ibiblio.org



General information about the mailing list is at:



  http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/herb



There you can also subscribe, unsubscribe, or change your options (eg, switch to

or from digest mode, change your password, etc.).



Email commands should be sent to herb-request@lists.ibiblio.org

The commands are:

   subscribe 

   unsubscribe <password>

     (or, if you're unsub'ing an obsolete address):

      unsubscribe <password> [address] 

   info

   help 

      (will send you a looong list of commands, with descriptions)

   set digest on <password>

   set digest off <password>

   set nomail on <password>

   set nomail off <password>

   password <oldpassword> <newpassword> 

   end



==============================



I'm still allergic to full parrot-mode posts (ie. repeating the full message you

reply to, in your reply). I'm also still rather allergic to .html and mime

messages. Do set your email software to plain text for this list, and upgrade

AOL 5 to 6 or suchlike (I think AOL 5 is completely incapable of sending plain

text. Baaad show, AOL.)(Downgrading to AOL 4 should work)



Lyris bounced such allergy-inducing messages automatically back to the sender;

mailman does not. That means I'll have to cut'em out by hand. There's only one

way to do that: people who post either sort will be "moderated" posters

faster'n'you can say "Hives, I got _hives_!"



... yes, I know, take some liver herbs and a few nervines. Anyway, posts from

moderated folks will need listowner approval before they hit the list.



I don't like it, it means more work for me, so don't, eh? Thanks! (You won't

like it either, as there'll be a delay between you posting and me approving.)



Okay? Have fun!



Cheers

Henriette, listowner



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi           Henriette Kress            Helsinki, Finland   

Over 30 MB herbal .html files (FAQs, classic texts, articles, links), plus

pictures, zipped archives, the works, at:   http://www.ibiblio.org/herbmed



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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Berberis/Chelidonium

From: Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Mon, 04 Mar 2002 08:19:31 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Marco Valussi" <marcobabi@libero.it> :



rochelle wrote:

 

> Having just ordered some Chelidonium I would love a simple differential when

> thinking in terms of Liver problems.



What do you mean exactly?  A diff. between different 'liver' herbs (Chel and

Berb) or a diff. between different liver ailments/dysfunctions re:

chelidonium?  Anyhow, Chelidonium is more of a gall bladder herb than a liver

herb in my view, and Berberis (vulgaris?) is more of a liver herb than a

kidney herb, again in my view.

PS: and Chelidonium tincture is less stable and long-lasting than Berberis,

that's why I make my own fresh, helping my mother get rid of the pest!



Cheers

Marco

-- 

Marco Valussi BSc (Hons.) Herbal Medicine

Medical Herbalist

Vicolo Santa Cecilia 7

37121 Verona

Italy







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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Lobelia

From: Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Mon, 04 Mar 2002 08:24:03 +0100

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Marco Valussi" <marcobabi@libero.it> :



rochelle wrote:

> 

> Sent to the herblist by "rochelle" <rochelle@ntlworld.com> :

> 

> The last query today - honestly. I received some Lobelia HT today and it was

> sooo different from the stuff I usually get from the homeopathic supplier I

> deal with and it is sold to me from them as HT. The liquid I got today was a

> reddish colour and tasted nice!!! The stuff I usually get is clear and

> tastes horrid. I suspect that the tincture from the homeopathic supplier is

> really a 1x MT. 



Don't they give you details on the HTs (ratio, ethanol %, etc.?).  Is this HT

from fresh or dry?  Is the MT you get done according to French Pharm. or

German?  In the second case you usually get a plant juice stabilised with

alcohol (Hannemanian MT), in the first a typical fresh tincture 1:10.  They

are clear because homeo preparations are well filtered.



cheers

marco





-- 

Marco Valussi BSc (Hons.) Herbal Medicine

Medical Herbalist

Vicolo Santa Cecilia 7

37121 Verona

Italy







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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [herb] Re: Lobelia

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2002 06:00:47 -0500 (EST)

--------

> The last query today - honestly. I received some Lobelia HT today and it was

> sooo different from the stuff I usually get from the homeopathic supplier I

> deal with and it is sold to me from them as HT. The liquid I got today was a

> reddish colour and tasted nice!!! The stuff I usually get is clear and

> tastes horrid. I suspect that the tincture from the homeopathic supplier is

> really a 1x MT. I usually give it to patients as a Ventalin substitute and

> firstly dilute is 100% and say take 2 drops on the tongue. Now I am

> wondering just how to prescribe this reddish herbal tincture. I would want

> to use it as a lung tonic and as a substitute for Ventalin in a mild

> asthmatic or wheezing case.



> regards, Rochelle



What is HT?  I think Ventolin is albuterol, and Atrovent is ipratropium

bromide.  Is lobelia only for a mild asthma attack?  Is this tincture just

lobelia and ethanol, or is something added to improve the taste?  I've used

mixed herbal brews containing lobelia, and for more than just mild wheezing,

but once I started with green tea, I had practically no further use for

lobelia.  I don't know what you mean by tonic, but think lobelia is for

relief of symptoms, rather than improving the general condition.

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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Re: Pennyroyal Oil Application in Pregnancy

From: Elfreem@aol.com

Date: Mon, 04 Mar 2002 13:18:42 EST

--------

<<Also, do you feel the dangers of using pennyroyal essential oil externally

while pregnant are overstated?

>>



One of the problems with taking anything during pregnancy is that the fetus has undeveloped organs for elimination. Does that mean you can't take large portions of alcohol? ..or does that mean a pregnant 

mother shouldn't take alcohol at all? When my wife was pregnant, I wasn't terribly bothered when she had an infrequent glass of wine ..but if it was frequent I would have been concerned.



What does that have to do with Pennyroyal? After reading about multiple organ failure in two infants who were given Pennyroyal tea I think Pennyroyal is a whole lot more dangerous than alcohol. One of the infants received 120ml of the tea 14 hours before admission and other had received 90ml three times a day for 3 months. The first child needed a liver transplant but died before anything could be arranged. The second child developed seizures and eventually was discharged. The main constituent of Pennyroyal oil (pulegone) was found in both infants.(Pediatrics 1996;98:944-47)



While there may be many children who may have been given Pennyroyal tea and haven't developed toxicity, I am greatly concerned when it comes to using this herb in young children and pregnant women.



Should a pregnant mother apply Pennyroyal oil on her skin, assuming that little would be absorbed ...I wouldn't! There must be many other herbal remedies that have NO toxic potential ...so why take a risk, even if its small. I've read alot of case reports on herbal toxicity that I've dismissed without a second thought ..not this one though.



Regards,



Elliot Freeman RPh



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: Pennyroyal oil

From: Elfreem@aol.com

Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2002 13:20:15 EST

--------

<<Also, do you feel the dangers of using pennyroyal essential oil externally

while pregnant are overstated?

>>



One of the problems with taking anything during pregnancy is that

the fetus has undeveloped organs for elimination. Does that mean

you can't take large portions of alcohol? ..or does that mean a pregnant

mother shouldn't take alcohol at all? When my wife was pregnant,

I wasn't terribly bothered when she had a glass of wine ..but if it

was frequent I would have been concerned.



What does that have to do with Pennyroyal? After reading about

multiple organ failure in two infants who were given Pennyroyal tea

I think Pennyroyal is a whole lot more dangerous than alcohol.

One of the infants received 120ml of the tea 14 hours before

admission and other had received 90ml three times a day for

3 months. The first child need a liver transplant but died before

anything could be arranged. The second child developed seizures

and eventually was discharged. The main constituent of Pennyroyal 

oil (pulegone) was found in both infants.(Pediatrics 1996;98:944-47)



While there may be many children who may have been given 

Pennyroyal tea and haven't developed toxicity, I am greatly concerned

when it comes to using this herb in children and pregnant women.



Should a pregnant mother apply Pennyroyal oil on her skin, assuming

that little would be absorbed ...I wouldn't risk it! There must be many 

other herbal remedies that have NO toxic potential ...so why take

a risk, even if its small. I've read alot of case reports on herbal toxicity

that I've dismissed without a second thought ..not this one though.



--------

<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT  SIZE=2>&lt;&lt;Also, do you feel the dangers of using pennyroyal essential oil externally

<BR>while pregnant are overstated?

<BR>&gt;&gt;</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"></BLOCKQUOTE>

<BR></FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">

<BR>One of the problems with taking anything during pregnancy is that

<BR>the fetus has undeveloped organs for elimination. Does that mean

<BR>you can't take large portions of alcohol? ..or does that mean a pregnant

<BR>mother shouldn't take alcohol at all? When my wife was pregnant,

<BR>I wasn't terribly bothered when she had a glass of wine ..but if it

<BR>was frequent I would have been concerned.

<BR>

<BR>What does that have to do with Pennyroyal? After reading about

<BR>multiple organ failure in two infants who were given Pennyroyal tea

<BR>I think Pennyroyal is a whole lot more dangerous than alcohol.

<BR>One of the infants received 120ml of the tea 14 hours before

<BR>admission and other had received 90ml three times a day for

<BR>3 months. The first child need a liver transplant but died before

<BR>anything could be arranged. The second child developed seizures

<BR>and eventually was discharged. The main constituent of Pennyroyal 

<BR>oil (pulegone) was found in both infants.(Pediatrics 1996;98:944-47)

<BR>

<BR>While there may be many children who may have been given 

<BR>Pennyroyal tea and haven't developed toxicity, I am greatly concerned

<BR>when it comes to using this herb in children and pregnant women.

<BR>

<BR>Should a pregnant mother apply Pennyroyal oil on her skin, assuming

<BR>that little would be absorbed ...I wouldn't risk it! There must be many 

<BR>other herbal remedies that have NO toxic potential ...so why take

<BR>a risk, even if its small. I've read alot of case reports on herbal toxicity

<BR>that I've dismissed without a second thought ..not this one though.

<BR></FONT></HTML>





==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] AOL 6.0 users/testing

From: Elfreem@aol.com

Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2002 13:53:36 EST

--------

For the last several months I've been using AOL 6.0 and have had trouble

sending messages. Unless AOL 5.0 is used, there seems to be one

problem after another.



However, an AOL technician provided this tip ..that is setting the text to 

"normal". This needs to be done for each post and can't be set automatically, 

according  to the technician. If this posts my message without unecessary 

lines, I'll use it more often.



Also, another method is to use the AOL web site (www.aol.com). 



I have a CD containing AOL 7.0 ..does anyone know if they eliminated

the problems with the new version?



Elliot

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Request info on grapeseed extract and super-hyperactive

 children

From: luna <ladyluna@pa.net>

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 11:09:55 -0500

--------

I hope that someone can help me with some good info.



Talked to my guy's sister "K" last night.  She's just about at her wits end 

with her super-hyper-active four year old "C".  The little girl  is already 

in a special pre-school for very active children, and is doing OK there, 

but is still so hyperactive that "K" isn't getting enough rest trying to 

keep up with her, and her other two children are getting lost in the shuffle.



For background, "K" is a SAHM, Dad is supportive, but is frequently away 

for periods of time due to his obligations as a military officer.  The 

family's general nutrition is pretty good, balanced, lots of veggies and 

fruits, and less sweets and "junk" food than most American families.  All 

three of their children appear to be developing physically normally; the 

entire family, including  "K" and her husband "D"  have  slender to average 

bodies on the tall side, with "C" seeming to be a little more "solid" than 

the others.   Right now, the middle boy (age 8-9) seems to be experiencing 

some digestive troubles which might be psychosomatic, or might be due to 

some food intolerance...  he's undergoing some testing in the near 

future.  Oldest daughter (age 14) seems to be doing well physically, and 

seems happy and  as well adjusted as anyone her age. :)



"K" was told by someone at a health food store that she should give her 

hyper daughter grapeseed extract.   All K could remember was that it was a 

childrens chewable tablet made of  grapeseed mixed with "some kind of 

bark."  She was told that it would "open up the channels in her brain and 

help her stay calmer and have more self control."



When K asked me what I knew about it, I wasn't able to tell her much, since 

my approach is to use locally available, easily extracted native plants.  I 

almost never purchase anything commerically prepared, and know almost 

nothing about the latest "hot" herbals.  My sense is that this grapeseed 

chewable might be the latest "wonder" herb, but I told her I would look 

into it.  After all, new things are being discovered all the time, and I'd 

hate to "poo poo" this just because I didn't know anything about it.



In the meantime, I suggested that she look for any of Doris Rapp's books on 

pediatric allergies and hyperactivity, and to look for info on the Feingold 

diet.  I also suggested that she might want to consider very gentle nervine 

herbs like oats and lemon balm in the meantime.



Any info, advice, websites, etc gratefully appreciated.  TIA.  Be well, be 

happy, Blessed Be!



luna in PA, USA



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Request info on grapeseed extract and

  super-hyperactive children

From: Jim Lamplugh <thingandjim@wnm.net>

Date: Wed, 06 Mar 2002 01:08:12 -0600

--------

Luna,



The preparation that was recommended to your friend "K" is most likely a 

mixture of grapeseed extract and pine bark extract, with the pine bark 

being derived from Pinus maritimus, the Maritime Pine.  (These two extracts 

sometimes are found together because both contain a mixture of flavanoids 

called oligoproanthrocyanidins or OPC's for short.)  What grapeseed and 

pine bark are thought to do is act as antioxidants, like vitamin C & 

vitamin E, only the extracts are thought to be a good bit stronger.  I have 

seen references in a number of sources (commonly available at health food 

stores) to using grapeseed and/or pine bark with attention deficit type 

conditions.  While I wouldn't call grapeseed/pine bark the "latest hot" 

herbs -- the store where I work has been selling both of them for at least 

the last six or seven years, perhaps longer -- I would also tend to agree 

that they are unlikely to be particularly effective for your friend's 

child, without also implementing the suggestions you offered her.  That is, 

I would suggest them as adjuncts, not the only course of treatment.



Hope this helps,



Jim in Memphis



At 11:09 AM 3/5/02 -0500, you wrote:



>I hope that someone can help me with some good info.



<snip>





>"K" was told by someone at a health food store that she should give her 

>hyper daughter grapeseed extract.   All K could remember was that it was a 

>childrens chewable tablet made of  grapeseed mixed with "some kind of 

>bark."  She was told that it would "open up the channels in her brain and 

>help her stay calmer and have more self control."

>

><snip>



>Any info, advice, websites, etc gratefully appreciated.  TIA.  Be well, be 

>happy, Blessed Be!

>

>luna in PA, USA

>Version: 6.0.325 / Virus Database: 182 - Release Date: 2/19/02

--------



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Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Request info on grapeseed extract and super-hyperactive

	children

From: elementalclay@webtv.net (Roxanne Brown)

Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2002 02:21:41 -0600 (CST)

--------

  This is going to sound so mundane but I have been there with kids just

like that.  My youngest was labelled a "mommy killer".

  What I did was give the youngest girl, the mommy killer, as much

creative things I could think of and take one incident at a time. Easier

said than done.  Strict discipline and watching the diet closely helps.

Mine, I fed her and half an hour later she was crazy.  She grew out of

it and now is a very sensitive, but over weight 15 year old young woman.

The weight is a control issue.

  Her older brother was missing a lot of school from stomach problems

and a perpetual "cold".  We had both of these kids run thru every test

the Mayo had.

  My son was not sick or allergic but has fear in school from bullies.

He made himself sick.  Once we gave him permission to strike back

verbally and knowing the repercussions, his illness went away.

  What I am saying is that you need to look at the whole environment,

emotional, dietary, birth order, response to negative behavior and then

decide how to proceed.

  I wish her all the best.  It is an energy drain to be a mom of these

types of children.

Roxanne



Roxanne J. Brown

Elemental Clay

http://www.cloudnet.com/~elemclay/

"One does not learn by speaking"



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Request info on grapeseed extract and super-hyperactive children

From: HerbalSW@aol.com

Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:03:51 EST

--------

Roxanne:

You may also want to look at flower essences as another method to help you 

kids deal with the issues which are affecting them...

I have seen remarkable responses to many of my clients who were otherwise 

"unresponsive" or written off as trouble makers or soon-to-be delinquents



Catherine M. Wood, LCSW, CADC, ADS

Eagle Spirit Healing Center

Where Your Spirit Learns To Soar

www.eaglespirithealingcenter.com

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Request info on grapeseed extract and super-hyperactive

	children

From: elementalclay@webtv.net (Roxanne Brown)

Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2002 10:48:40 -0600 (CST)

--------

Catherine,

  Thank you for your kind words and I do use flower essenes in the

house.  Without bragging, once these energy vampire children got into

their teens they are the best kids ever.  No trouble and on the honor

roll, math league, speech, drama, sports.  They got busy with school

activities of their choice.

  I think a lot of children that are labeled with ADHD etc. are very

intelligent and whereas half a century ago they were building real tree

houses that involved using energy, today they are building virtual tree

houses.

  I hope this makes sense as I am trying to relay a theory on mind and

body connection.  Very active children need things that challenge their

minds and keep them busy at the same time.

  I wish I had the internet years ago as many of the home school sites

have great ideas and wonderful activities

Roxanne



Roxanne J. Brown

Elemental Clay

http://www.cloudnet.com/~elemclay/

"One does not learn by speaking"



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [herb] Re: AOL 6.0 users/testing

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2002 06:00:45 -0500 (EST)

--------

> For the last several months I've been using AOL 6.0 and have had trouble

> sending messages. Unless AOL 5.0 is used, there seems to be one

> problem after another.



> However, an AOL technician provided this tip ..that is setting the text to 

> "normal". This needs to be done for each post and can't be set automatically, 

> according  to the technician. If this posts my message without unecessary 

> lines, I'll use it more often.



> Also, another method is to use the AOL web site (www.aol.com). 



> I have a CD containing AOL 7.0 ..does anyone know if they eliminated

> the problems with the new version?



> Elliot



AOL 6.0 makes it awful tricky to send one-part plain-text messages, and as the

AOL technician told you, you have to apply the fix every time for every message,

no way to save the settings.  AOL 5 was more manageable.  I am also on IDMA

aromatherapy list, and there are a number of AOLers.  Occasionally I see a

MIME-free post showing AOL 7 in the headers, so apparently it can be done.  You

should have asked the technician.  I'm inclined to say AOL 7 is no worse than 6,

so there is nothing to lose by replacing AOL 6 with 7 on that computer.  I even

received an unsolicited AOL 7 CD mailed in a metal container, think AOL is again

carpet-bombing everybody with AOL CDs.  But I won't be able to run AOL 7 to test

for you.



You could set up a free email account on mail.yahoo.com or www.gmx.net, where

you get POP3 access, and email a test message from AOL to your free-email

account, if you know a way to view a downloaded message in raw-text form under

MS-Windows.

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Request info on grapeseed extract and

 super-hyperactive  children

From: Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net>

Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2002 09:49:10 -0700

--------

The thing with grapeseed extract combo = bioflavinoids-quercetin 

,procyanadins so a supplement is fine but diet should be addressed- 

these things can be had in greater quantity more cheaply through 

diet. veggies like broccoli, onions, garlic, greens, fruits(anything 

in the rose family) they act as anti-oxidants as well as helping to 

support connective tissue. use olive oil because of  no arachidonic 

acid  formation- which is an irritant. fish. small frequent meals. 

should probably keep a diet/activity diary for a week or 2 and see if 

there are any correlations

herbs for a hyper kid- lemon balm, chamomile tea

   ( b vitamins for mom)

good consistent limits,(danger rant) lots of kids I see who's parents 

think they are hyper just need their parents to toe up. kids will be 

kids and testing limits can be a common occurrence finding a balance 

takes a lot of work on the parents part. I will see a mom or dad tell 

a kid no, don't ... then the kid may stop for a minute then start 

again this time they may get a mini lecture, turn around and do it 

again this time parent is mad and either acts mad or ignores the 

behavior. At our home school group we have one kid who's mom

would rather think that he might have some form of exotic autism than 

to alter her parenting behavior- her older boy hits and is mean to 

his younger sibling and is now doing this to the other kids in the 

group. she will say now don't do that, then moves to that's not nice 

your hurting (who ever) then she says now i just don't know what to 

do. for this kid he knows that he is hurting others he needs to be 

prevented from doing so- teach him limits  stop the hitting right 

now- you have a time out and perhaps he may even need to be left with 

grandma for a park day or 2 so that he misses out on what he wants to 

do and knows that mom and others are serious about not allowing him 

to hit or act-out in other ways.

Sharon in Tucson





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: super-hyperactive children

From: Vera Gillen <Vgillen@mb.sympatico.ca>

Date: Thu, 07 Mar 2002 13:15:55 -0600

--------

Hi Luna,

This seems to be a problem for a lot of parents these days.  I am not

a specialist in alternative healing but am learning a lot thru this list

and anything else I can get my hands on.  But I am an experienced

mother, and have had this problem solved by removing dairy

products totally.  It works almost immediately. To understand why, I

can recommend the book "The Yeast Connection" (can't remember the

author).  

Hope that helps...Vera

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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Re: super-hyperactive children

From: "Aliceann or Scott" <carlton@midrivers.com>

Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 09:56:19 -0700

--------

While there are some children and adults sensitive to dairy, these products

often are unnecessarily removed from the diet because of lack of taking them

correctly.  Two hallmark trouble spots are drinking cold milk and drinking

or using milk with genetic or hormone contaminants as well as food

additives, antibiotics and such.  The time of day dairy is used as well as

what spices and herbs are used with them are also very important to their

acceptance and absorption in the digestive system.



In Ayurveda where dairy products are revered as medicinal and nutritional

healing agents, there are several protocols of how to use these products

with herbs for health and balance.  There is one protocol for treating liver

damage with an exclusive milk diet for a couple of months with additional

herbs such as turmeric heated with it and taken in 2 oz amounts several

times a day.



Milk should not be used upon arising or during periods of kapha excess (or

phlem and congestion) in general.  Quantities should be limited to 6 to 8

oz.  For those who have trouble digesting milk, buttermilk is a good choice.



For children, milk is one lifegiving source of survival in the world...  The

proteins can be irritants if not broken down and the fats can be hard to

digest if there isn't digestive agni enough to process them.



I'm not sure what a "super-hyperactive child is" although I have seen and

treated hundreds of children in  mental health  and home settings over the

years.  There are many reasons for impulsive, aggressive, can't sit still,

can't stay out of trouble youngsters; diet is among these as most of us

discover.



Whenever I see a child referred to me as "hyper", I first look at their

shoes.  If the shoes show no signs of being outside, climbing trees, jungle

gyms, wading in muck and puddles, then I ask how new they are...and the

response better be "We bought them yesterday"   Children learn and grow

through constant physical activity,.  If their shoes are like new, they are

sitting quietly too much. The constant activity is wearing on parents, but

necessary for developing the mind.



As an aside, for those parents who keep a set of "like new" clothes for

medical appointments....please don't, as we look to the "real" child in

assessment and treatment.  Noise, scuffed shoes, worn knees and elbows and

some calluses and ground in dirt are signs of a busy and growing child.



Here's to adventures in the Hundred Acre Wood,

Aliceann



----- Original Message -----

From: Vera Gillen



Subject: [Herb] Re: super-hyperactive children





.  But I am an experienced

mother, and have had this problem solved by removing dairy

products totally.



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Re: super-hyperactive children

From: HerbalSW@aol.com

Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 12:49:09 EST

--------

Aliceann:

Thanks for the insight.  I have a highly active child and am relieved to see 

that her bumps, bruises, scuffed up shoes, and dirty clothes are a good 

thing. Sometimes I see children who are so quiet that I can't help but 

compare and want my daughter to calm down.  She is polite, well mannered but 

INCREDIBLY ACTIVE

Catherine



Catherine M. Wood, LCSW, CADC, ADS

Eagle Spirit Healing Center

Where Your Spirit Learns To Soar

www.eaglespirithealingcenter.com

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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Lobelia

From: "rochelle" <rochelle@ntlworld.com>

Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2002 21:40:37 -0000

--------

HT = Herbal Tincture and it has nothing added.  Interesting about the green

tea. can you tell us more?

Regards,

Rochelle

---------------------------------

What is HT?  I think Ventolin is albuterol, and Atrovent is ipratropium

bromide.  Is lobelia only for a mild asthma attack?  Is this tincture just

lobelia and ethanol, or is something added to improve the taste?  I've used

mixed herbal brews containing lobelia, and for more than just mild wheezing,

but once I started with green tea, I had practically no further use for

lobelia.  I don't know what you mean by tonic, but think lobelia is for

relief of symptoms, rather than improving the general condition.



www.rochellemarsden.co.uk





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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] question

From: "John" <jfoster1@cableone.net>

Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2002 23:53:31 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by "jfoster" <jfoster1@cableone.net> :



If I change e-mail addresses do i need to unsub then resub. I did look at

the text I got when joining but did not see any info on changing e-mail

addresses.

Thanks







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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] ADMIN: changing email address

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Fri, 08 Mar 2002 09:10:28 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Henriette Kress" <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"John" <jfoster1@cableone.net> wrote to herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu:



> If I change e-mail addresses do i need to unsub then resub. I did look at

> the text I got when joining but did not see any info on changing e-mail

> addresses.



Yes, if you unsub you HAVE to do that, UNLESS you go to the website for the list

(Lyris).

For the mailman list you HAVE to unsub/resub, there's no possibility to change

email address on the web page.



This kind of question should go to the listowner, NOT to the list. Mumble

grumble razzin frazzin...



Henriette, listowner.



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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Equiseteum arv.( sm.horsetail)

From: Christa-Maria <cmaria@triton.net>

Date: Sat, 09 Mar 2002 08:32:47 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Christa-Maria" <cmaria@triton.net> :



Hallo, mumble, grumble, frazzled Henriette...:)

On Febr.2nd I broke my hip, had surgery with screws, plates etc. and am

now recovering.

Also have to figure out how to improve and more importantly reverse my

osteoporosis.

I really want to prove something here to the medical establishment and

feel that I have the most perfect opportunity to do so.

The formula I take is from David Winston, a very good herbalist. It

contains equiseteum arv., Alfafa, nettles and bullkelp. I take 3 'oo'

capsules a day.

After 3 weeks I can see a remarkable improvement in my nails and hope

that it translates into improvement for my bones to heal.

My question is about the equiseteum arv.This is the springtime, very

small picked small plant and my research on it is very confusing.

From toxitity when taken at 10 days to enzyme interference, I've read it

all ( maybe I just should not have done that and just trust David

Winston) but I am too curious of a person.

I know David has a lab and is a top herbalist and it's not so much doubt

into his knowledge as that I do not like what I've read so far every

where else on the long-term use of equiseteum.

Mind you, there are different species of  horsetail and I am not

familiar with all their chemical compositions.

Equis.arv. is wonderful to stop bleeding , internally and externally and

I have never hesitated to use it for that.

My health overall is not bad, lungs somewhat impaired from 58 years of

asthma and a electrical heart condition from childhood diphtheria that

translates into syncope and very low blood reassure with some

arrhythmia.

My wound has healed exceptionally well, using rosehip with helichrysum ,

my bedsores and open sores from sheets in the hospital that had been

laundered in chlorine all have healed and my mobility improves every

day, sometimes to slow for my impatient soul, but well.

I am battling a rash that seems to be fungal in origin, but a jewelweed

tincture is taking hold and not just giving me a break from itching ,

but also is beginning to recede.

My case right now has the perfect opportunity to show the allopathic

community that herbs can do something ( they already are impressed how

I  healed my sores etc.) and I am very blessed to have a surgeon and

Doctor that is willing to work with me.

I do not know how to contact David Winston personally. If anyone has a

connection to him, I very much would like to talk to him.

Any good scientifically input on the longterm use of equiseteum arv.

would be appreciated.

C-M









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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] pinus mantima and pinus pinaster

From: HerbalSW@aol.com

Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 10:33:43 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Catherine M. Wood" <HerbalSW@aol.com> :



I am looking for information regarding the medicinal properties of these herbs

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Catherine





Catherine M. Wood, LCSW, CADC, ADS

Eagle Spirit Healing Center

Where Your Spirit Learns To Soar

www.eaglespirithealingcenter.com



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [herb] pinus mantima and pinus pinaster

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 00:26:02 +0200

--------

HerbalSW@aol.com wrote to herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu:



> I am looking for information regarding the medicinal properties of these herbs

> Any help would be greatly appreciated.



You mean Pinus maritima. That's the one they use to make pycnogenol, which is

not a herbal product; it's a supplement.



Other than that? _All_ species of the nontoxic Northern conifer group (Pinus

sp., Picea sp., Abies sp., and nontoxic Juniper sp.) can be used for things like

cough syrups, or to sweat you, or as diuretics.



However, they _all_ contain resins - and those irritate your kidneys. So if you

have or have had kidney troubles, you only have one kidney, you're pregnant,

don't. It's the "don't flog a tired horse" thingy - it might die on you, eh?



Cheers

Henriette



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To: "Herb@Lists. Ibiblio. Org" <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] EJHM

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 10:34:38 -0600

--------

Is the EJHM still active? I'm considering buying a subscription, but in

looking at the website, it looks like the last issue on the website archives

doesn't seem very current.



Kerry





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] EJHM

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 00:33:23 +0200

--------

"Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com> wrote:



> Is the EJHM still active? I'm considering buying a subscription, but in

> looking at the website, 



This one: http://www.ejhm.co.uk/ ? It mentions the Dec01 issue.



> it looks like the last issue on the website archives

> doesn't seem very current.



They were aiming for 3 issues a year, and kept that for rather long, but are now

selling subscription by the volume instead. One volume still being 3 issues.



I've sort of promised an article on Epilobium and one on Leucanthemum /Bidens

/Capsella for an issue in the not too far future; I guess I should go to work on

those now, rather than later.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] EJHM

From: "gcwhite" <gcwhite@ntlworld.com>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 09:55:14 -0000

--------





> Is the EJHM still active? I'm considering buying a subscription, but in

> looking at the website, it looks like the last issue on the website

archives

> doesn't seem very current.



> Kerry



The EJHM is currently undergoing a change of editor.  There has just been a

special issue edited by Nigel Wynn, and it is intended to get back to the

regular 3 issues per volume under the new editor (whose name I can't

remember at present).  It was intended to go to 3 issues per year, but I

don't think there were enough articles coming in to make that possible.



Cheers



Graham White  B.Sc. (Herb. Med.), MNIMH.

Medical Herbalist

Bishop's Stortford & Buntingford

--------------------------------------------------------------------



gcwhite@ntlworld.com



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To: "Herb@Lists. Ibiblio. Org" <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Tabebuia water soluble?

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 12:02:50 -0600

--------

I'm doing some reading on Tabebuia (lapacho, pau d'arco) and its use in

treating chronic candidiasis. It's a popular remedy and is usually

recommended to take as a tea/decoction. However, I recall reading somewhere

that the active constituents are not water soluble; thus, a tea would be

useless and it should be taken as a tincture in order for it to be effective

against candida. Active constituents are naphthaquinones - these are

alkaloids, right? And am I correct in saying that, in general, most

alkaloids are not very water soluble?



Kerry





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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Tabebuia water soluble?

From: "Aliceann or Scott" <carlton@midrivers.com>

Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 14:59:42 -0700

--------

This concept of tinctures is a puzzle to me...perhaps because I am

unappreciative of them being an anciet grass stem chewer from childhood.



It seems to me that the human body is a pretty remarkable chemical factory.

Now it isn't as good at extracting some constituents from plant and animal

sources as some other species...but all the same you'd pay a lot of money to

reproduce the chemistry set, analysis and conversion process the body

accomplishes 24 hours a day for a lifetime.



 I understand preserving some herbs as tinctures but I don't quite get

assuming that the herbs are not able to be processed at all if in water or

in dry condition they are unchanged.  The point of the media of

intake...whether water, food, milk, oil, alcohol, dried, macerated, crushed,

or "as is as grows" is to assist  the herb to tissues and systems where it

needs to be most effective....which sometimes is but usually isn't the site

of injury or disorder.   Alcohol speaks to the air and ether qualities of

life; and as such can assist with quick absorption which is

nice....sometimes, but not so nice when the need is based in the deeper

tissues, bones etc. where it is more desireable to have the material pass

further through the gut rather than to be quickly absorbed into the blood

system.



With an herb like pau d'arco which might "hold on" to it's constituents in

water....the assumption can't be made that it continues to do so in solution

in the mouth, stomach, small intestine, large intestine, liver, kidneys,

blood etc.  In the case of this herb, does it pass through the body system

unchanged from mouth through excretia?



 In my view, this weirdness to "extract" is a prime reason we get into

trouble with herbal treatment.  A prime exampleis the worry over Kava.  If

you chew a piece (a small piece) you will quickly notice its initial local

effects, and then later it's systemic effects....saliva has amazing

chemistry in it.



I do not believe it holds true that one needs a certain significant dose of

and herb more than a few leaves or a piece of stem or root's worth to effect

benefit..assuming the herb is correctly gathered, preserved, and honored.



If the body has zero effect on on an herb during ingestion or application,

is it of benefit to alter it's properties to extract components without

their "jackets"?  This is not to say tinctures and alcohol extractions are

of no benefit; they certainly are, but it seems for many folks it is the

preferred doctine of use.   I'd appreciate any comments about this from

those in the phytochemistry and physiology front....as well as from those

who do a lot of extracting in alcohol.



Thanks,

Aliceann



----- Original Message -----

From: Kerry & Jack

To: Herb@Lists. Ibiblio. Org

Sent: Saturday, March 09, 2002 11:02 AM

Subject: [Herb] Tabebuia water soluble?





I'm doing some reading on Tabebuia (lapacho, pau d'arco) and its use in

treating chronic candidiasis. It's a popular remedy and is usually

recommended to take as a tea/decoction. However, I recall reading somewhere

that the active constituents are not water soluble; thus, a tea would be

useless and it should be taken as a tincture in order for it to be effective

against candida.



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Tabebuia water soluble?

From: Jim Lamplugh <thingandjim@wnm.net>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 01:38:16 -0600

--------

You are suggesting, then, that you would need to consume the herb -- i.e., 

eat the herb itself in order to receive the benefit?  I mention this only 

because if this is the case, than presumably teas would be of no more 

particular benefit than tinctures.  Then again, given the opportunity to 

use an edible herb in a form that allows me to consume it, I will often do 

so.



I guess sometimes I neglect the obvious -- before there were capsules of 

herb, there were tinctures and teas.  Before both of these, though, there 

was the herb itself.



Jim



At 02:59 PM 3/9/02 -0700, you wrote:



>This concept of tinctures is a puzzle to me...perhaps because I am

>unappreciative of them being an anciet grass stem chewer from childhood.

--------



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Tabebuia water soluble?

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 09:51:42 +0200

--------

"Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com> wrote to <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>:



> I'm doing some reading on Tabebuia (lapacho, pau d'arco) and its use in

> treating chronic candidiasis. It's a popular remedy and is usually

> recommended to take as a tea/decoction. However, I recall reading somewhere

> that the active constituents are not water soluble; thus, a tea would be

> useless and it should be taken as a tincture in order for it to be effective

> against candida. 



Nope, it's a tea herb. It's just about as effective as desert willow (Chilopsis)

and as fireweed (Epilobium angustifolium). Tea herbs, the lot, especially for

candida, where alcohol can be problematic on two counts: 1. fast energy for the

yeast, 2. yeast-made product which you might just have become extremely

sensitive to, adding to your troubles.



> Active constituents are naphthaquinones - these are

> alkaloids, right? And am I correct in saying that, in general, most

> alkaloids are not very water soluble?



Glycosides, are they not, the quinones? Water soluble, oil soluble, alcohol

soluble, depends. Think senna tea, or uva ursi tea. Or Rhamnus bark tea and

tincture. Or oil of bitter almond, with all its cyanoglycosides. Or tea or

tincture of hawthorne.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Tabebuia water soluble?

From: Jim <waldpond@interbaun.com>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 18:56:54 -0700

--------

At 12:01 PM 03/11/2002 -0500, Jim wrote: 

>

> I guess sometimes I neglect the obvious -- before there were capsules of 

> herb, there were tinctures and teas. Before both of these, though, there 

> was the herb itself. 





Yes, but even chimpazees know which herbs to just "mouth" and swallow whole,

and which ones to chew up well.  IMO external extraction methods (like teas,

etc.) are a major boon to herbalists:  the major purpose is to try and separate

the components that are wanted from the ones that aren't.  And IMO that is why

cooking times are important, and getting the public to swallow whole herbs is a

major step backwards.  If you don't believe this, try some tests.   



For example, take a good quality organic green tea, steep it at the "ideal"

temperature (many are in the 75 C to 85 C range) for the "ideal" time (often in

the 2.5 to 4 minute area) (both depend on the tea), and prepare another cup by

boiling it for an hour.  Taste.   When it is chewed and swallowed whole, the

extraction probably is closer to the latter cup than the former.



Cooks understand extraction processes and changes from heating etc. very well. 

That is why black mustard seed is popped in hot oil when it is used as a

culinary herb in Indian dishes.



Jim (a different one  :)







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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Tabebuia water soluble?

From: "Aliceann or Scott" <carlton@midrivers.com>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 23:22:26 -0700

--------

Your points are well made about the use of different methods to make an

herb's benefits more available to us, Jim....but the fact remains that

before there were herbal formulations and extracts...there were the herbs

themselves.  It is, in the end, the nature of the herb and it's interaction

with the nature of the user that truly commingle..that does not require

"taking, consuming, or applying" the herb at all....  Have you ever noticed

that in preparing herbs for use, you will notice body and mental changes as

you handle it?  For example....crushing neem leaves will create a bitter

taste in the mouth even if there is no contact hand to mouth and no

paticular deep breathing of it.  Similarly, in making up capsules of

turmeric....I often find myself "drying up".. and becoming warm from it's

fairly mild heat and vulnerary qualities. On the plus side, incidendal aches

and pains disappear.  Some of the effect of course is from handling the

herbs...olfactory, skin and visual senses are adept.



Any intentional change of an herb...such as heating mustard seeds in oil

before use....must be done with understanding of the herb itself not just

because that's how one gets the "effect" in my experience.



So, we probably all know this but sometimes get caught up in the

extractions, decoctions, pastes and constituents to the slighting of the

herb which exists not for us but because it exists...as Henriette has

mentioned on several occasions.



Best Regards,

Aliceann



----- Original Message -----

From: Jim

Subject: Re: [Herb] Tabebuia water soluble?





At 12:01 PM 03/11/2002 -0500, Jim wrote:

>

> I guess sometimes I neglect the obvious -- before there were capsules of

> herb, there were tinctures and teas. Before both of these, though, there

> was the herb itself.



And another Jim responded---- SNIP---



...  and getting the public to swallow whole herbs is a

major step backwards.



  Taste.   When it is chewed and swallowed whole, the

extraction probably is closer to the latter cup than the former.



That is why black mustard seed is popped in hot oil when it is used as a

culinary herb in Indian dishes.



Jim (a different one  :)











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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: essiac herbs

From: "Lynn Kelly, DC" <drkelly@icdc.com>

Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 17:13:12 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Lynn Kelly, DC" <drkelly@icdc.com> :



Have been researching essiac herbs and formulae.  Anyone have good

information on ingredients?  4 or 8 herbs?  recipes?



Have the info from Penn Herbal on the above but they got their information

from the videotape that was sold a few years ago by a chiropractor.  Some

sources say it is not the correct recipe.  Any feedback from anyone on this?

My very dear friend has cancer and I'd like to make the tea for her.  Thank

you.  Lynn Kelly, DC





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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: essiac herbs

From: Mewsmuse@aol.com

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 08:54:30 EST

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Susanne Mills" <mewsmuse@aol.com> :



I have this in my files.  Hope it helps you.

http://essiac-info.org/recipe1.html



Susanne



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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Equiseteum arv.( sm.horsetail)

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 00:22:25 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Henriette Kress" <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



Christa-Maria <cmaria@triton.net> wrote to herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu:



> The formula I take is from David Winston, a very good herbalist. It

> contains equiseteum arv., Alfafa, nettles and bullkelp. I take 3 'oo'

> capsules a day.



The minerals are far more bioavailable as a tea, but shrug:



> After 3 weeks I can see a remarkable improvement in my nails and hope

> that it translates into improvement for my bones to heal.



...if it works, it works.



> My question is about the equiseteum arv.This is the springtime, very

> small picked small plant and my research on it is very confusing.

> From toxitity when taken at 10 days to enzyme interference, I've read it

> all ( maybe I just should not have done that and just trust David

> Winston) but I am too curious of a person.



Over here most horsetails are considered more or less toxic - _except_ for E.

arvense. Which is why it's so important for people, over here, to learn the

difference between E. arvense and E. pratense; E. pratense being considered the

"most toxic" one - it had most nicotine in one or the other test.



Now, there's a problem with that nicotine. Equisetums do contain that if they

grow in too rich a muck, ie. the ditch right downstream from the swinery or

suchlike (except for E. arvense? I'm not sure, though.).



Long-term use of E. arvense is not problematic - if it _is_ E. arvense. I can't

say anything about any of the other Equisetums; I don't use them. Over in the US

it's "horsetail is horsetail, why would you want to know the species?"



> I am battling a rash that seems to be fungal in origin, but a jewelweed

> tincture is taking hold and not just giving me a break from itching ,

> but also is beginning to recede.



For "easy" fungi (ie. not toenail fungus) I do Thuja salve. You might want to

help your immune system, too, it should have averted that fungus on its own.



> I do not know how to contact David Winston personally. If anyone has a

> connection to him, I very much would like to talk to him.



You want his email address? Email me privately.



> Any good scientifically input on the longterm use of equiseteum arv.

> would be appreciated.



Scientific, well, that's different. I'm all anecdotal. Somebody else?



Cheers

Henriette



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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Equiseteum arv.( sm.horsetail)

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Sat, 09 Mar 2002 19:53:50 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by "May Terry" <mterry@snet.net> :



Henriette Kress wrote:



> > I am battling a rash that seems to be fungal in origin, but a jewelweed

> > tincture is taking hold and not just giving me a break from itching ,

> > but also is beginning to recede.



I haven't heard of jewelweed being used for this--where did you hear about it?  Sure

works great on poison ivy, though.



> For "easy" fungi (ie. not toenail fungus) I do Thuja salve. You might want to

> help your immune system, too, it should have averted that fungus on its own.



Henriette, do you use thuja essential oil?  Or prepare fresh herb in oil?



Thanks,

May





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [herb] Re: Equiseteum arv.( sm.horsetail)

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 09:37:22 +0200

--------

May Terry <mterry@snet.net> wrote to herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu:



> > For "easy" fungi (ie. not toenail fungus) I do Thuja salve. You might want to

> > help your immune system, too, it should have averted that fungus on its own.

> 

> Henriette, do you use thuja essential oil?  Or prepare fresh herb in oil?



Thuja or Cypress, infused oil, from the dried green parts.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Equiseteum arv.( sm.horsetail)

From: "Phosphor" <phosphor@hotkey.net.au>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 08:28:43 +0300

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Phosphor" <phosphor@hotkey.net.au> :



re horsetail:



  > The minerals are far more bioavailable as a tea, but shrug:



I understood that the silica is poorly extracted through tea; an alcoholic

tincture is much better. is this correct?



andrew







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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [herb] Re: Equiseteum arv.( sm.horsetail)

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 00:47:59 +0200

--------

"Phosphor" <phosphor@hotkey.net.au> wrote to herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu:



> re horsetail:

>   > The minerals are far more bioavailable as a tea, but shrug:

> I understood that the silica is poorly extracted through tea; an alcoholic

> tincture is much better. is this correct?



Sounds fishy. Herbs like horsetail, green oat straw and comfrey have been used

for their silica content for ages, as teas, not tinctures. Alcohol isn't likely

to draw too much out. I could be wrong, but the idea of an alcohol tincture for

minerals _feels_ off. 

Vinegar is better at minerals than alcohol, so if you want an easy way to use

mineral herbs, do vinegars. Apple cider vinegar being the best for this, white

wine vinegar second best; red, well, if you _want_ to, go ahead.



Anyway, mineral availability in general, in tea, from Equisetum depends on the

age of the plants:



Pick'em in early summer, you get lots of minerals in your tea. 

Pick'em late in autumn, you have to boil your herb for quite a while before you

get anything out. Me, I pick them the minute they're full grown; it's one of the

early summer things to do, enjoying sunshine, and birds, and the first few

butterflies, and things like that.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [herb] Re: Equiseteum arv.( sm.horsetail)

From: "Niamh" <niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 00:01:05 -0000

--------

> Sounds fishy. Herbs like horsetail, green oat straw and comfrey have been

used

> for their silica content for ages, as teas, not tinctures. Alcohol isn't

likely

> to draw too much out. I could be wrong, but the idea of an alcohol

tincture for

> minerals _feels_ off.



That's true, silica is water sol. One way of extracting it from Equisetum is

by infusing it in a thermos overnight. I have taken it as a normal infusion

as part of a blend with alfalfa and the usual suspects and find that just

brill, I don't put it down to just silica or just any thing else and have

been trying get my head round these "mineral herbs" and how it is they can

be so marvellous when all the scientists say the mineral content is

negligable (Ca, e.g.) Anyone got any theories?



Schoenberger do a juice (nci). Equisetum is cautioned in cases of renal

disease as the silica can be harsh on the kidneys. Have a break every 6

weeks for 2 if you are worried. Did you know it has quite a rep as a lung

strengthener too, to restore any damage to the tissues? Could be useful with

your history of asthma.



Good luck with your mending,

Namh





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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [herb] Re: Equiseteum arv.( sm.horsetail)

From: "Phosphor" <phosphor@hotkey.net.au>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 09:47:14 +0300

--------

 I don't put it down to just silica or just any thing else and have

> been trying get my head round these "mineral herbs" and how it is they can

> be so marvellous when all the scientists say the mineral content is

> negligable (Ca, e.g.) Anyone got any theories?



more gems of wisdom from the north!



which other herbs do u regard as 'mineral' herbs?



one way to consider herbs is as alchemical factories for 'enlivening'

inanimate minerals.



andrew







herb



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [herb] Re: Equiseteum arv.( sm.horsetail)

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 09:55:44 +0200

--------

"Phosphor" <phosphor@hotkey.net.au> wrote to <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>:



> > I don't put it down to just silica or just any thing else and have

> > been trying get my head round these "mineral herbs" and how it is they can

> > be so marvellous when all the scientists say the mineral content is

> > negligable (Ca, e.g.) Anyone got any theories?



Perhaps they're in a form we can easily use? Having grown up with them, so to

speak.



> which other herbs do u regard as 'mineral' herbs?



Nettles, Alchemilla leaf, red raspberry leaf, green oat straw, Ephedra, alfalfa,

Equisetum ... 



... lots. Add things like Zea leaf and Helianthus leaf (sunflower, Jer.

artichoke) to that list, too, they also contain lots of minerals. 



High in silica: Equisetum, oat straw, Helianthus, in addition to comfrey which

shouldn't be used as it unfortunately is also high in hepatotoxic PAs.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [herb] Re: Equiseteum arv.( sm.horsetail)

From: "Phosphor" <phosphor@hotkey.net.au>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 08:56:23 +0300

--------



  > Anyway, mineral availability in general, in tea, from Equisetum depends

on the

> age of the plants....[etc]..



brilliant [as always]. may i ask further



1 is it traditional in the northern climes to process horsetail with

vinegar?



2. how widespread is horsetail up there? does  it grow from russia to

scotland and everyhwere in between?



3. does it have more than anecdotal indication for tuberculosis?





thanks :)

andrew













listinfo/herb



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [herb] Re: Equiseteum arv.( sm.horsetail)

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 01:21:46 +0200

--------

"Phosphor" <phosphor@hotkey.net.au> wrote to <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>:



> > Anyway, mineral availability in general, in tea, from Equisetum depends on the

> > age of the plants....[etc]..

> 

> brilliant [as always]. may i ask further

> 

> 1 is it traditional in the northern climes to process horsetail with

> vinegar?



Nah, we do them as teas, here. Now where have I seen the vinegar? Hmmm.



> 2. how widespread is horsetail up there? does  it grow from russia to

> scotland and everyhwere in between?



It's pretty much everywhere. It's got spores, and needs acid soil, so if you dig

it up (30 cm (1') down, a mat of roots, 30 cm further down, another mat of

roots, 30 cm further down etc. up to 2 m (7')... lots of work) it'll be back the

minute a spore lands, unless you also add lime to your soil.



There's lots of species, here, and most are pretty, but the prettiest of them

all is the one that's found in dediduous forests: Equisetum pratense. 



Woops. Error in a previous post: the horsetail that's considered to be most

toxic is E. palustre, not E. pratense. 



Not that we have too many deciduous forests, except for birch forests, and those

don't count.



> 3. does it have more than anecdotal indication for tuberculosis?



I've seen that one elsewhere, too, but not too often. Sure, go ahead, but don't

depend on Equisetum to do all the work there. A better herb to help fight tb

would be Cetraria islandica; a couple herbalist friends over in the UK use it

for that, as a very low EtOH tincture (did they make it 25 % 1:4? Perhaps.

Cetraria, even if "fresh", is of course "fresh" only right after a rain; at any

other time it's dried.)



And even Cetraria isn't enough, the antibiotics are a must in any case.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [herb] Re: Equiseteum arv.( sm.horsetail)

From: Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 09:02:31 +0100

--------

Silica is definetively more bioavailable in water, in facts it changes from

purely elemental to colloidal which helps the availability.  Since reading

this in Mills' out of the earth some years ago, i've used decoctions with

sugar to enhance extraction, and had good results compared to normal

decoctions/infusions. either that or lowering the pH with vinegar.



cheers

Marco 

-- 

Marco Valussi BSc (Hons.) Herbal Medicine

Medical Herbalist

Vicolo Santa Cecilia 7

37121 Verona

Italy



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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Equiseteum arv.( sm.horsetail)

From: greg patch <patch@berkshire.net>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 13:41:09 -0500 (EST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Greg Patch" <patch@berkshire.net> :





>Now, there's a problem with that nicotine. Equisetums do contain that if they

>grow in too rich a muck, ie. the ditch right downstream from the swinery or

>suchlike (except for E. arvense? I'm not sure, though.).



Henriette do you feel the toxins from lands have the plant producing more

nicotine as a self protective action?

The warning here in NE US comes also with arvense. What's been said is that

it draws in and holds the toxins from chemically (farm) treated lands.

Locally we have two Horsetails. E arvense and E hyemale, unaffectionally

called "scouring rush, or, Giant Horsetail. It is a single stemmed

prehistoric looking plant with "stronger" characteristics.

Does anyone have a scientific source for whole plant Horsetail destroying

Thiamine?



Regards,

Greg









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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] toenail fungus

From: "Lynn Kelly, DC" <drkelly@icdc.com>

Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 18:17:57 -0500

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Lynn Kelly, DC" <drkelly@icdc.com> :



It isn't an "easy" fungus; it's more like yellow death.  Broke my toe when

it bent backward years ago and the fungus set in and never left.  Used all

kinds of allopathic concoctions.  Nothing works.  Deep circulation to the

toe is probably damaged.



Know any herbs to help?  Thank you.       Lynn Kelly, DC



"Don't let your spine get on your nerves."

http://members.aol.com/starchiro/starchiro.html





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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] toenail fungus

From: Debbie <lullwater@airmail.net>

Date: Sat, 09 Mar 2002 22:52:03 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Debbie McDonald" <lullwater@airmail.net> :



I went to an organic gardening show and our local organics guy(on the

radio) has a post on his web page about soaking your feet in corn meal.

Swears it works. Check it out

http://www.dirtdoctor.com



Mine went away when I rid my diet of all gluten grains, sugar, potatoes,

rice, most carbs other than veggies:).



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [herb] toenail fungus

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 09:41:28 +0200

--------

"Lynn Kelly, DC" <drkelly@icdc.com> wrote to herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu:



> It isn't an "easy" fungus; it's more like yellow death.  Broke my toe when

> it bent backward years ago and the fungus set in and never left.  Used all

> kinds of allopathic concoctions.  Nothing works.  Deep circulation to the

> toe is probably damaged.

> 

> Know any herbs to help?  Thank you.       Lynn Kelly, DC



Either do the chemicals,



or file your toenail(s) waaaay thinner than they are now, and use tea tree

essential oil, religiously, daily (or twice daily), a drop or two on each

affected nail, for a year or so. Tea tree EO is not very nice; it's turpentine,

it smells like h*ll, and I don't like it for everyday use, but there are few

other things you can do with ingrown toenail fungi. Remember to keep filing your

nails thinner, too; the EO can't reach the fungus through thick nails.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [herb] toenail fungus

From: Roses9652@aol.com

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 20:28:48 EST

--------

When you say "file down the nail" so it is thin, are you suggesting using a 

regular nail file..and how thin?  My toenails are quite thick now...and 

almost dark under the nail in some areas; along with the yellow.  



Also, is there something I can use for my feet to prevent odor problems?  In 

the past year or two, I've noticed it more and more; but never had it before. 

 I shower or bathe daily; so don't know why the problem.  



Thank you.



R. Hayward

--------

<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT  SIZE=2 FAMILY="SCRIPT" FACE="Comic Sans MS" LANG="0">When you say "file down the nail" so it is thin, are you suggesting using a regular nail file..and how thin? &nbsp;My toenails are quite thick now...and almost dark under the nail in some areas; along with the yellow. &nbsp;

<BR>

<BR>Also, is there something I can use for my feet to prevent odor problems? &nbsp;In the past year or two, I've noticed it more and more; but never had it before. &nbsp;I shower or bathe daily; so don't know why the problem. &nbsp;

<BR>

<BR>Thank you.

<BR>

<BR>R. Hayward</FONT></HTML>





==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [herb] toenail fungus

From: "TeraGram" <teragram@silcom.com>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 08:49:56 -0800

--------

R. Hayward asked:



Also, is there something I can use for my feet to prevent odor problems?  In

the past year or two, I've noticed it more and more; but never had it

before.  I shower or bathe daily; so don't know why the problem.

---------------------------------------------------------------



This isn't herbal, but I'll answer it anyway.



Many times, smelly feet are a two-fold problem



1. sweaty feet

2. bacteria in the footwear



You can do what you can to mitigate the sweat your feet produce, but until

you get the bacteria in your shoes under control, you're still going to have

stinky feet.



One of the easiest ways to kill those nasty bacteria is to put your shoes in

a plastic bag (or two or three) and put them in your freezer at least

overnight.



Also, try to rotate your shoes such that you never wear the same pair two

days in a row.  This will help make sure they dry out completely.  Not only

will you help minimize the bacterial growth, but you'll also make your shoes

last longer.



HTH



- T.





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: RE: [herb] toenail fungus

From: Veronica Honthaas <honthaas@bigsky.net>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 19:42:35 -0700

--------

At 08:49 AM 3/11/02 -0800, you wrote:

>R. Hayward asked:

>

>Also, is there something I can use for my feet to prevent odor problems?  In

>the past year or two, I've noticed it more and more; but never had it

>before.  I shower or bathe daily; so don't know why the problem.

>---------------------------------------------------------------

Being a professional Reflexologist I have run into many smelly feet.My 

suggestions are:

- Check your diet and make sure it agrees with you. Clean it up if necessary.

-Try and soak feet in hot salt water at least one a day (more if needed). 

This will help draw out toxins.

-Each night you will need to scrub feet with a good hard brush and 

soap.  Make sure you scrub every nook and cranny.

- Keep shoes clean or get new ones.

- Stay well hydrated..........lots of good herb teas.



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: RE: [herb] toenail fungus

From: Veronica Honthaas <honthaas@bigsky.net>

Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 12:09:57 -0700

--------

Remember that bacteria can grow more easily in the dead skin on 

feet.  Therefore, it frequently helps if not only wash feet daily but to 

scrub them with a firm brush..........scrub hard.  Scrub the entire foot, 

under the nail, between the toes, etc. It should make a remarkable 

difference. Veronica







>This isn't herbal, but I'll answer it anyway.

>

>Many times, smelly feet are a two-fold problem

>

>1. sweaty feet

>2. bacteria in the footwear





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [herb] toenail fungus

From: Art Carlson <cgreenacres@centurytel.net>

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2002 09:54:28 -0700

--------

     Whenever I have toenail fungus, or foot or underarm body odor 

problems, I treat for Candida. This always clears it up for me.

         Art



>Also, is there something I can use for my feet to prevent odor 

>problems?  In the past year or two, I've noticed it more and more; but 

>never had it before.  I shower or bathe daily; so don't know why the 

>problem.

>Thank you.

>R. Hayward





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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Spring TRs

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 01:30:45 +0200

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Henriette Kress" <hetta@saunalahti.fi> :



"Niamh" <niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk> wrote to herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu:



> I plan to tincture my own spring herbs this year: nettle, chickweed etc. But

> when have they sprung enough? The nettles look nice now, but they are only a

> few weeks old, and should it be later (before flowering) for chickweed?





Use the other list (post to herb@herb@lists.ibiblio.org); I'm closing this one

down pretty soon.





Mumble grumble razzen frazzen ....



... spring. We just had another snowstorm, and you speak of _spring_? Of nettles

being weeks old already?



Grumble.



Nettles aren't really a tincture herb, neither is chickweed. Nettles are big

enough when they're 15-30 cm (1/2-1') high; smaller than that is a waste of

time, really, because they're so very tiny. I chop them up and freeze them, if I

don't eat them right away. I also bind them in bunches, two to a twine, and hang

them on a string strung across a small shady room to dry. That's for tea, for

later on.



Don't wait too long with your nettles, older ones are stringy in the stem (for

wild "spinach") and might contain crystals that could possibly irritate your

kidneys, if your kidneys feel irritable, that is. 



Ie. they don't irritate everybody's kidneys, but some people feel that lower

backache after drinking nettle tea made from older nettles. Use those nettles

for footbaths instead of teas. 



And, same as Equisetum, younger nettles give more minerals to a normal tea.



Chickweed, any time. It grows all the time, the older ones rotting away

underneath. It's easier to clean young ones. Chickweed, to me, is a fresh or

juice plant, not a dried nor a tincture plant. So juice the lot, and pop it into

your freezer tray; once frozen, pop the cubes into a ziplog bag, use one a day

for minerals when you think you need them; ie. when convalescing from, say, the

flu, or an operation, or a broken leg or something.



NOW I'm going to bed. Nighty-night!



Henriette



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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Spring TRs

From: "Niamh" <niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk>

Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 23:45:44 -0000

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Niamh" <Niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk> :



I plan to tincture my own spring herbs this year: nettle, chickweed etc. But

when have they sprung enough? The nettles look nice now, but they are only a

few weeks old, and should it be later (before flowering) for chickweed?



Thanks,

Namh





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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [herb] Re:kidneys

From: "Phosphor" <phosphor@hotkey.net.au>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 12:29:18 +0300

--------



  two queries on kidneys..



1. which herb[s] are regarded as specific for kidney function? ie is there a

kidney equivalent to St Mary's Thistle for liver



2. do the aromatic oils found in spices irritate the kidneys or help them in

counteracting micro-organisms? [or maybe do they do both?]



andrew



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [herb] Re:kidneys

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 10:01:34 +0200

--------

"Phosphor" <phosphor@hotkey.net.au> wrote to <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>:



> 1. which herb[s] are regarded as specific for kidney function? ie is there a

> kidney equivalent to St Mary's Thistle for liver



You can't go wrong with the silk from Zea.



Other than that, there's lots of herbs that help the kidneys, be they "hot"

(dense high acid pee, high bp) or "cool" (watery low acid pee, normal to low

bp). 

A good herbal, perhaps? Or a quick read-through of Michael Moore's "Herbal

energetics" booklet, found on his site under "Herb manuals"?



> 2. do the aromatic oils found in spices irritate the kidneys or help them in

> counteracting micro-organisms?



In spices? Those oils never even see the kidneys; they add digestive force to

the gut, and also help with cramps and gas. Also, the kidneys don't do anything

about micro-organisms, that's the work of the lymph and immune systems.



Cheers

Henriette



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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [herb] Re:kidneys

From: "Phosphor" <phosphor@hotkey.net.au>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 18:30:11 +0300

--------

Also, the kidneys don't do anything

> about micro-organisms, that's the work of the lymph and immune systems.



I was thinking of kidney infection.

also..in the case of chronic renal failure, has anyone on the list treated

this, and of so which herbs?



ta

andrew



/herb



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] adding to Best of the Herbal Forums: Serenoa, Male Pattern Baldness

From: Elfreem@aol.com

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 10:37:46 EST

--------

Linda wrote, back in January 2000 (see Best of the Herbal Forums,

http://www.ibiblio.org/herbmed/archives/Best/HerbalArchives.html):



> What is the best herbal preparations that can be applied to the scalp to 

> aid against hair loss for women. Is there an oral supplement that can be 

> taken for this same purpose? Thanks.



I replied:



> Linda, you may recall that finasteride was used for BPH (benign 

> prostatic hypertrophy) but has since been approved for hair loss. The 

> mechanism of action is inhibition of 5-alpha reductase ..the enzyme 

> that converts testoserone to dihydrotestosterone. Recall also that saw 

> palmetto works in the same fashion and has been shown to be as effective 

> as finasteride for BPH symptoms. Suggestions have been made for its 

> use in hair loss. As far as I know, there are no studies that have shown 

> it to be effective for hair loss, but you might want to give it a try. I 

> wouldn't be surprised if it was as effective as finasteride.

>

> Regards,Elliot Freeman 

> RPh, Managing Editor

> Midwest Shared Newsletter



Karen wrote:



> As far as I know, there are no studies that have shown it to be effective 

for 

> hair loss, but you might want to give it a try. I wouldn't be surprised if 

it 

> was as effective as finasteride. 

> 

> Since finasteride is not useful for hair loss in women, it might make more 

> sense to say that saw palmetto might be effective for *male* pattern 

> baldness.

>

> Karen Vaughan

> CreationsGarden.juno.com



I respond:



This implies that women don't have "male pattern" hair loss, which

is not the case. A small number of women actually do have "androgen

baldness". Before menopause when production of estrogen is high, there 

is a protective effect against the small amount of testosterone that women 

also produce. After menopause there is less estrogen to counteract

the effects of testosterone. As in males, the enzyme 5-alpha reductase 

in scalp tissue converts circulating (free) testosterone into DHT which in 

turn can harm hair follicles by making them shrink or cause them to enter 

prematurely into the resting stage of the hair cycle. 



Although I don't have clinical studies to cite, see the following webpages 

for further information ...which suggests that there may be some

benefit for women who have DHT-related (male pattern) baldness

in taking saw palmetto.



http://www.seniority.co.uk/content/archive/health_wellbeing_hair_loss.html

http://www.hairloss-reversible.com/female_pattern_baldness.htm



Merck, manufacturers of finasteride, completed a phase III trial on 

the effects of finasteride (propecia) in post menopausal women. Their 

conclusion was that finasteride was ineffective in treating female 

androgenetic alopecia. Officially, Merck do not recommend finasteride for 

use by women and the FDA has not passed it for use by women. However, 

some dermatologists have suggested that the trial was intentionally 

biased. The rumor (and it is only a rumor) is that Merck specifically 

wanted to avoid obtaining Federal Drug Administration approval for 

treating women with finasteride. Propecia/finasteride is dangerous 

during pregnancy as it causes multiple and extensive birth defects to 

male embryos. The suggestion is that Merck wants to avoid any court 

action by pregnant women who took finasteride for their hair loss and 

subsequently had a child with birth defects. Indeed, advertisements for 

propecia recommend that women do not even handle the pills without 

using latex gloves to ensure none of the drug is absorbed through the 

skin. 



Despite these contraindications some dermatologists outside the 

USA do sometimes prescribe finasteride for use by women. These 

dermatologists recommend the individual uses at least two forms of 

birth control while taking propecia as the risk of birth defects is very 

serious. However, without independent trials on pre-menopausal women 

the true effect of finasteride on female pattern baldness is unknown. 

It has been used in pre-menopausal women with hirsutism with some 

success. Studies on hirsute women suggest finasteride can be effective 

in reducing dihydrotestosterone levels. One trial suggests it is as 

effective as oral antiandrogens spironolactone and flutamide, both of 

which are used to treat female androgenetic alopecia. 



The bottom line is that because finasteride might indeed be effective

for male pattern (andregenic) baldness in women, saw palmetto

might be as well. It should not be taken during pregnancy. Practically 

speaking, however, this type of baldness typically occurs after menopause

anyway so this shouldn't be alarming to those who might be considering

it use (postmenopausal women).



For those who want all the scientific information, try obtaining the 

following

papers (unfortunately I don't have them):



Moghetti P. Comparison of spironolactone, flutamide, and finasteride efficacy 



  in the treatment of hirsutism: a randomized, double blind, 

placebo-controlled 

  trial. J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 2000 Jan;85(1):89-94. 

Whiting DA. Measuring reversal of hair miniaturization in androgenetic 

  alopecia by follicular counts in horizontal sections of serial scalp 

  biopsies: results of finasteride 1 mg treatment of men and postmenopausal 

  women. J Investig Dermatol Symp Proc. 1999 Dec;4(3):282-4. 

Faloia E. Effect of finasteride in idiopathic hirsutism. J Endocrinol Invest. 



  1998 Nov;21(10):694-8. 

Bayram F. Related Articles Finasteride treatment for one year in 35 hirsute 

  patients. Exp Clin Endocrinol Diabetes. 1999;107(3):195-7. 





Regards,



Elliot Freeman RPh



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] herbal seminar in Albuquerque NM (USA)

From: Elfreem@aol.com

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 10:43:04 EST

--------

I'll be attending a seminar in Albuquerque, NM April 26th-28th hosted 

by Foundations in Herbal Medicine. The keynote speaker is Tieraona 

Low Dog, MD, AHG. Is anyone on the list a former student of Tieraona

and/or attending the seminar?



Elliot Freeman

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] herbal seminar in Albuquerque NM (USA)

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 14:40:29 -0600

--------





I am real curious about her. I was just wishing I could listen to some of 

her seminars, etc.

Linda



_________________________________________________________________

MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: 

http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] FAQ update - journals?

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 20:00:28 +0200

--------

Hi all,



I'm updating the medicinal herbfaq again, and would need some input:



-----



Beginner-level journals.



I don't subscribe to any of them, these days. Are the descriptions still

up-to-date? http://www.ibiblio.org/herbmed/faqs/medi-6-3-periodicals.html



And have I left out any?



-----



Professional-level journals. 



* The British Journal of Phytotherapy. I must've learned about that one at an

  unfortunate point in time, because no matter what, I've NEVER gotten a valid

  address / phone # / web address / email address for it, nor have I seen

  information that'd confirm if it's still out there - and that despite trying

  for the last two years or so to lay my grubbies on an issue or five. 

  It was edited by Heyn Zelstra, correct? He died last year, correct? Is the

  journal still a going concern, and if so, how do I subscribe? And how

  much does it cost? If it's dead, Jim, where can I get back issues? SOMEbody

  must have subscribed, I see references to it elsewhere...



* Zeitschrift der Phytotherapie. It's in German, I just got my first issue, and

  it's really not worth it. I'll add a note to the FAQ soonish. (Why isn't it

  worth it? It's got far too much science and far too little practical

  information. I want my professional journals to give me ideas for difficult

  problems, I don't want them to give me a summary of Hypericum research. 

  Gak. Test tubes.)



* Strayan Journal of Medical Herbalism. Anybody subscribe to this? They want

  cash, IIRC, and anything that doesn't take VISA is too much of a hassle to me.

  Well, actually they want checks, but that's even WORSE than cash, to me.

  Finland is a credit card / electronic banking country, we don't even HAVE

  checks, anymore.



Any professional-level journals I haven't mentioned?

http://www.ibiblio.org/herbmed/faqs/medi-6-3-periodicals.html



Ta,

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi           Henriette Kress            Helsinki, Finland   

Over 30 MB herbal .html files (FAQs, classic texts, articles, links), plus

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] FAQ update - mailing lists?

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 20:00:32 +0200

--------

Okay, mailing lists, then. 



Any updates that you know of? 



New URLs, new email addresses, things like that? 



Are the lists alive, dead, hanging on in there, flooded with off-topics or

flames, other?



----------



8.1.1 The Herblist.

<Alive and well. Mar02. new address>



----------



8.1.2 The Aromatherapy List

(Alive and well. Contentious. Dec00)



To subscribe, write to list@idma.com with the following text: join aromatherapy 



The problem with this list, as per several emails in December 00 from former

aromatherapy listmembers, is that

it's become extremely chatty, with next to no aromatherapy posts. If that

changes I'd appreciate an update.



----------



8.1.3 The Kombucha List

(Alive and well. Dec00)



To subscribe: write to kombucha-subscribe@topica.com

Website here: http://www.topica.com/lists/kombucha/ and here:

http://w3.trib.com/~kombu/ 



Pretty good for newbies but mostly the same stuff over and over and over. Good

FAQ.



----------



8.1.4 The Paracelsus List

(Alive and well. Dec00)



I'd need an opinion on this list. I'm on nomail, and go in to sniff the air

every half year or so... the last three, four times it hasn't been worth my

while and I've gone back to nomail faster'n'you can say "not <insert-fad-here>

_again_". So what you say, worth it? not?



----------



8.1.5 The Homeopathy List

(Alive and well. High volume, no chat. Dec00)



To subscribe: write to homeopathy-request@lyghtforce.com with the text: join

homeopathy

The archives for this list and a FAQ on homeopathy are kept on 

http://www.homeopathyhome.com/web/descriptions/homlist.shtml 



----------



8.1.6 The Phytopharmacognosy List



Mar02: it's been killed by a moderation that surprises by the sheer level of

ineptness shown. It couldn't be worse if the moderator(s) had _aimed_ for

killing their list.



My take on it is, if the moderator/listowner changes it might be resurrected; 

in that case it might even be a good list again. But as is? Forget it. 



So if you're a pharmacognosist, and think a mailing list might be good to have,

start one. This one is dead, dead, dead.



----------



8.1.7 The Culinary Herblists

(Both are almost dead. Jan01)



This is the list for the gardening and use of culinary herbs: 

To subscribe: write to: HERBS-L-request@orednet.org with the text: subscribe



A similar list with about as much (or little) traffic is found here:

http://www.egroups.com/community/herb_kitchen 



----------



8.1.8. The HerbInfo list.

<almost dead>



----------



8.1.9 The Wellpet List

(Alive and well. Dec00)



A list for a holistic approach to animal health.

To subscribe: write to: majordomo@imagicomm.com with the text: sub wellpet 

Webpage: http://www.listservice.net/wellpet/ 



----------



8.1.10 The Holisticat List

(Alive and well. Chatty. Dec00).



A chatty list for the use of nutrition, herbs, homeopathy, acupuncture etc. as

it relates to cats. 

To subscribe: write to: majordomo@vlists.net with the text: subscribe holisticat

OR the text: subscribe holisticat-digest

The list FAQs, archived old posts, articles etc. are available here:

http://www.holisticat.com 



----------



8.1.11 The Natural Health & Beauty List

(Alive and well. Dec00)



A list for all aspects of natural and herbal cosmetics and remedies and sharing

of recipes; traffic is light to medium.

to subscribe write to: Majordomo@mint.net with the text: subscribe natural-list

A faq for the list exists at http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Spa/3893 - very

nice, too!



----------



8.1.12 The Apothecary List

(Alive and well. Dec00)



A list for preparing oils, ointments and suchlike. I'm told that the chatters

have moved on.

To subscribe: write to: apothecary-request@kjsl.com with the text: subscribe



----------



8.1.13 The Wildcrafting List

(Alive and well. Very chatty. Jan01)



To subscribe: write to wildcrafting-subscribe@egroups.com 

Website found here: http://www.egroups.com/group/wildcrafting 



----------



8.1.14 The Toiletries List

(Alive and well. Dec00)



A list for various aspects of making your own lotions, cremes, soaps, personal

care products, and related

subjects. 

To subscribe: write to: 1Toiletries-subscribe@egroups.com 

The Library is at The Library: http://www.luxurylane.com/thelibrary/index.htm 



----------



8.1.15 The WildForager List

(Alive and well. Very chatty. Dec00)



This is the old "EdibleWild" -list.

To subscribe: write to WildForager-subscribe@egroups.com 

Website found here: http://www.egroups.com/group/WildForager and here:

http://www.ediblewild.com



----------



8.1.16 The Aboutherbs List

(Alive and well. Dec00)



A list focused more on growing and preserving herbs. Animal health and natural

beauty are ontopic, as are herbs

for health.

To subscribe: write to aboutherbs-subscribe@egroups.com 

Website found here: http://www.egroups.com/group/aboutherbs 



----------



8.1.17 The UK Herbal List.

<alive and well.>



----------





Any I've left out? Any I should remove altogether?



Cheers

Henriette



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Over 30 MB herbal .html files (FAQs, classic texts, articles, links), plus

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] FAQ update - mailing lists?

From: elementalclay@webtv.net (Roxanne Brown)

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 12:21:29 -0600 (CST)

--------

Hello,

  Wildcrafting at egroups is defunct.  It has changed to NAHerbs at

Yahoo groups and focuses on native tribes and uses.

  Wild forager is alive and well and quite chatty.

Roxanne



Roxanne J. Brown

Elemental Clay

http://www.cloudnet.com/~elemclay/

"One does not learn by speaking"



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] FAQ update - mailing lists?

From: margi <oaksong@peak.org>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 11:00:40 -0800

--------



Link didn't work on wildcrafting list



Henriette Kress wrote:



> Okay, mailing lists, then.

>

> Any updates that you know of?

>





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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] FAQ update - mailing lists?

From: "Joanie MacPhee" <macphee@net1plus.com>

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 22:34:29 -0500

--------

Okay, some comments...at least those that are fit to be published here...



>8.1.2 The Aromatherapy List

>(Alive and well. Contentious. Dec00)



still that way, same address

there are also the less contentious

and slightly slower

essentials@naturesgift.com

and

kercher@yahoogroups.com

that deal with the same subjects

I can find subbing details if requested





>8.1.7 The Culinary Herblists

>(Both are almost dead. Jan01)

>To subscribe: write to: HERBS-L-request@orednet.org



unless I've been unsubbed, this one is really dead



>8.1.8. The HerbInfo list.

><almost dead>



yup





>8.1.11 The Natural Health & Beauty List

>(Alive and well. Dec00)



oh, my...*I* would suggest completely scrubbing this list.

Its address has changed at least 3 times in the last year (last at

Yahoo)..and as I have been booted from it for declining to continue to be

the list moderator, I am not even sure where it is now.

But this list has little to do with *natural* nor *health* nor *beauty*at

this point, but exists as a commercial forum for the sales promotions of the

listowner's business, which is as a soapmaker's supply wholesaler, and

promotes (what I have been told by professional cosmetics chemists as)  very

bad cosmetics chemistry.    There is a whole lot more I could say about what

is going on there, but as it is pretty nasty, I will stop for this public

posting.

The FAQ is still online, however.  It has not been updated for over 3 years,

though, and I believe the listowner has forgotten about it.





>8.1.12 The Apothecary List

>(Alive and well. Dec00)

>A list for preparing oils, ointments and suchlike. I'm told that the

chatters

>have moved on.



yes, I believe that I told you that about the chatters over the last few

years.  It is true, but most everyone else has moved on too...about as alive

as herbinfo and the culinary herblists



>8.1.13 The Wildcrafting List

>(Alive and well. Very chatty. Jan01)



I signed onto this one and it disappeared..I think Roxanne has covered the

reasons for this..the NA list is very busy, lots of links and reposts about

NA herbs and other subjects



>8.1.14 The Toiletries List

>(Alive and well. Dec00)



Yes, though too many people seem to use this as an ad forum at this point..I

check in, but too many ads drives me out after a few days



>To subscribe: write to: 1Toiletries-subscribe@egroups.com



sub Yahoogroups for egroups



>8.1.15 The WildForager List

>(Alive and well. Very chatty. Dec00)

>

>This is the old "EdibleWild" -list.

>To subscribe: write to WildForager-subscribe@egroups.com



yes..this is the same, though slightly slower these days, again, sub

Yahoogroups for egroups



>Website found here: http://www.egroups.com/group/WildForager and here:

>http://www.ediblewild.com



insert Yahoo for e

and I may get back to you again soon with another website correction



>8.1.16 The Aboutherbs List

>(Alive and well. Dec00)





Yes, though this one has slowed some since egroups became Yahoo, though not

at all dead.

Again, this is another Yahoogroup, now, and not an egroup...what a PIA these

changes are



>Any I've left out? Any I should remove altogether?



Well, I have suggested one to remove as it has totally changed into a

commercial outlet, IMO.

The really slow lists...well, it would be nice if they came alive again, but

it won't happen without work...perhaps they should be bundled together so

that those that care to can join and liven things up.  But, they *are*

barely there.



There are several other herbal groups on Yahoo and on Smartgroups that I

have been checking out.

IMO, the best of them is Herbal Healers International on Smartgroups;

it more often than not slants toward the cayenne/lobelia/Christopher/Schulze

philosophies,

though pagan influences creep in;

sometimes listmembers post more articles from other sources than of their

own experience, but it is very alive and well, friendly, helpful,

informative, and stays on topic more often than not, and most members are

out there collecting and processing and using herbs rather than just

purchasing them.



On Yahoogroups, one just has to do a search for groups using any of several

keywords to find herbal groups, most of which are as slow and dead as any

mentioned here.  Others exist to provide some so called "doctors", with a

degree from a 9 month mail order university, an online and paying clientele.

There is an SCA herbalist group, slow, but on topic,

and several others appear to be classes with a

classroom free.  Lots of botany and herbal groups on yahoo seem to be for

yahoos with an urge to rant and promote themselves, others are very

professional but very slow..  But none yet that I have found and not yet

mentioned about have been found to be anything all that substantial.

WiseWeeds, on Yahoo, is a great herbal healing and information list when the

listowner is around...perhaps this year she will get her email going again,

but without her, that list is slow,too.



Several of the lists mentioned here are owned by people who are members of

*this* herb list.

One of the members of this list has started an herblist for horses...not

sure of the name.."Equineherbal", perhaps?  He can provide details of that

if he cares to, I suppose.  I know he is reading this.



Well, enough for now.  I can provide more details if anyone wants me to.



Joanie









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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] athletes foot

From: rja86@webtv.net (Renee and Jerry Amonette)

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 21:40:37 -0800 (PST)

--------

Hi eveyone,

My neighborkid has athletes foot.  I wondered if anyone has a athletes

foot recipe, (porportions, etc.) I can make for him.  He's not very

herbal, but maybe I can make in powder form to put into his shoes?  Or

tea tree to put on his feet?  D you think athletes foot can be cleared

up permantly?  thank you, and I sure hope everyone is doing well. ;))



 







Love,  



Rene and Jerry

rja86@webtv.net







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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] athletes foot

From: elementalclay@webtv.net (Roxanne Brown)

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 01:48:22 -0600 (CST)

--------

Renee,

  With athletic kids this has worked well.

1 cup bentonite clay

1 cup cornstarch

20 d rosemary eo

20 d tea tree eo

This makes a good foot powder, add 

5 d peppermint eo if you want a cooling effect.

  For really stubborn problems, I use tea tree neat twice a day.

Roxanne



Roxanne J. Brown

Elemental Clay

http://www.cloudnet.com/~elemclay/

"One does not learn by speaking"



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] athletes foot/black walnut?

From: rja86@webtv.net (Renee and Jerry Amonette)

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 21:53:36 -0800 (PST)

--------

I wonder if a cotton ball soaked in black walnut tincture would rid of

it?  I have tons from my trees last fall.  Then a salve from calendula

to follow that after skin dries?  



 







Love,  



Rene and Jerry

rja86@webtv.net







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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Kava and Equisetum

From: hkobayas <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 00:51:10 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Hideka Kobayashi" <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu> :



I know this address will be closed soon, but for some reason, I am having a 

serious problem in posting a message. It bounced back 6 times! I think itas 

has something to do with the formatting of the e-mail program I use.



Anyway,



<A prime exampleis the worry over Kava.  If you chew a piece (a small piece)

you will quickly notice its initial local effects, and then later it's

systemic effects....saliva has amazing chemistry in it.>



Actually, active compounds of kava (kawain, yangonin, etc) exist as they are

in roots, and I am not sure how much "chemistry of saliva" has something to do

with the effect of kava. Unlike some of the medicinal compounds that need to

be broken down before becoming active, kavapyrones directly bind at GABA

receptors, thereby causing the "effects."



I think this is a good opportunity, so I should ask this. Does anyone know

Equisetum used in a similar manner as calmative like kava? (Some species of)

Equisetum does contain very similar compounds, and I have been wondering about

this. I am very aware structurally similar compounds do not necessarily behave

in the same way, though.



Hideka Kobayashi

Dept. of Natural Resources and Environmental Sciences

1115 Plant Science Laboratory

1201 S. Dorner Dr.

Urbana, IL 61801





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: Lobelia

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 01:54:41 -0500 (EST)

--------

>HT = Herbal Tincture and it has nothing added.  Interesting about the green

>tea. can you tell us more?

>Regards,

>Rochelle



I used dried lobelia in combination with other herbs in an infusion or

infusion-decoction.  One such combination was lobelia, southernwood (Artemisia

abrotanum), Hibiscus sabdariffa, yerba santa, grindelia and lungwort

(Pulmonaria officinalis).

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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [herb] Re: motherwort

From: "Phosphor" <phosphor@hotkey.net.au>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 09:57:06 +0300

--------

can anyone say which Motherwort species are most prevalent through europe

apart from cardiaca?



andrew



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Plantar fasciitis

From: Kathy Kommit <kkommit@earthlink.net>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 07:57:25 -0400

--------

A new friend of mine has been suffering for 5 yrs from constant and 

chronic pain in his feet caused by plantar fasciitis. Has anyone had any 

experience in treating this successfully? Thanks



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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Plantar fasciitis

From: "Jay Poutinen" <Jay.Poutinen@uwsp.edu>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 21:17:26 -0600

--------

Take aspirin or Motrin for inflammation.  Put foot on an ice

pack several times a day.  Walk around normally, but don't

stretch Achilles.



-----Original Message-----

From: Kathy Kommit [mailto:kkommit@earthlink.net]

Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 5:57 AM

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Plantar fasciitis





A new friend of mine has been suffering for 5 yrs from

constant and

chronic pain in his feet caused by plantar fasciitis. Has

anyone had any

experience in treating this successfully?



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: RE: [Herb] Plantar fasciitis

From: Veronica Honthaas <honthaas@bigsky.net>

Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 09:30:16 -0700

--------

At 09:17 PM 3/11/02 -0600, you wrote:

>Take aspirin or Motrin for inflammation.  Put foot on an ice

>pack several times a day.  Walk around normally, but don't

>stretch Achilles.





In my experience. both professional and personal, it is very important to 

do lots of stretching to the Achilles. However, it is imperative that it is 

gentle, soft and very consistent. It is very important to stretch the 

Achilles before you get out of bed, before you get out of a chair, every 

time you have access to a stair step (put toes on end of step and drop 

heels). Gently stretch this tendon even while you are sitting.



It is also usually important to get some type of orthotic device in your 

shoes.  I prefer the plastic kind that you can mold yourself in hot water 

because it is typical that in the most painful part of this condition you 

will need the most arch support but as the foot starts to heel you may 

require less arch support. With this type of orthotic you can adjust the 

support.



The foot will be happier with a shoe that cups the heel rather that having 

just a flat heel surface. Wearing Birkenstock (sp?) shoes is frequently one 

of the most important therapeutic things you can do. If someone cannot for 

some reason wear their Birkies all of the time I usually suggest they put 

them on as soon as they get home in the evening.



Gentle foot rubs or reflexology treatments will be very helpful and 

pleasurable.

As usual, the diet must be examined  and mineral herb teas taken daily (oat 

straw,nettles, horsetail,etc.). For some, making sure you are absorbing 

enough calcium is a critical factor. Although I do not recommend this, some 

have gotten relief from supplementing with hydrochloric acid tablets to 

increase stomach acidity which will supposedly help with calcium absorption.



Good luck. Veronica



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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Plantar fasciitis

From: "Poutinen, Jay" <jpoutine@uwsp.edu>

Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 11:12:22 -0600

--------

You can do stretching of the Achilles as preventative care--AFTER it heals.



-----Original Message-----

From: Veronica Honthaas [mailto:honthaas@bigsky.net]

Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2002 10:30 AM

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: RE: [Herb] Plantar fasciitis





At 09:17 PM 3/11/02 -0600, you wrote:

>Take aspirin or Motrin for inflammation.  Put foot on an ice

>pack several times a day.  Walk around normally, but don't

>stretch Achilles.





In my experience. both professional and personal, it is very important to 

do lots of stretching to the Achilles. 

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Plantar fasciitis

From: GerstenbergerA@aol.com

Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 16:46:02 EST

--------

I'm not yet clear on which comes first with this problem. Bone spurs caused 

by tight/rubbing tendons, or inflamed tendons/fascia caused by bone spurs. It 

might be a  vicious circle. In any case. Solomon's Seal (Polygonatum 

biflorum) has the reputation of soothing and restoring elasticity to  

inflamed, stiff joints and CT. I've used it to help treat a painful "frozen" 

shoulder, together with myofascial massage, moderate strength training and 

gentle stretching. Took 4 months, but it worked. Your foot-sore friend may 

find it helpful as well. 

I used an alcohol-based tincture, though in Appalachia I hear they just put a 

piece of the root near the hurting body part. Your friend could put a piece 

in his sock!. Be sure to collect only from robust plant communities, give 

thanks, and replant 1/2 of the rhizome you collect.

Be well,

Ann G.



In a message dated 3/11/02 7:59:14 AM, kkommit@earthlink.net writes:



>A new friend of mine has been suffering for 5 yrs from constant and 

>chronic pain in his feet caused by plantar fasciitis. Has anyone had any

>

>experience in treating this successfully? Thanks

>

>_______________________________________________

>Herb mailing list

>Herb@lists.ibiblio.org

>http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/herb

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Tea Tree Essential Oil Question

From: Jim Lamplugh <jim@planetida.com>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 10:17:19 -0600

--------

Henriette,



I'm curious.  You said that Tea Tree EO is not very nice.  Do you mean that 

it doesn't smell very nice -- which is true -- or do you mean that it has 

some fairly unpleasant properties other than the smell?



Jim





Tea tree EO is not very nice; it's turpentine,

it smells like h*ll, and I don't like it for everyday use, but there are few

other things you can do with ingrown toenail fungi.

Version: 6.0.332 / Virus Database: 186 - Release Date: 3/6/02

--------



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Tea Tree Essential Oil Question

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 06:37:46 +0200

--------

Jim Lamplugh <jim@planetida.com> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



>> Tea tree EO is not very nice; it's turpentine,

>> it smells like h*ll, and I don't like it for everyday use, but there are few

>> other things you can do with ingrown toenail fungi.

>

> I'm curious.  You said that Tea Tree EO is not very nice.  Do you mean that 

> it doesn't smell very nice -- which is true -- or do you mean that it has 

> some fairly unpleasant properties other than the smell?



It's far too much like turpentine for my tastes. Would you use turpentine in

your toothpaste? on a tampon? in your everyday tea? in your soap? 



Also, it is possible to become sensitive ("allergic") to it... so don't use it

unless you have a problem that less harsh remedies can't help with.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi           Henriette Kress            Helsinki, Finland   

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: Mailing lists

From: Thomas Cagle <nh-adapt@juno.com>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 13:22:49 -0500

--------

There are a lot of seed exchanges between Yahoogroups and Topica. Do you

want any of those listed? Some DO have  focus on exchange of seed cutting

and plants with an herbal bent to 'em.





Tom C

nh-adapt@juno.com







________________________________________________________________

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Join Juno today!  For your FREE software, visit:

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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Hempseed Oil

From: "Kit Betteridge" <kitb@silverstar.com>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 13:40:19 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Kit Betteridge" <kitb@silverstar.com> :



A friend and I are thinking of making lip balms using, in part, hempseed

oil.  I have read lately that using this on a regular basis can/may affect

drug testing readings.  Is this true?  How large an amount does it take to

do this?  As it is only a small percentage of the balm recipe is hemp oil,

would that cause a false reading?



Did I make any sense at all???



Thanks.



Kit





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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: Hempseed Oil

From: Art Sackett <asackett@artsackett.com>

Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 22:22:06 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Art Sackett" <medherb@artsackett.com> :



On Mon, Mar 11, 2002 at 01:40:19PM -0600, Kit Betteridge wrote:



> A friend and I are thinking of making lip balms using, in part, hempseed

> oil.  I have read lately that using this on a regular basis can/may affect

> drug testing readings.  Is this true? 



You might want to pay a visit to:



http://www.testpledge.com/



-- 

----   Art Sackett   ----

PGP/GPG Public Key: asackett-pubkey@artsackett.com (autoresponder)





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: osteoporosis and Equisetum arvense

From: Elfreem@aol.com

Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 10:46:31 EST

--------

from herb@franklin.oit.unc.edu



<<<

Hallo, mumble, grumble, frazzled Henriette...:)

On Febr.2nd I broke my hip, had surgery with screws, plates etc. and am

now recovering.

Also have to figure out how to improve and more importantly reverse my

osteoporosis.

I really want to prove something here to the medical establishment and

feel that I have the most perfect opportunity to do so.

>>>



I assume you want to demonstrate that herbs can benefit osteoporosis

as well as drugs and conventional therapy. Calcium, vitamin D, and

vitamin K are essential to the process. In a study published in the

Journal of Orthopaedic Science, 92 osteoportotic women who were

more than 5 years after menopause where given either vitamin D3,

vitamin K2, vitamin D3 plus vitamin K2, or calcium lactate (2gm/day).

After 2 years, there was a significant increase in bone mineral

density of the lumbar spine in the calcium group. However, there

was a significant increase in BMD in the vitamin D3 group AND 

vitamin K2 groups compared with the calcium group. The vitamin 

D3/K2 group had the greatest increase in BMD, demonstrating

that taking these vitamins together without additional calcium

supplementation may be one of the best methods to treat 

osteoporosis (J Ortho Science 2000;5:546-51).



While this study may suggest that calcium supplementation is 

not needed, let's not forget that a D/K/calcium group was not

included so we cannot speculate that taking addition calcium

wouldn't be beneficial. Vitamin D is generally not found in many 

natural dietary sources; therefore, supplementation is recommended 

(probably with higher doses than is recommended today) and let's 

not forget being in direct sunlight ...watch for a book by Krispin

Sullivan that should be out soon called "Naked at Noon". 



That said, it might be of interest to find out what herbs are high

in calcium and also vitamin K ...and Equisetum in particular

(oatstraw anyone?). 



Elliot Freeman RPh





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: osteoporosis and Equisetum arvense

From: Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net>

Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 09:53:12 -0700

--------

As Elliot has written about vitamin K's  importance to bone health. 

So what herbs, it should probably read vegetables-Vitamin K1 is most 

abundant in, photosynthetic tissues of plants. Accordingly, the 

highest concentrations (3000-6000 micrograms/kg) are found in 

dark-green leafy vegetables and herbs, such as kale, parsley, spinach 

and green cabbage. Intermediate concentrations (1000-2000 

micrograms/kg) are found in plants with paler leaves such as white 

cabbage and lettuce or in green, non-leafy vegetables such as 

broccoli and brussel sprouts. Cooked is better than raw in getting 

the vit k and although oils and oily food is suppose to have vit K 

content it turns out that vit K content of hydrogenated oil products 

do NOTHING for bone health but does still form clotting factors as 

well as irritants = blocked arteries.

   The alfalfa that you have been taking should help, the midwives I 

have worked with that recommend it for upping vit K levels tell women 

to take 6-12 caps or tablets/day.  Sharon in Tucson

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: osteoporosis and Equisetum arvense

From: Susan Marynowski <sumar@mail.ifas.ufl.edu>

Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 20:40:47 -0500

--------

Just to expand on this and other recent posts about David Winton's bone

blend (nci), I am not defending David's products, but thought folks might

like to hear what he has to say. Ellie and I just brought David here to

Florida for a weekend intensive and he talked a bit about his bone formula.

David's bone formula is in capsules, not tincture form as are many of his

other preparations. He claims that the mineral-rich herbs are well absorbed

in capsule form. He also says that they have radiographic data that shows a

reversal of osteoporosis with this formula, as well as faster healing of

fractures and breaks. I got the sense that David also felt that compliance

was a major issue with infusions or decoctions of mineral-rich herbs and

that the capsules were better in that regard. (OK, not for us on this list,

but perhaps for our clients?) By the way, you can contact David through his

company's website at http://www.herbalist-alchemist.com/



I got a chuckle out of the recent discussion of spring herbs (nettles,

chickweed, etc.). While Henriette is digging out from under the snow, we

down here in Florida are rushing to gather the last of the "spring" greens

before they are totally gone from the impending doom of heat and humidity.

We only see chickweed here from about Jan-April. Y'all come on down

sometime and set a spell!  -Susan in Florida



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To: "herb@lists.ibiblio.org" <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Meadowsweet

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 20:48:56 -0500

--------

In what form (i.e. tincture, tea, dried herb in capsules, etc.) is it

best to consume meadowsweet?  I am interested in using it for occasional

headaches.



May



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Meadowsweet

From: greg patch <patch@berkshire.net>

Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 19:24:53 -0500 (EST)

--------

>In what form (i.e. tincture, tea, dried herb in capsules, etc.) is it

>best to consume meadowsweet?  I am interested in using it for occasional

>headaches.

>

>May



May,

Meadowsweet, as an anti-inflamatory, might not be too helpful with a

constrictive, or, cold headache. Keeping that in mind, tincture would

release more of its constituency, infusion less, tea even less, and

capsule, how fresh is the herb inside? It is gentle, you could experiment

with low dose to test your occasional particular situation.

Greg





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Meadowsweet

From: P D Lewis <p.d.lewis@ic.ac.uk>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 23:08:02 +0000

--------

  I use meadowsweet infusions for headaches and influenza. However I have 

noticed that about 10 minutes after taking some people become very red 

faced. Anyone else found this?

Amy



mailto:p.d.lewis@ic.ac.uk



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Meadowsweet

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 09:43:17 +0200

--------

P D Lewis <p.d.lewis@ic.ac.uk> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



>   I use meadowsweet infusions for headaches and influenza. However I have 

> noticed that about 10 minutes after taking some people become very red 

> faced. Anyone else found this?



Asthmatics, are they? Some can't take salicylates, of which meadowsweet contains

_LOADS_. So ask first if they can take aspirin. If yes, meadowsweet is no

trouble.



Henriette



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] toenail fungus

From: Quinnten Allen <quinnten@usa.net>

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2002 13:11:37 -0600

--------

I once had terrible foot odor and it went away completely and never to return

by using 1/8 teaspoon of baking soda in each shoe. Anymore than that will dry

out the stitching in your shoes and they will literally fall apart. This

should not be done everyday - just make sure that there is a little-tiny bit

in every pair, especially if they're brand new. 



But .... I would suggest initially getting a very cheap pair of shoes and

putting maybe a teaspoon in each shoe for starters. Keep in mind these  cheap

shoes are used only to get rid of the foot odor (not the shoe odor). And these

should not be shoes you intend to keep. This is not what I've heard, but what

worked for me.



Q



=======================================



Whenever I have toenail fungus, or foot or underarm body odor 

problems, I treat for Candida. This always clears it up for me.

Art



>Also, is there something I can use for my feet to prevent odor 

>problems? In the past year or two, I've noticed it more and more; but 

>never had it before. I shower or bathe daily; so don't know why the 

>problem.

>Thank you.

>R. Hayward





 

 



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: Candida [was: toenail fungus]

From: Susan Marynowski <sumar@mail.ifas.ufl.edu>

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2002 19:43:09 -0500

--------

Alright, Art. I'll bite at this one. So HOW do YOU treat for candida?

Details please! Just saying you "treat for Candida" doesn't give us much to

go on.  -Susan in the Sunny South (Florida)

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Re: Candida [was: toenail fungus]

From: Art Carlson <cgreenacres@centurytel.net>

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2002 19:57:51 -0700

--------

Susan,

     Treating for Candida has to be modified for the individual. It is 

rather complicated and long lasting -- they say that once you have Candida 

you have it forever, and you can control it but not eliminate it. The 

extent of treatment depends on the severity of the Candida infection.

    Candida is a yeast which feeds on sugar and simple carbohydrates which 

can be fermented into sugars. An important part of the control is to reduce 

sugars (including many fruits plus vegetables such as carrots), simple 

carbs such as white flour or white rice, anything which has been fermented 

(beer, wine, vinegar, pickles), anything made using yeast (bread made with 

yeast), and anything which may have mold spores (bacon, mushrooms).

    The above is to starve the yeast. Then we hit it with herbs. Once I 

have the Candida pretty much under control I can usually knock it back down 

using Pau D'Arco tincture and increasing my garlic intake. If bad I also 

use greatly diluted Grapefruit Seed Extract for a short time. Any herbs 

which are anti-fungal are worth trying.

    The book I started with is "Candida - A Twentieth Century Disease," by 

Shirley S. Lorenzani. There is also a lot of information on the Web - some 

good and some bad. I did not search Henriette's site. I also feel that 

Candida is more of a problem in the warmer more humid climates. Here in 

NorthWest Montana we are still getting snow with low temperatures forecast 

down around 9 degrees Fahrenheit (-12 C).

    Contact me off list if you want to continue this.

         Art in frozen Montana

>Alright, Art. I'll bite at this one. So HOW do YOU treat for candida?

>Details please! Just saying you "treat for Candida" doesn't give us much to

>go on.  -Susan in the Sunny South (Florida)

>_______________________________________________





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Re: Candida [was: toenail fungus]

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2002 09:36:42 +0200

--------

Art Carlson <cgreenacres@centurytel.net> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> Susan,

>      Treating for Candida has to be modified for the individual. It is 

> rather complicated and long lasting -- they say that once you have Candida 



Nah. It's a piece of cake.



If you're a lady, and do the pill, do B-vitamins -- especially B6, but it's not

a good idea to do only one B. That'll stop _new_ candida growth.



To get rid of _current_ candida overgrowth:

- do diet low in simple carbs with no sugar (white sugar, syrup, honey, maple

  syrup, etc.) whatsoever.

  If you're still all puffed up, with that diet, ALSO remove all yeast-made

  foods, including alcohol (yeast...), beer (yeast...), bread, etc.

- do Epilobium angustifolium leaf tea for three months, 2-3 cups a day.

- help your _liver_. Depending on liver type that's yellow dock root or

  dandelion root, berberis/mahonia root or burdock root/leaf, etc.

- do lactobacilli: acidophilus, bifidus... the more the merrier.



That's it.



We all have candida, it's part of our normal gut flora, but we shouldn't have so

much of it that it gets to be a problem.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Re: Candida [was: toenail fungus]

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2002 09:12:50 -0500

--------

Henriette Kress wrote:



> Depending on liver type that's yellow dock root or

>   dandelion root, berberis/mahonia root or burdock root/leaf, etc.



Henriette, can you elaborate on this a bit?  Is there a way that a layperson can

figure this out?



May

--

I try to take one day at a time, but sometimes several days attack me at once.

---Jennifer Unlimited





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Re: Candida [was: toenail fungus]

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2002 16:43:02 +0200

--------

May Terry <mterry@snet.net> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> Henriette Kress wrote:

> 

> > Depending on liver type that's yellow dock root or

> >   dandelion root, berberis/mahonia root or burdock root/leaf, etc.

> 

> Henriette, can you elaborate on this a bit?  Is there a way that a layperson can

> figure this out?



Check Michael Moore's "herbal energetics" booklet, on his site under "Manuals":

http://www.swsbm.com/ManualsMM/MansMM.html



Henriette



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Re: Candida [was: toenail fungus]

From: NEHrbSup@aol.com

Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2002 01:55:59 EST

--------



Art,



From my perspective, in your response on the subject of candida there is a 

bit of truth and a bit of misconception on someone's part, not necessarily 

yours directly, that I feel compelled to put my two cents in on.



Since I haven't been "contributing " to the list for a while though I have 

tried to keep up, by way of background to my comments, I think it appropriate 

to note that my comments are not based on reading a text on the subject, but 

rather from direct first hand experience  with a good  number of clients who 

have come to me looking for answers that the allopathic community was unable 

to provide.  In all but a couple of cases, and then because the people didn't 

do what was suggested,  the individuals have had remarkable success in 

dealing with their candida problems and are now able to live lives unaffected 

by what was a constant problem before..  



 That said, I'll comment on your response.

<<Treating for Candida has to be modified for the individual. It is 

rather complicated and long lasting -->>



"Treating" candida in the absence of any testing for the presence of heavy 

metals, particularly mercury (Hg) in the system is akin to doing what the 

allopaths do all the time with so many different "disorders" . - and -  

"treating" it as they do with antibiotics only compounds the problem.  



In virtually every case of "chronic" or systemic candida - the stuff that 

just keeps coming back over and over, regardless of what is done, is tied 

directly to the presence of Hg in the system which protects the yeast colony 

that is able to live in closer proximity to Hg than any of the "tools" that 

medicine, allopathic, herbal or other, has at its disposal to deal with it.  

As a result, when diflucan or one of the other drugs, or herbal preparations 

are used they kill off ALL the bacteria - beneficial and pathogenic - that 

are outside of Hg's area of influence, there still remains a relatively good 

size colony of candida that will multiply and overcolonize as soon as the 

medicine is cleared from the system.



The proper "balance" of beneficial to pathogenic bacteria in the system is 

85%/15%.  With Hg compromised systems the balance starts at that and 

gradually declines to 70/30 and with the help of antibiotics - which is what 

most folks opt for  initially - the balance is thrown further and further off 

until people develop all sorts of ancillary "disorders"  that the body must 

also fight.  What also happens as the colony grows in size is that the yeast 

becomes what I call "super yeast" and instead of just replicating itself by 

spewing spore as most fungal infections do, this critter develops a rhizome 

like root that it sends out in search of a rich source of blood  - and once 

tapped in, it spews spores into the bloodstream where it can then go to all 

parts of the body and find new places to live and prosper.  There are a ton 

of folks that discount the "systemic yeast" problem, but having seen it too 

often, I can't even begin to buy into that train of thought.



 <<they say that once you have Candida 

you have it forever, and you can control it but not eliminate it. >>



We are born with it and it is apparently necessary for some biochemical 

process in the body - but - as noted above - in the right place and at the 

right "balance" .  Without something that will promote an overcolonization 

like Hg, the body will, through its own defense mechanism's maintain the 

proper balance.  Add Hg or a couple of other "factors" into the equation, and 

the balance becomes upset.



<< The extent of treatment depends on the severity of the Candida infection.

    Candida is a yeast which feeds on sugar and simple carbohydrates which 

can be fermented into sugars. An important part of the control is to reduce 

sugars (including many fruits plus vegetables such as carrots), simple 

carbs such as white flour or white rice, anything which has been fermented 

(beer, wine, vinegar, pickles), anything made using yeast (bread made with 

yeast), and anything which may have mold spores (bacon, mushrooms).

    The above is to starve the yeast. >>



While all of the above is true, it is totally unnatural if you think about it 

to have to starve the body in this manner.  I won't go into a discussion 

about junk foods etc. that we in this country barrage our systems with that 

certainly add to the problem, but returning the body to a proper balance, 

when it is something that the body wants to do to begin with, should not have 

to mean starving it of any thing that it needs.  The complete elimination of 

anything that will produce sugars or yeast etc., as advocated by most of the 

texts out there on the subject is also starving the body of "essential" 

nutrients - which sets up a whole other set of problems to deal with later 

on.   Better, IMHO, to try to put your finger on the root cause and deal with 

 it - then let the body's systems do their job.  



<<Then we hit it with herbs. Once I 

have the Candida pretty much under control I can usually knock it back down 

using Pau D'Arco tincture and increasing my garlic intake. If bad I also 

use greatly diluted Grapefruit Seed Extract for a short time. Any herbs 

which are anti-fungal are worth trying.>>



Not a bad way to go - even goldenseal for  a week or so for something that is 

out of contr\ol, but you also need to feed the systems that are trying to 

heal and detox all of the die-off.  Chlorella and chlorophyl are essential - 

some liver herbs Burdock and dandelion root being primary to both clean and 

tonify the organ and keep the kidney from overloading are also essential, 

otherwise you get people getting real sick from the "stuff" that the candida 

releases when it dies off.  And a question - why a greatly diluted grapefruit 

seed extract for a couple of days?/  - I have people doing that as a matter 

of course "all the time"  along with capryllic acid and a good high dose 

probiotic.   With the potential for more serious things developing if an 

overcolonization of candida is allowed to happen, there is no reason I can 

think of short of a seriously low bank account which would warrant a 'go 

slow" approach.  But - taking this all the way back to the beginning - a hair 

analysis, provocative urine or provocative fecal analysis is a "must"  to 

determine the existence or lack thereof of mercury as the "root of the 

problem":  





Peter Byram, CNC, Herbalist

New England Herbal 

299 Jagger Lane

Hebron, Connecticut 06248

860-228-9199  -  Fax 860-228-9399

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Re: Candida [was: toenail fungus]

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2002 15:25:43 -0600

--------

Do you think eating tons of canned tuna can increase the problem of getting 

mercury into the system?? Just a thought.

Linda Shipley







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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Re: Candida

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2002 07:12:08 -0600

--------

And a question - why a greatly diluted grapefruit

seed extract for a couple of days?/  - I have people doing that as a matter

of course "all the time"  along with capryllic acid and a good high dose

probiotic.



************************************



Question about this - is it helpful or useless to take a probiotic

concomitantly with GSE or another powerful antimicrobial herb (garlic,

even)? Wouldn't the antimicrobial herb also destroy the probiotic with which

you're trying to repopulate your body? I've had a few people ask me this

question. I've counseled quite a few moms on systemic thrush (candida

infection which affects nursing moms and babies in the mouth and breast

tissue), and while I feel very strongly that a probiotic needs to be taken

any time you take an antibiotic or antifungal, I don't know if it should be

taken at the same time (and then for an additional week or two) or not until

after the treatment is complete. I've always instructed the moms to take it

at the same time, and then for a period of time afterwards, but I know a

good quality acidophilus is expensive, and if they're just throwing away

money, I'd like to revise that recommendation if it turns out that it's

useless to do so while actively treating the yeast.



Kerry





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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Herbal energetic

From: "Gardenthyme Lady" <dblan@netusa1.net>

Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2002 11:28:41 -0500

--------

Very Nice chart Henriette, I imagine that was some project to put together.



 Could you give some examples of what circumstances you would use the

stimulation  and suppressive factors?  For instances, if one has a cold, you

would stimulate the immunity(Lymph?) and repress the mucosa?  For a bad gall

bladder or liver, would you stimulate  or suppress the heptic?  A weak heart

or high blood pressure?  Fatigue?  If you had PMS would you stimulate or

suppress the reproductive?  What about the central nervous?

I hope you  understand what I mean and will clarify the uses of stimulation

and suppression.

Thanks!



Dee

"The Gardenthyme Lady"

>

> > Depending on liver type that's yellow dock root or

> >   dandelion root, berberis/mahonia root or burdock root/leaf, etc.

>

> Henriette, can you elaborate on this a bit?  Is there a way that a

layperson can

> figure this out?



Check Michael Moore's "herbal energetics" booklet, on his site under

"Manuals":

http://www.swsbm.com/ManualsMM/MansMM.html



Henriette





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal energetic

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2002 20:42:40 +0200

--------

"Gardenthyme Lady" <dblan@netusa1.net> wrote to <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>:



> Very Nice chart Henriette, I imagine that was some project to put together.



It's part of the herbal energetics booklet, put together by Michael Moore. I

just put it into a set of .html tables; the charts is the reason Michael didn't

do it as text.



>  Could you give some examples of what circumstances you would use the

> stimulation  and suppressive factors?  For instances, if one has a cold, you

> would stimulate the immunity(Lymph?) and repress the mucosa? 



Never suppress mucosa during a cold. There's a reason for a runny nose - your

liver can't handle the crud after (or during) a largish infection, and the

easiest way to get rid of it is to throw it out.

Dry up the mucosa, and your cold will last _far_ longer. Better to stimulate it

- use heating herbs (like cayenne, horseradish, garlic) - that way the crud

flows easier.



> For a bad gall

> bladder or liver, would you stimulate  or suppress the heptic?  A weak heart

> or high blood pressure?  Fatigue?  If you had PMS would you stimulate or

> suppress the reproductive?  What about the central nervous?

> I hope you  understand what I mean and will clarify the uses of stimulation

> and suppression.



Depends on the _person_. Read the full booklet, fill in the intake form, look at

your own patterns, and choose herbs based on your own imbalances.



But always, always, help your liver.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Fw: [Herb] Re: Candida [was: toenail fungus]

From: "Kevin Chisholm" <kchisholm@ca.inter.net>

Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2002 10:00:59 -0400

--------

> Dear Peter

>

> I found your explanation fascinating!! Thanks indeed!!

>

> You close with:

> .   With the potential for more serious things developing if an

> > overcolonization of candida is allowed to happen, there is no reason I

can

> > think of short of a seriously low bank account which would warrant a 'go

> > slow" approach.  But - taking this all the way back to the beginning - a

> hair

> > analysis, provocative urine or provocative fecal analysis is a "must"

to

> > determine the existence or lack thereof of mercury as the "root of the

> > problem":

>

> Is a hair or urine analysis even necessary? Wouldn't the mere presence of

> Candidia be a proof that mercury was present to excess? If hair and urine

> showed acceptable mercury, how then could a person have Candidia?Have you

> ever seen a case of Candidia where mercury was NOT present in excess?

>

>

> Thanks again for the fascinating explanation.

>

> Kindest regards,

>

> Kevin Chisholm





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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Immune system

From: "rochelle" <rochelle@ntlworld.com>

Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2002 21:18:00 -0000

--------

I have a patient who has had a blood test that shows that her ESR levels are

very high. This means an auto immune disease. At the moment we don't know

what. She often gets colds and feels tired. The doctor says that her immune

system is over working. Other than Echinacea any other ideas please. She is

also taking Carduus M.



Regards, Rochelle

www.rochellemarsden.co.uk





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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Immune system

From: "Aliceann or Scott" <carlton@midrivers.com>

Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2002 14:55:19 -0700

--------

I wouldn't recommend echinacea.  Auto-immune problems thrive on immune

building....



During acute flare-ups or times when the system seems to be going through

one infection after another....it is not a good idea to stoke the

auto-attack mode by building up the immune system.



It took years for my daughter, now 23, to convince doctors that immune

rebuilding was the trigger to her lupus flares, self-destruction of red

cells and T-cells and associated anemia, recurrent infections etc.



In fact, when she was diagnosed at 19 with mixed type of leukemia, she felt

better with her immune system completely crashed than beforehand.  She also

didn't get sick no matter where she went or what she was exposed to.



Interferon and stem cell therapy gave her the first life she'd ever had with

an immune system.  She was distinctly annoyed to discover what a regular

cold was like as she was used to the direct transition to pneumonia.  So,

echinacea (and cohorts), iron pills, and vitamin C are not in her bag of

health maintainance therapies.  I don't know what others' experiences are

but that's what hers has been.  Patients I have treated with autoimmune

disease symptoms also do poorly on immune building therapies.



Better to support lymph clearing and palliative blood cleansing....in

moderation.  Best is to improve digestion and cut down by doing so on

triggers to autoimmune attack against body cells.



FWIW....



Regards,

Aliceann





----- Original Message -----

From: rochelle

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2002 2:18 PM

Subject: [Herb] Immune system





I have a patient who has had a blood test that shows that her ESR levels are

very high. This means an auto immune disease. At the moment we don't know

what. She often gets colds and feels tired. The doctor says that her immune

system is over working. Other than Echinacea any other ideas please.





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Immune system

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2002 09:24:17 +0200

--------

"Aliceann or Scott" <carlton@midrivers.com> wrote to <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>:



> I wouldn't recommend echinacea.  Auto-immune problems thrive on immune

> building....



Echinacea can be _very_ good for people with auto-immune problems. Your daughter

obviously excluded; but don't throw out Ech based on just one person's

experience; contrast it with other auto-immune people's experience, who can keep

spurious infections at bay with - Ech.



Henriette



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Immune system

From: "Aliceann or Scott" <carlton@midrivers.com>

Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2002 07:34:06 -0700

--------

Could be Henriette.  I recall that one variety of Echinacea seems more

active in building T-Cells and another is more macrophage active.  (The

specific research results I do not have at hand...they came through Abbas

Qutab a couple of years ago). I can only speak from one very close up

experience, and the experiences I have had with other patients with auto-

immune disorders.



What seems a safer bet to me is to use burdock root, marshmallow root, and

jasmine.  Hibiscus also seems to be well tolerated and supports red blood

cell production.   For digestive function and liver clearing, my preferences

are turmeric and barberry, trikatu and asafoetida, and triphala as well as

dandelion root.  For women with reproductive system autoimmune problems,

shatavari (Asparagus racemosis) can be a help as well in my experience.



The specific choices of herbs and formulations depend upon constitution and

assessment of course.  Behind all the herbs, though, is a foundation of

fresh and pure water, drunk hot with lemon three times a day, and cool

throughout the day.  When there is weakness and loss of energy a little pear

juice diluted in water seems to help as well.



Marshmallow, jasmine and hibiscus are immune supporting, but don't seem be

"above the radar" so to speak.  They work well on rasa (lymph) clearing and

rebuilding.    For "exposure to life" infections I usually use basil, sage,

barberry, neem, gotu kola, black pepper, pippali, turmeric, burdock root,

dandelion root....herbs that support clearing and reducing as much as

possible.



I would like to learn more of others' experiences regarding auto-immune

approaches.



Thanks,

Best Regards,

Aliceann



 --



--- Original Message -----

From: Henriette Kress

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2002 12:24 AM

Subject: Re: [Herb] Immune system





"Aliceann or Scott" <carlton@midrivers.com> wrote to

<herb@lists.ibiblio.org>:



> I wouldn't recommend echinacea.  Auto-immune problems thrive on immune

> building....



Echinacea can be _very_ good for people with auto-immune problems. Your

daughter

obviously excluded; but don't throw out Ech based on just one person's

experience; contrast it with other auto-immune people's experience, who can

keep

spurious infections at bay with - Ech.



Henriette







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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Immune system

From: "Denise O'Connor" <rnmsw@bellsouth.net>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 00:19:05 +1030

--------

    Many so called auto immune diseases are caused by an infection.

Fighting the infection and building the immune system may be exactly what is

called for to go into remission.

Denise



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Immune system

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 09:47:29 +0200

--------

"Denise O'Connor" <rnmsw@bellsouth.net> wrote to <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>:



>     Many so called auto immune diseases are caused by an infection.

> Fighting the infection and building the immune system may be exactly what is

> called for to go into remission.



LOTS of autoimmune problems are caused by diet. Eliminate the foods you're

sensitive to and watch your troubles disappear.



Henriette



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Immune system

From: greg patch <patch@berkshire.net>

Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2002 21:45:59 -0500 (EST)

--------

>I would like to learn more of others' experiences regarding auto-immune

>approaches.



>Aliceann



>Echinacea can be _very_ good for people with auto-immune problems.

>Henriette



I've found Echinacea to be very helpfull, ...but overused! We can give it a

break by using other herbs.

Interesting point you bring up Aliceanne is that by

tonifying/stimulating/nutrifying various body systems with "their" herbs,

the immune system is enhanced. Could we say no herb addresses the immune

system because we can not take the immune system out of the body and

display it - joking. Through strengthening various body sytems

immunological strengthening occurs for day to day preventative herbalism.

Other immunological stimulants to think about;

Elecampane rt for lungs/digestion, Milky Oats/Avena sativa as

nervous/digestive nutrition, Schissandra and Astragalus, generally.

Many of the mushrooms/lichens, in consideration of individual

mushroom/lichen sensitivities, are the Ganodermas, Shitake, Chaga, Usnea.

I also like the sea weeds.



Greg

















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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Immune system

From: "Aliceann or Scott" <carlton@midrivers.com>

Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2002 21:44:25 -0700

--------

Your points are well taken greg.  I agree that the variety of herbs and

herbal approaches is of greater value than a one fits all approach.  I like

echinacea on occasion, it works like a decongestant for me during a cold,

but that's occasional use.  It is of great value that this list is so active

because of the variety of experiences and learning.



Best Regards,

Aliceann

----- Original Message -----

From: greg patch



<SNIPS>



I've found Echinacea to be very helpfull, ...but overused! We can give it a

break by using other herbs.

Interesting point you bring up Aliceanne is that by

tonifying/stimulating/nutrifying various body systems with "their" herbs,

the immune system is enhanced. Could we say no herb addresses the immune

system because we can not take the immune system out of the body and

display it - joking.



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Immune system

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2002 18:02:31 -0600

--------

Aliceann,

Very interesting. Would you share what herbs are lymph building?

Linda S.





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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Immune system

From: "rochelle" <rochelle@ntlworld.com>

Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2002 18:35:13 -0000

--------

Thanks for the informative posts. We did discuss  dandelion. She has a lot

sprouting in her garden and will use the root to make a tea (or buy

dandelion teabags) and the leaves in salads.

I am getting a bit cautious about  using Berberis as I have had one or 2

patients get proving (as in homeopathic provings) symptoms from the tincture

although  I know I prescribe far lower doses than you professional

herbalists do!!  I am even beginning to wonder if Chelidonium is gentler

although I have never given this.



Now I am aware that with chemotherapy and steroid treatment you shouldn't

take Echinacea how ever in this case I hope it will be balancing.



We were taught at homeopathic college that the spleen was involved with

autoimmune diseases and that a good plant is Ceanothus which I can't get in

UK as a tincture as it is not indigenous. I have got it in a 3x potency

though. Any thoughts on this please?



Regards, Rochelle

www.rochellemarsden.co.uk





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Immune system

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2002 23:10:31 +0200

--------

"rochelle" <rochelle@ntlworld.com> wrote to <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>:



> Thanks for the informative posts. We did discuss  dandelion. She has a lot

> sprouting in her garden and will use the root to make a tea (or buy

> dandelion teabags) and the leaves in salads.



If she digs roots in autumn, and dries them all sliced up, she can just nibble

them. That's not a good idea with spring-dug roots, they're just bitter then.

(Autumn-dug are sweet, almost).



> I am getting a bit cautious about using Berberis as I have had one or 2

> patients get proving (as in homeopathic provings) symptoms from the tincture

> although I know I prescribe far lower doses than you professional

> herbalists do!!  I am even beginning to wonder if Chelidonium is gentler

> although I have never given this.



Chelidonium is harsher by far than Berberis. It's also been implicated in one

(or more? I forget) case of liver failure. 



Chelidonium and Berberis do different things. Chelidonium heats your gall

bladder, Berberis heats your liver. (Yes, there is a difference).



My guess is, you gave Berberis/Mahonia to people with "hot" livers. They can't

take it and will break out in rashes and such. Give them dandelion or burdock

roots, instead. 



People with "cool" livers can't take dandelion/burdock - they get very strung

out (not quite overtired but almost). They should take Berberis/Mahonia or

yellow dock instead.



Of course, most people can take either just fine; it's the people on the edges

who react. The person with a really cool liver and liver-cooling diet to go with

that will flip on dandelion; the person with a hot hot liver and a liver-heating

diet to boot _will_ get a rash when using Berberis.



> We were taught at homeopathic college that the spleen was involved with

> autoimmune diseases and that a good plant is Ceanothus which I can't get in

> UK as a tincture as it is not indigenous. I have got it in a 3x potency

> though. Any thoughts on this please?



You'll find Ceanothus in the nursery catalogues - it's an ornamental bush, at

least over here. You can also buy dried Ceanothus root from Blessed Herbs (in

the US), among others. I think of Ceanothus as one of the great lymphatic liver

herbs, alongside plants like ocotillo (Fouquieria). Both will help with fat

digestion (partly fat organization in the gut, partly lymph system, partly

liver). A more local plant that does the same (at least in terms of fat

digestion) might be mugwort (Artemisia vulgaris) or sage (Salvia officinalis).



Cheers

Henriette



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Immune system

From: "rochelle" <rochelle@ntlworld.com>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 23:14:30 -0000

--------

Yet again Henrietta - thanks for the informative post. You wrote:-



<<Of course, most people can take either just fine; it's the people on the

edges

who react. The person with a really cool liver and liver-cooling diet to go

with

that will flip on dandelion; the person with a hot liver and a liver-heating

diet to boot _will_ get a rash when using Berberis.>



How do we know if someone has a hot or a cold liver??



The symptoms I have had with Berberis are joint pain  from one patient (a

new symptom) and radiating pain from the kidney area ( again a new symptom)

both of which are proving symptoms found in the homeopathic texts. with the

first the Berbers was discontinued and with the second a couple of doses of

Berberis 30C (a homeopathic potency) stopped it within 1/2 hour.



Regards, Rochelle



www.rochellemarsden.co.uk





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: FAQ update - mailing lists?

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2002 03:31:42 -0500 (EST)

--------

8.1.2 The Aromatherapy List

(Alive and well. Contentious. Dec00)



I just prepared my unsub message for this list.  I've been there for about four

months, learning nothing usable so far regarding aromatherapy.  A lot of talk

about NAHA's misdoings, misuse of Raindrop Therapy, a lot of 

non-aromatherapy-related stuff.  And a lot of excess quoting, where one quotes

the entire message being responded to, including the unsub instructions which

are automatically appended to each message: just what you (Henriette) refuse to

tolerate.  I get tired of downloading 200 lines preceded by '>' that I already

downloaded from a recent previous message.  A waste of my time, and a large part

of the reason why I am so late with this response.





8.1.7 The Culinary Herblists

(Both are almost dead. Jan01)



Moderate activity at times, I wouldn't say near-dead, though there are lulls

where I see no activity.

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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Pure Water

From: "Kevin Chisholm" <kchisholm@ca.inter.net>

Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2002 11:18:57 -0400

--------

Dear Alice Ann



...del...

> assessment of course.  Behind all the herbs, though, is a foundation of

> fresh and pure water, drunk hot with lemon three times a day, and cool

> throughout the day.

...del...

>

What constitutes "pure water?"



From a chemical standpoint, the only "pure water' is a distilled water.



From a sterility standpoint, any heavily chlorinated and microfiltered water

is "pure."



From a "general" standpoint, as long as it does not have bugs and heavy

metals in it, and does not have visible sediment, it is pure.



From a "concerned" standpoint, as long as it doesn't have bugs, or heavy

metals, and as long as you run it through a charcoal filter, it is pure.



What elements should be in water, so that it is "pure?"



Are there factors other than chemical elements and compounds that should be,

or should not be,  associated with water for it to be pure?



Are there other paradigms for determining if water is "pure?



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Pure Water

From: "Aliceann or Scott" <carlton@midrivers.com>

Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2002 19:00:37 -0700

--------

No not distilled water Kevin.....no matter what the chemical process etc.  I

don't think sterile is the path either when talking about pure water.  For

those of us old folks who grew up with dug wells, creeks and springs a clear

pool of sweet water is a part of those memories.



As much as possible, water should be from an uncontaminated source.  It can

be enlivened by pouring it back and forth between two glass or copper bowls

for aeration.  We use water from a reverse osmosis filter here in alkali

Montana.



I assume there is no longer such a thing as pure water, from any depth, from

any spring, from any glacier or mountain stream....so purity is a matter of

best attempts.



Water I prefer to drink is without taste or odor....although I've had some

pretty good swamp water in the past on treks.  "Pure" water tastes fresh;

there's no other description.  That doesn't mean of course that it isn't

loaded with all the by products of chemistry and agriculture. Researching

that is up to each of us and what our bodies can tolerate.  Many minerals in

water are those needed by the body as are some of the salts...not so sure

about the radioactive and glow in the dark particles however.





----- Original Message -----

From: Kevin Chisholm

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2002 8:18 AM

Subject: [Herb] Pure Water





Dear Alice Ann



What constitutes "pure water?"



>From a chemical standpoint, the only "pure water' is a distilled water.



>From a sterility standpoint, any heavily chlorinated and microfiltered

water

is "pure."



>From a "general" standpoint, as long as it does not have bugs and heavy

metals in it, and does not have visible sediment, it is pure.



>From a "concerned" standpoint, as long as it doesn't have bugs, or heavy

metals, and as long as you run it through a charcoal filter, it is pure.



What elements should be in water, so that it is "pure?"



Are there factors other than chemical elements and compounds that should be,

or should not be,  associated with water for it to be pure?



Are there other paradigms for determining if water is "pure?







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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2002 18:11:36 -0600

--------

On a whim I bought an ounce of dried cut and sifted SJW at the local herb

store yesterday. Along with comfrey and chamomile, I added some olive oil. I

did a hot water bath for two hours, but it didn't turn the typical red that

I was hoping for. I was thinking I would set it in sunlight for the next

couple days, as well as do the water bath a few more times. Is there still

hope that it will become red, or would it have already happened if it was

going to happen?



Kerry





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net>

Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2002 17:33:57 -0700

--------

>On a whim I bought an ounce of dried cut and sifted SJW at the local herb

>store yesterday.

>

the last time Itried to use dried SJW to make oil it took a year of 

sitting before it turned red. The oil I usually make is only from 

fresh stuff.

sharon in tucson

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 09:46:37 +0200

--------

"Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com> wrote to <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>:



> On a whim I bought an ounce of dried cut and sifted SJW at the local herb

> store yesterday. Along with comfrey and chamomile, I added some olive oil. I

> did a hot water bath for two hours, but it didn't turn the typical red that

> I was hoping for. I was thinking I would set it in sunlight for the next

> couple days, as well as do the water bath a few more times. Is there still

> hope that it will become red, or would it have already happened if it was

> going to happen?



Pro: waterbath won't turn the oil red (or at least, not very). 

Contra: dried herb, if old enough (and any you've bought now is too old; they've

picked it last summer, too), is pretty much inert. 

Pro: you only bought an ounce.

Contra: you added other herbs to the oil. When I do a SJW oil it's ONLY SJW.

When I make that oil into a salve (and only then) I add calendula, no others.

Calendula being far better than comfrey because

- it doesn't smell (YECH, the smell of well-dried comfrey root. Gak.)

- it contains no hepatotoxic pyrrolizidine alkaloids (which can be absorbed,

  especially through open wounds... you weren't going to use the olde wound herb

  comfrey on an open wound, were you? Thought so.)

- it's very pretty when it grows, as opposed to comfrey, which is likely to flop

  all over the place (or at least, the three or four species in my garden do).



Tell me, why did you add chamomile to that oil? Haven't heard of that one in an

oil before.



If your oil hasn't turned red after four days in the sun it won't turn at all.

Another waterbath won't help; 2 hours is plenty.



So pick it yourself in June/July, and make an oil from the fresh or recently

dried herb. An herb oil being defined as "cram as much herb as can possibly fit

into that there oil without leaving mountains and valleys on the surface" - ie.

cover all the herb with oil, and leave no "empty" oil - if you do it the

waterbath way. Your chopstick should stand upright in the mass.



And if you want to use SJW you've dried yourself over the whole year (as a tea,

say, which is quite as effective as the tincture, provided the herb is _fresh_),

freeze it the minute it's dried, except for what you estimate to be perhaps 2

months worth. 

Note, when you freeze any dried herb, chop it up first; that way, it's easy to

take just a dollop from the bag/jar.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 07:37:20 -0600

--------

Contra: you added other herbs to the oil. When I do a SJW oil it's ONLY SJW.

When I make that oil into a salve (and only then) I add calendula, no

others.

Calendula being far better than comfrey because

- it doesn't smell (YECH, the smell of well-dried comfrey root. Gak.)

- it contains no hepatotoxic pyrrolizidine alkaloids (which can be absorbed,

  especially through open wounds... you weren't going to use the olde wound

herb

  comfrey on an open wound, were you? Thought so.)





I use the leaf, and other than having a "green" smell, I don't find it

objectionable. I'm also in the camp that believes topical use of comfrey,

even on open wounds, does not pose the same risk as, say, isolating

pyrrlizidine alkaloids and injecting them in insanely high amounts into the

peritoneal cavity of newborn mice. Thank you for your concern, though. ;-)



*****************************



Tell me, why did you add chamomile to that oil? Haven't heard of that one in

an

oil before.



I was planning on turning the oil into a salve, and I like to put chamomile

(Matricaria) in many of my salves. I find its topical use helpful for skin

stuff like eczema and dermatitis, plus I've noticed it confers a nice mildly

sweet smell to the finished product.



***********************************



If your oil hasn't turned red after four days in the sun it won't turn at

all.

Another waterbath won't help; 2 hours is plenty.



So pick it yourself in June/July, and make an oil from the fresh or recently

dried herb.



Unfortunately, 4 days in the sun is going to take about 2 weeks to achieve,

with the weather the way it's been. Thank you for your feedback, it was very

helpful! I'm planning on trying to pick some this summer, I'll be taking

some herbal walks on my parents' 40 acres in the country.



Kerry





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: NEHrbSup@aol.com

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 09:51:38 EST

--------



<<t contains no hepatotoxic pyrrolizidine alkaloids (which can be absorbed,

  especially through open wounds..>>. 



Question here Reverend Mother -  for the edification of the class and some of 

us that are not, hopefully, still laboring under a misconception.  For things 

like comfrey in a salve or for its wound healing properties, are not the 

larger "older" leaves much better to use because they have little or none of 

the pyrrolizidine alkaloids in them but still have the constituents that 

cause wounds to heal incredibly quickly??   Or has recent research that I am 

behind on reading indicated something different?



The rest of my offering is an addition to the comments you  offered.   Fresh 

is indeed the only way to go with Hypericum and if one has the field or 

meadow available with the plants in it, then restrict the picking to the 

flowers, buds and only a bare minimum of the uppermost leave nearest the 

flowers.  Even in a "sun oil" I get color within a day or two of putting 

fresh flower and bud into a bath.  I also let them sit for 8 weeks and what 

starts out as a pale pink migrates to a deep purple by the end of the   

infusion process.  The smell is wonderfully rich and pungent.  I have also 

taken to using apricot kernel oil as it will not turn rancid quite as quickly 

and has some other benefits when it comes to healing.



my two cents worth

peter





Peter Byram, CNC Herbalist

New England Herbal Supply Co.

299 Jagger Lane

Hebron, Connecticut 06248

860-228-9199  -  Fax 860-228-9399

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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: "Michelle Morton-niyama" <lakshmi@kingcon.com>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 11:38:01 -0500

--------

I have also

> taken to using apricot kernel oil as it will not turn rancid quite as

quickly

> and has some other benefits when it comes to healing





peter-

as quickly as what?

In my experience- apricot goes rancid far faster than olive- which I use

exclusively for extracting into- then I add Jojoba or other oils for their

healing benefits (rose hip seed, callophyllum, essential oils)

and I must also add- fresh is the only way to do SJW!

Michelle



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 19:37:52 -0500

--------

Michelle Morton-niyama wrote:



> I have also

> > taken to using apricot kernel oil as it will not turn rancid quite as

> quickly

> > and has some other benefits when it comes to healing

>

> peter-

> as quickly as what?

> In my experience- apricot goes rancid far faster than olive- which I use

> exclusively for extracting into- then I add Jojoba or other oils for their

> healing benefits (rose hip seed, callophyllum, essential oils)



I have been using fractionated coconut oil almost exclusively now for a couple

of years.  It it much less expensive than jojoba, has a very long shelf life,

appears to absorb quickly and is non-greasy, so it makes a wonderful skin

salve.  I know it's not 100% 'natural', so some may object to it, but I love

it.



May

--

I try to take one day at a time, but sometimes several days attack me at

once.   ---Jennifer Unlimited





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 19:29:34 +0200

--------

NEHrbSup@aol.com wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> like comfrey in a salve or for its wound healing properties, are not the 

> larger "older" leaves much better to use because they have little or none of 

> the pyrrolizidine alkaloids in them but still have the constituents that 



Possibly. I don't use any comfreys; I like calendula too much.



> infusion process.  The smell is wonderfully rich and pungent.  I have also 

> taken to using apricot kernel oil as it will not turn rancid quite as quickly 

> and has some other benefits when it comes to healing.



For Hypericum I like sesame oil, because it's so light.



But really, any of the cold-pressed vit-e rich ones will do. 



Apricot kernel? Not available in bulk over here, or at least, my wholesaler

doesn't carry it in 5 l (5+ quart (US)) jars.



And I bottle my oil after 1.5 hours in a waterbath, sieve, and 4-10 days in the

sun, minus the bottom muck that forms in that tall jar in that sunny window when

you've infused a fresh herb. If you do SJW oil in a sunny window, in a jar (ie.

not the waterbath method) you _have_ to put a deep plate under it, else you'll

have brown rings forever more on your windowsill.



Also, some research says that it's not all that important to pick only

flowers/buds; that in fact the seeds are what's important when you make an oil

for bruises. Not that I'd stoop to picking only SJW seeds; where would be the

fun in that? I _like_ hunting for yellow blooms in hiding, in the tall grass.

And that basketfull of yellow flowering tops (2-3", mainly) gives me a real

sense of achievement, of a summer afternoon. A basketfull of brownish-green

seeding tops wouldn't even be half as satisfactory.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 19:50:03 -0500

--------

Henriette Kress wrote:



> Possibly. I don't use any comfreys; I like calendula too much.



Do you find it equally as healing as comfrey, for wounds?  I find it wonderful for

skin, but I haven't tried it all by itself for wound healing.



> Also, some research says that it's not all that important to pick only

> flowers/buds; that in fact the seeds are what's important when you make an oil

> for bruises. Not that I'd stoop to picking only SJW seeds; where would be the

> fun in that? I _like_ hunting for yellow blooms in hiding, in the tall grass.



I take the top couple inches of plant in bud/bloom.  It's always a beautiful garnet

red in just a few days.



So the flowering tops are not effective against bruising?  Or just not as effective?



Alas, the days of hunting in tall grass are over, here in Connecticut, the Lyme

disease capital of the world.  I was treated for Lyme about seven years ago in East

Lyme.



May

--

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---Jennifer Unlimited





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 08:56:34 +0200

--------

May Terry <mterry@snet.net> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> Do you find it equally as healing as comfrey, for wounds? 



Yes.



[SJW:]

> So the flowering tops are not effective against bruising?  Or just not as effective?



Sure they are. But some research says the seeds would be even better. So don't

chuck out the occasional seed that makes it into the basket.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 01:38:26 -0500 (EST)

--------

from May Terry:



>Alas, the days of hunting in tall grass are over, here in Connecticut, the Lyme

>disease capital of the world.  I was treated for Lyme about seven years ago 

>in East Lyme.



Days of hunting in tall grass are very limited in Kentucky too, because of

chiggers, though the effects of chiggers are likely to be gone in three weeks.

Could you dress well for protection against the tiny ticks, starting with high

boots?  Would anything less than waterproof raincoat and rain pants be

sufficient?

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 06:18:05 -0500

--------

Thomas Mueller wrote:



> >Alas, the days of hunting in tall grass are over, here in Connecticut, the Lyme

> >disease capital of the world.  I was treated for Lyme about seven years ago

> >in East Lyme.

>

> Days of hunting in tall grass are very limited in Kentucky too, because of

> chiggers, though the effects of chiggers are likely to be gone in three weeks.

> Could you dress well for protection against the tiny ticks, starting with high

> boots?  Would anything less than waterproof raincoat and rain pants be

> sufficient?



Unfortunately, no.  The ticks are so tiny they are extremely difficult to locate

(especially in the nymph stage).  Most people who get the typical circular rash

never knew they had a tick on them.  Worse yet, many who get Lyme never had the

rash, though of course it could have been hidden by their hair.  And its results are

far more devastating than chiggers.  I've known people who have had severe

arthritis, Bell's Palsy that never went away, endocarditis, psychotic symptoms, and

severe chronic-fatigue type symptoms, among many others.  I was fortunate to have a

doctor who recognized my headache and flu-type symptoms, followed by knee pain after

about a month, who treated me aggressively with doxycycline.  I wouldn't fool with

herbs for this one, although of course they can be helpful used along with the

antibiotic.  But that's just my choice, I suppose.  I have known people who've

claimed success with homeopathic treatment, but Lyme's symptoms can remit and then

come back.  Not fun.



May



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---Jennifer Unlimited





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 13:41:33 -0600

--------





I would really like to know what all you use herb oils for?  I read one uses 

hypericum for bruises.  I know oils are good for massages, as I was a 

massage therapist. Hypericum is great for stressed areas during massage.  I 

would love to hear what different oils you use for different reasons please? 

The arnica oil is great for sore muscles and arthitic pain, etc. Thanks so 

much for your input.

Linda S.



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 15:01:24 -0600

--------

Well, after a day in the sun, the oil is now a dingy brown color, as opposed

to a bright green-gold which is usually the case with my other salves (a

result of the comfrey and plantain, I imagine). So I haven't totally given

up hope yet.



Kerry





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: HerbalSW@aol.com

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 07:26:11 EST

--------

Is there a blood test for Lyme's disease?



Catherine M. Wood, LCSW, CADC, ADS

Eagle Spirit Healing Center

Where Your Spirit Learns To Soar

www.eaglespirithealingcenter.com

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: "Cylise" <cyli@visi.com>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 11:28:41 -0600

--------

Mail message body

--------





On 21 Mar 2002 at 7:26, HerbalSW@aol.com wrote:



Is there a blood test for Lyme's disease?



Yes, at least two.  I've heard you should get both, as the most used 

one is apt to giving false negatives, but I'd not know. I had the 

ring, which is definitive.

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Getting hypericum oil to turn red

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 13:30:16 -0500

--------

HerbalSW@aol.com wrote:



> Is there a blood test for Lyme's disease?



I'm not an expert, but yes, I believe they use an ELISA followed by a

Western blot, which is much more accurate than what was available when I

was diagnosed.  You can check here for more information:



http://www.lymenet.org/



May

--

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once.   ---Jennifer Unlimited





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Necessity of Hair and Urine analyses

From: NEHrbSup@aol.com

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 12:10:08 EST

--------

Kevin



<<Is a hair or urine analysis even necessary?>>



Absolutely -  



<<Wouldn't the mere presence of Candidia be a proof that mercury was present 

to excess?>>



No.  This is not a situation where "any" candida albicans means Yea, you got 

Hg - or even that an overcolonization means you got it.  which is why I am 

emphatic about testing to rule it "in" or "out"  There are a number of other 

factors that will promote an overgrowth - antibiotics - junk food diet etc.,  

 



<<If hair and urine  showed acceptable mercury, how then could a person have 

Candidia?>>



We all have a bit of candida and , (again I have not explored this as far as 

I should to comment on it intelligently,)  apparently it is necessary in the 

overall makeup of gut mucosa to accomplish some specific task that our bodies 

need.  That said, the balance of this and other pathogenic bacteria to the 

beneficial bacteria should be on the order of 15% to 85%  - more than that 

and you start to experience problems.  



On the "if hair showed acceptable mercury"  question, there is not, in my 

mind, ANY acceptable level of Hg or any other heavy metal in the body.   an 

acceptable level is shown on reports as < 00.0001 or less than the amount 

they need to trigger the analysis equipment.  We are NOT born with heavy 

metals unless our mothers are toxic and it passes in utero to the baby - 

which all heavy metals will -  Metals like lead, cadmium, mercury, arsenic, 

etc., are toxic in any amount and the effects of even a minute amount of one 

of them are only now beginning to be better  (not fully) understood.  When 

you have more than one there is often a synergistic effect that takes the old 

one plus one equals two and throws it out the window - one plus one with 

certain metals can easily equal 5 or 10. -  add to that the recently 

discovered biochemical effects (as opposed to radiological) effects of u-235 

and u-238  which occurs naturally all over the world and you really start to 

compound the problem.  Fortunately there are herbs that are natural chelators 

for lots of what is bad - but until you know what to chelate,  its a waste of 

time and money not to mention just bad practice, to "treat" for something 

that may be present. 



Have you

> ever seen a case of Candidia where mercury was NOT present in excess?>>



yes - and it was because a new client had stopped going to her dermatologist  

after 12 years of CONSTANT antibiotic use to treat acne.  I was both 

flabbergasted and outraged that someone with purported knowledge of body 

chemistry and biology would do that.  I was floored to find out that this is 

indeed a "treatment of choice" for persistent acne and skin disorders.  It 

took 4 months to get things under control and the client is now,  over a year 

later, starting to get proper bowel function and have some hope that she will 

not be "doing this" for the rest of her life.    UGGGGH!



Hope this clarifies it a little.

peter



Peter Byram, CNC, Herbalist

New England Herbal Supply Co.

299 Jagger Lane

Hebron, Connecticut 06248

860-228-9199  -  Fax 860-228-9399

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Necessity of Hair and Urine analyses

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 13:46:06 -0600

--------

I am curious, Peter, and anyone else that knows for sure--what herbs are 

natural chelators and chelators of what?  You mean chelating the plaque off 

the walls of the arteries and such as what else? Please excuse my itiocy.

Linda S.







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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Necessity of Hair and Urine analyses

From: NEHrbSup@aol.com

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 23:34:32 EST

--------

In a message dated 3/18/2002 2:46:58 PM Eastern Standard Time, 

clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com writes:



<< I am curious, Peter, and anyone else that knows for sure--what herbs are 

 natural chelators and chelators of what?  You mean chelating the plaque off 

 the walls of the arteries and such as what else? >>



Linda,

 "chelation" comes from the greek word chelos - which means claw - which best 

describes the process.  Certain herbs and chemicals literally grab (as in 

like a claw would do) the free chemical bonds of the toxic metals in the 

system and pull them from the receptor sites that were meant for another 

beneficial metal or a hormone or something else that the body needs.   Some 

chelators don't do as good a job as others and some don't have the ability to 

form "complete" bonds with the junk they are pulling free so there is a good 

possibility that stuff will be redeposited someplace else in the system.  The 

best herbal chelators that I am aware of are cilantro which is wonderful for 

mercury and to a lessor degree antimony, wood sorrell which has a particular 

affinity for lead and cadmium and though not technically an herb  - the algae 

chlorella, which loves everything and will complete the chemical bonds that 

are free, making it much easier to get junk out of your body. I believe that 

rue wil also chelate tin.   There is a number of people that are currently 

looking for other true chelators in the plant world both to help with 

detoxing contaminated sites and for the obvious benefits to personal health.  



Much of the stuff you read about regarding cardivascular health has to do 

with chemicals  that will chelate out the calcium which has been implicated 

as the "glue" that holds artherosclerotic plaque together in the arterial 

walls - these are not herbs and have names that go on for 30 letters - edta, 

dmsa, dmps etc - all of which work and all of which can, in the wrong hands, 

be more deadly than the problem you set out to fix.  

So concludes the mini lesson on chelation (pronounced Key-lation)

hope this helps a little

peter   

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Necessity of Hair and Urine analyses

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 07:42:16 -0600

--------

Thank you Peter for the info on chelation.  I am interested in plaque 

chelation.

Linda







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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 22:47:22 +0200

--------

"Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> I would really like to know what all you use herb oils for?  I read one uses 

> hypericum for bruises.  I know oils are good for massages, as I was a 

> massage therapist. Hypericum is great for stressed areas during massage.  I 

> would love to hear what different oils you use for different reasons please? 

> The arnica oil is great for sore muscles and arthitic pain, etc. Thanks so 

> much for your input.



I make oils into salves - just add beeswax. Oils as oils are too messy for me,

and because it's difficult to just take a little you use more; salves give more

bang for the herb.



Different ones: 

- Hypericum - for swellings due to trauma. That includes some (but not all)

  joint troubles.

- Berberis root + burdock leaf. This is the old standby for skin troubles,

  touted in all the books for psoriasis. Actually, it helps only about half the

  people with psoriasis whom I've given it to; the other half do better on

  Hypericum.

- Calendula. The Woundhealer. Another would be Plantago leaf, but that one's

  such a lot of work to pick that I usually go with Calendula. Except when I

  have a flock of students with too much energy, in which case I tell them to

  pick Plantago leaf, lots, after which we make plantago oil and salve, and

  plantago syrup.

- Rose and lavender. Both are soothing to the skin, but both are far more just

  luxury rather than actually useful. Add calendula for that extra zing -

  there's few more pleasant things than to be told, at a fair or the other, that

  "your rose salve is so excellent, and it got rid of <insert intractable thing>

  wounds too! I usually double infuse dried rosebuds as a single infusion

  doesn't cut it. Lavender is strong enough for just the usual.

- Stellaria media and Impatiens sp., for itchy skin. Good for things like atopic

  dermatitis, even if that's just treating the symptom... people do want them,

  even though I always say to stop these things internally, ie. by helping the

  liver and changing the diet.

- Aesculus leaf (or green seed, or bark). Excellent for hemorrhoids, varicose

  veins and couparosa skin. Add oak leaves (picked when still young and soft) to

  make a real killer salve for these. One lady went through four jars in a year,

  but her varicosities had shrunk amazingly.

- Meadowsweet (Filipendula) or balsam of gilead buds (Populus balsamifera), for

  pain. 

- Thuja or Cypress. They are pretty good for your normal run of the mill fungi,

  like the foot fungi you pick up at the swimming hall and such. Preventative,

  too - just use them on your feet before you go home.

- Black pepper, cayenne, mustard and ginger, all as powders, make a very nice

  heating salve; excellent for cold feet. I tell gents that this is the luxury

  salve for them... just give it to your ladies and tell them to put it on their

  feet before they turn in. Because these are powders they take a very long time

  to drop through; because they're powders I also have them drip through

  large-sized coffee filters instead of the usual cheesecloth. So it's not a

  salve that can be made in front of a class in two hours or so. I forget how

  much of each, but it's about equal amounts of cayenne and ginger (_lots_), a

  dollop of mustard and as much black pepper as you care to wring out of that

  pepper mill. (I never seem to go much beyond 10 grams of pepper...). Cover

  with a good oil and let sit in the waterbath for 1.5 hours; stir every now and

  then.



A good combination oil/salve is

- Meadowsweet, Hypericum and Calendula. You get a full house for parents of

  young kids and for sports people that way: meadowsweet for the pain, hypericum

  for the swelling, and calendula for the wounds. Add scents if you like; I

  sometimes add lavender or peppermint EOs.



and 

- Yarrow is of course good to repel horseflies. Add lavender / meadowsweet and

  make the oil sesame (cold-pressed) and it doubles as an anti-mosquito salve,

  as well.



My salve basket currently holds about 11 salves; what exactly I have available

depends on where I've been teaching and which salves I've been praising the

most. Rose is really delightful.



All my salves are made by adding 1 part (100 g) beeswax to 8 parts (8 dl)

infused herbal oil; melt, stir, pour into jars, let set, close lids, add labels.



I'd be interested in what kind of salves/oils you guys make.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 14:59:39 -0600

--------

I also mainly make my oils into salves. The exceptions to that are calendula

(great to add to homemade diaper wipe solution) and arnica (in addition to a

nice massage oil and used for muscle trauma, it's also great applied

immediately after a bump, and will usually prevent or greatly minimize

swelling/bruising, quite handy to have with small children), and I also make

a teething oil (infused valerian and chamomile, add a little clove oil).



The oils I make into salves are my all-purpose salve, which has calendula,

comfrey, chamomile, plantain and a few other goodies, and an antimicrobial

version of that salve, which also contains OGR, as well as EOs of tea tree

and thyme. That one is WONDERFUL for candida and ringworm.



Kerry





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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Michelle Morton-niyama" <lakshmi@kingcon.com>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 19:08:37 -0500

--------

Thanks Henriette for the informative post on salves!



I am a massage therapist(well right now I am a full time mom-dont practice

much) BUT when I do I use infused oils in my massage practice. Calendula in

olive oil with some jojoba and Lavender EO is especially nice- and lovely

for the skin as well as the deeper tissues, bruising, etc- sometimes I add a

bit of SJW- but I am a bit more stingy with this one because I can only make

so much every year! Theres always a gallon of Calendula oil brewing!

Another oil I love is Chaparral(Larrea tridentata) I do the alcohol

extraction method with this one(sometimes w/ Calendula, too) and this

produces a resin rich, deep green oil that smells like the desert after a

rain storm. I use this oil for skin care (for everything) and for fungal

problems. I also make a salve to which I add Myrrh and Lavandin EOs. I was

recently in the Sonoran Desert and was going to harvest some, but they have

had a DRY year and it just didnt seem very potent- not as resinous as usual.

I love this plant and it hurts to see them plowed down as the desert is

developed- argh.

My favorite luxury salve is made with St Johns Wort oil(for that vibrant

summer energy), shea butter, beeswax and Turkish Rose EO. I use this as my

face cream, and it does

also clear up chapped skin and redness quite well. I use it on my 2 year

old, too- who gets "eczema" if he gets ahold of any unsprouted wheat or corn

in any form!

I make an all purpose salve with SJW, Calendula and Chaparral- it seems to

work well all around. I do an unscented and one with a Croatian Lavender EO,

which works well for skin problems like rashes and blemishes.

When I lived in California I made a "spring garden salve' at this time of

the year...plantain, dock leaves, calendula, chickweed,and whatever else was

there...I used them fresh,experimented with a wee bit of alcohol to extract

more goodies,made a "green slurry" in the blender, steeped for a day and

pured the oil off the water. Amazingly- this did not grow mold- and was very

potent and effective. Wont be making that one at this time of the year in

Vermont- we just had several inches of snow today!  Now wheres that SJW rose

balm...

 To Spring!

Michelle



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: greg patch <patch@berkshire.net>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 21:51:05 -0500 (EST)

--------

Great reading all the different approaches and calls for favorites!

I like to make the oils with fresh, semi dried herb, with olive, sometimes

almond, oils infused in jars. I leave them on average 4-6 wks as to when

they begin to sing. Making the salves, simple or formula, from the oils

with beeswax, leaving some oils for use as is, or, in mixes.

Have had fun experimenting with Dandelion flower, leaf, root each/combined,

making early spring batches for spring/summer and early fall for

fall/winter applications. Dandelion is versatile in so many ways! I pick St

Johnswort flowering tops/hand width, fresh dried, and redred oil. White

Pine - also great for deep tissue massage, usually cambrian layer of

branches fallen from springs winds, some from spring new growth tips.

Calendula fl, Plantain major lf, Comfrey/whole plant, Yarrow fl, Red Clover

fl, Self Heal/Prunella vulgaris herb, Mullein fl and Garlic are regulars.

This past years favorite salve is White Pine bk, Plantain lf, SJW fl., and

Comfrey rt. I see it as some bark, some leaf, some flower and some root

from some of my favorites.

I heard recently Black Walnut green hulls make for good defense with the

black flies, here in the NE US - eh, anyone?, with this years draught they

shouldn't be too bad.

Respectfully,

Greg



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: May Terry <mterry@snet.net>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 22:12:37 -0500

--------

Henriette Kress wrote:



> I'd be interested in what kind of salves/oils you guys make.



I mix half arnica oil and half hypericum oil, add beeswax, sometimes rosemary and

lavender EO.  Wonderful for aches and pains.



Mothers love plain calendula salve for their kids and their own hands.  Lavender EO

is nice for a hand salve.



I have made plain chickweed salve, but it doesn't work all that well on eczema

patches, which itch more than anything I've ever had.  I tried adding cleavers oil,

but it didn't really help.  (Ideas?)



Broadleaf plantain is plentiful here, so I have that around for skin sores.  Very

healing.  Sometimes I mix plantain and calendula oils to make a healing salve.

Sometimes I throw in a bit of comfrey, but I only use this when I need the big guns.



I have made black walnut hull salve, but you have to be careful, unless you want to

turn brown.  Someone suggested I try it on my rosacea.  Since metronidazole gel (an

antifungal medication) is used on rosacea, they assumed the cause was fungal...which

I don't think is true.  I think it's just prescribed for its anti-inflammatory

properties.  In any case, the salve didn't control the rash.



May

--

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---Jennifer Unlimited





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: Art Sackett <asackett@artsackett.com>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 23:20:30 -0700

--------

On Mon, Mar 18, 2002 at 10:12:37PM -0500, May Terry wrote:



> I have made plain chickweed salve, but it doesn't work all that well on eczema

> patches, which itch more than anything I've ever had.  I tried adding cleavers oil,

> but it didn't really help.  (Ideas?)



It's not herbal, but (nci) Grandpa's Pine Tar Soap might just do the

trick. http://www.grandpabrands.com/ 



-- 

----   Art Sackett   ----



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 09:00:13 +0200

--------

May Terry <mterry@snet.net> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> I have made plain chickweed salve, but it doesn't work all that well on eczema

> patches, which itch more than anything I've ever had.  I tried adding cleavers oil,

> but it didn't really help.  (Ideas?)



Fresh herb, not dried, for both of them. And if they still don't help, make them

into a water to spray onto the skin instead: chop up, leave in cold water in the

fridge overnight, sieve, dilute, use up within 2 days.



Henriette



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: greg patch <patch@berkshire.net>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 23:31:01 -0500 (EST)

--------



>I have made black walnut hull salve, but you have to be careful, unless

>you want to

>turn brown.



Thanks May, If I trusted BW as effective, I'd trade in the red, and, the

itch from black fly infestation for the brown.

Greg





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 21:34:47 -0600

--------





I have some red clover flowers and am thinking about making a salve out of 

them with the method you described.  What kinds of problems do you use the 

red clover salve for? I also have some chopped plantain, mullein, goldenseal 

and echinacea.   Maybe I will give it a whirl. I have never infused oil and 

made a salve.  Might be fun.

Linda S.



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 21:36:01 -0600

--------





I am also curious about the dandelion for salve?? Hmmm. Hadn't thought of 

that. For what?

Linda S.



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: greg patch <patch@berkshire.net>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 23:30:57 -0500 (EST)

--------

>I am also curious about the dandelion for salve?? Hmmm. Hadn't thought of

>that. For what?

>Linda S.



Makes for treating skin dryness, cysts, tumors. As a massage oil for

tenderness, pain in breasts, both for women and men, and with adolescent

girls and boys often experiencing great discomfort through pubescence. The

flower and leaf are anodyne. As a liver herb, think of the organ, skin as

connected to liver. Its cleansing for liver, also for skin - cleansing

pores, and all parts just plain nourishing, softening and moisturizing for

skin. It also enters the body through the skin and travels the blood stream

inwardly. The root is bactericide, fungicide and astringing. Formulate it

for needs.

Greg





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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Leppihalme, Miikkali" <leppihalme@quartal.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 11:17:50 +0200

--------

Henriette:

> I'd be interested in what kind of salves/oils you guys make.



Each year I make a salve for cuts, scrapes, burns, insect stings and such. It's just Calendula (and sometimes Comfrey too) double-infused in cold-pressed rapeseed oil. I add some Lavender or Thyme EO for a nice fragrance and antimicrobial purposes.



This year, now that I've moved to the countryside, I hope to find patches of SJW and make a massage oil.



> All my salves are made by adding 1 part (100 g) beeswax to 8 

> parts (8 dl) infused herbal oil; melt, stir, pour into jars,

> let set, close lids, add labels.



Same same. Hardly surprising, I learned that from you.



-

M

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 09:05:13 -0600

--------

Hi. On the double-infused oil salve, what exactly does that mean?  Do you 

make an infusion first before you put herb in the oil to macerate and how do 

you drain off the water (if so)?  My memory is lacking. Didn't take my 

ginkgo today.

Linda S.







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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 17:59:20 +0200

--------

"Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> Hi. On the double-infused oil salve, what exactly does that mean?  Do you 

> make an infusion first before you put herb in the oil to macerate and how do 

> you drain off the water (if so)?  My memory is lacking. Didn't take my 

> ginkgo today.



A double infusion is a double infusion.



Put some herb in oil, let it sit on a waterbath for 1.5-2 hours, strain, put

some more herb into the same oil, let sit on the waterbath 1.5-2 hours, strain.



> I am wondering, again, about mullein in a salve.  How do you get those 

> itchies out?



Coffee filter instead of sieve or cheesecloth.



> Ok, just one more question please? I know the fresh herb is better but I 

> have bunches of dried herbs that have been in the freezer.  How well will 

> these work? I need to do something with all this stuff.



Dried herb in the freezer (airtight, though) keeps better than dried herb in a

jar. Why did you freeze it in the first place? Or, what did you want to do with

it when you dried it?

If it was, say, SJW for oil, tea or tincture, sure, that'll work, if it was

recently dried when you froze it.

Etc.



Henriette



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 09:08:24 -0600

--------





I am wondering, again, about mullein in a salve.  How do you get those 

itchies out?

Linda



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 09:11:29 -0600

--------





Ok, just one more question please? I know the fresh herb is better but I 

have bunches of dried herbs that have been in the freezer.  How well will 

these work? I need to do something with all this stuff.

Linda S.



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 09:19:51 -0600

--------

It would depend on the herb. Stuff like chickweed or SJW doesn't keep for

more than a few months, other herbs will be good for a year or more. What

does the color look like? Personally, I don't ever use *fresh* herbs in my

oils or salves. Even with stuff I harvest myself, I always dry them first to

remove all water. Since I don't use any preservatives, I take great pains to

make sure there is no water in my oil-based preparations or you're taking a

risk with bacteria colonization.



Kerry



**********************************



Ok, just one more question please? I know the fresh herb is better but I

have bunches of dried herbs that have been in the freezer.  How well will

these work? I need to do something with all this stuff.

Linda S.







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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 18:00:37 +0200

--------

"Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com> wrote to <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>:



> It would depend on the herb. Stuff like chickweed or SJW doesn't keep for

> more than a few months, other herbs will be good for a year or more. What

> does the color look like? Personally, I don't ever use *fresh* herbs in my

> oils or salves. Even with stuff I harvest myself, I always dry them first to

> remove all water. Since I don't use any preservatives, I take great pains to

> make sure there is no water in my oil-based preparations or you're taking a

> risk with bacteria colonization.



Well sure, but a salve with _dried_ Stellaria or Impatiens (or even good old

cucumber) isn't going to do too much, especially when compared to fresh herb

salves of the same herbs.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 10:18:19 -0600

--------

I personally would just never use an herb in an oil or slave that HAS TO BE

used fresh in order for it to work. I just can't take the risk of bacterial

contamination, especially when selling it to others.



Kerry



**********************************



Well sure, but a salve with _dried_ Stellaria or Impatiens (or even good old

cucumber) isn't going to do too much, especially when compared to fresh herb

salves of the same herbs.



Cheers

Henriette







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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Gardenthyme Lady" <dblan@netusa1.net>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 20:55:04 -0500

--------

impatiens (such as jewelweed?)  Right, no way to do it dried.  I used extra

E and heated it slowly for several hours in the crock pot.  I also froze

some fresh jewelweed to use if someone gets poison ivy, good for first

exposure, salve works well if used later I've found.  I didn't have problems

with bacteria, but it was used fairly soon.  Wonderful herb.

Not familiar with Stellaria, is that grown in USA?  What is the common name?

Use?



Dee

"The Gardenthyme Lady"

-----Original Message-----

From: herb-admin@lists.ibiblio.org

[mailto:herb-admin@lists.ibiblio.org]On Behalf Of Henriette Kress

Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2002 11:01 AM

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils







Well sure, but a salve with _dried_ Stellaria or Impatiens (or even good old

cucumber) isn't going to do too much, especially when compared to fresh herb

salves of the same herbs.



Cheers

Henriette



--

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 10:24:13 -0600

--------

Henriette wrote:



"Put some herb in oil, let it sit on a waterbath for 1.5-2 hours, strain, 

put

some more herb into the same oil, let sit on the waterbath 1.5-2 hours, 

strain."



Henriette,

I don't understand what a waterbath is.  You don't put water in with the oil 

do you? You said let it sit _on_ a waterbath.  Or do you put the jar of oil 

and herbs in the waterbath? Duh

I have heard of putting the herbs and oil in a slow oven for that period of 

time. Would that help get out the goodies from the herb?

Linda



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 20:40:13 +0200

--------

"Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> I don't understand what a waterbath is.  You don't put water in with the oil 

> do you? You said let it sit _on_ a waterbath.  Or do you put the jar of oil 

> and herbs in the waterbath? Duh



Get a basic herbal, one with salve recipes. There you'll see a nice waterbath in

pictures.



Henriette



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 10:27:11 -0600

--------



Henriette wrote:



"Dried herb in the freezer (airtight, though) keeps better than dried herb 

in a

jar. Why did you freeze it in the first place? Or, what did you want to do 

with

it when you dried it?

If it was, say, SJW for oil, tea or tincture, sure, that'll work, if it was

recently dried when you froze it"



Henriette,



Well, I ordered or bought these herbs that sounded good at the time. I 

couldn't throw them out! (Where is Karen Vaughn anyway?) Now I want to do 

something with them.  They can't be all bad, can they? I have some pretty 

new red clover blossoms. Thanks for your input.



Linda S.



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 10:29:46 -0600

--------

Well, ok, Kerry. So you use dried herbs. Great. So they must be ok for me to 

use.  Fantastic.  I have a _bunch_ of dried herbs.  I really want to start 

using them.

Linda







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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 10:32:03 -0600

--------





Kerry,I know you can use some vit. e oil to preserve the oil/salve.  I will 

want to add more beeswax than you Henriette down here in Texas where it is 

_hot_ in the summer.

Linda S/



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 10:39:22 -0600

--------

Vitamin E will help prevent oxidation (the oil turning rancid) but is NOT a

bacteriostat.



Kerry

**********************************



Kerry,I know you can use some vit. e oil to preserve the oil/salve.  I will

want to add more beeswax than you Henriette down here in Texas where it is

_hot_ in the summer.

Linda S/







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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Michelle Morton-niyama" <lakshmi@kingcon.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 13:44:26 -0500

--------





> Vitamin E will help prevent oxidation (the oil turning rancid) but is NOT

a

> bacteriostat.

>

> Kerry



No, but alcohol is- and I have not had any problem with bacteria in fresh

plant salves when I use a little alcohol(1/2pt vol(ethanol)[or less!] to 1

pt wt(herb)-

and I have made oils and salves this way.

A separatory "thingy"(whats the word?) is helpful in pouring the oil off...

actually I havent had a problem with wilted plant oils either- without the

alcohol.

I think there is a lot of fear of bacteria- eeeeeeek.

All these antibacterial soaps and such- making things worse!

Michelle



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 11:03:23 -0600

--------

How do you know if a salve or whatever has bacteriostat in it??

Linda







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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 11:14:12 -0600

--------



There are some essential oils that have some antibacterial properties which

will help discourage bacteria growth (tea tree oil, lavender, thyme, etc).

Also, I've heard of adding some GSE to the oil or salve to discourage

bacterial growth. However, my understanding is that the only thing that will

be guaranteed to prevent bacteria contamination in it is a chemical

(Germaban? is that what it's called?). Many people who make homemade creams

and lotions will use it (you can find it at any place that sells

lotionmaking supplies) because of the nature of lotion makes it very

susceptible to bacteria contamination. I just try to take precautions by

making sure I don't have any water in my herbs or the pans I use when I melt

the wax, and making sure all supplies are very clean.



Kerry



-----Original Message-----

How do you know if a salve or whatever has bacteriostat in it??

Linda







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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: NEHrbSup@aol.com

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 23:47:49 EST

--------

In a message dated 3/19/2002 11:19:47 AM Eastern Standard Time, 

jclarke1@mn.rr.com writes:



<< I personally would just never use an herb in an oil or slave that HAS TO BE

 used fresh in order for it to work. I just can't take the risk of bacterial

 contamination, especially when selling it to others. >>



But what about when the work "best" when fresh - if your concern is bacterial 

or fungal contamination, why not just put a couple of drops of GSE per ounce 

of salve or cream into the mix - quiet - unobtrusive, healing, and definitely 

will do the trick.

peter

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 07:39:39 +0200

--------

NEHrbSup@aol.com wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> But what about when the work "best" when fresh - if your concern is bacterial 

> or fungal contamination, why not just put a couple of drops of GSE per ounce 

> of salve or cream into the mix - quiet - unobtrusive, healing, and definitely 

> will do the trick.



Because any GSW that actually is antibacterial is so because of an additive, not

because it's anything even close to "natural"?



Most people who make herbal salves try to do without any of those. A drop of

lavender EO, now...



Henriette



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 08:59:02 +0100

--------

Just a quick note on vit E as antioxidant agent.  While  you master

salve-makers might know this already, perhaps it will be interesting for others.

Vitamin E capsules are almost exclusively d- and dl- tocopheryl acetates, and

as such, do not act as an anti-oxidant. They are vitamins for human ingestion,

as the esterases in the body cleave the acetate to liberate the 'straight'

tocopherols, which are the effective antioxidant agents...

 

Industrially for preserving oils gamma and delta-tocopherols are used in

preference: they are better at anti-oxidant preservation function for oils.



Chhers



Marco



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Medical Herbalist

Vicolo Santa Cecilia 7

37121 Verona

Italy



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 07:08:14 -0600

--------

Adding GSE - will it work? I seem to recall that we had a similar

conversation on this list several months ago and someone (Marco?) said that

the only guaranteed way to prevent bacterial contamination is to use

Germaben. According to this person, even antibacterial EOs, like TTO, are

not very effective in preventing bacteria growth.



Kerry

-----Original Message-----

<< I personally would just never use an herb in an oil or slave that HAS TO

BE

 used fresh in order for it to work. I just can't take the risk of bacterial

 contamination, especially when selling it to others. >>



But what about when the work "best" when fresh - if your concern is

bacterial

or fungal contamination, why not just put a couple of drops of GSE per ounce

of salve or cream into the mix - quiet - unobtrusive, healing, and

definitely

will do the trick.

peter

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 08:35:37 +0100

--------

> Adding GSE - will it work? I seem to recall that we had a similar

> conversation on this list several months ago and someone (Marco?) said that

> the only guaranteed way to prevent bacterial contamination is to use

> Germaben. According to this person, even antibacterial EOs, like TTO, are

> not very effective in preventing bacteria growth.

> 

> Kerry



I seem to recall it was Graham to write that TTO would have not prevented

bacterial growth, and I agree.  However it is a matter of what you do with

your end product.  It is different to make a cream for extemporaneous use by

your patient and to make a cream that will be sold in shops, standing for some

time on the shelves etc.  In the latter case preservatives are probably the

only choice, but when I make creams et al.  I always do small amounts and tell

my patients to keep them refrigerated; never had any problems.  Aa a matter of

course I add antimicrobials in the form of a mixture of EOs and resins, to

provide a larger range of action.  I usually put small amounts of phenol-rich

oils (clove, origanums, thymes, ajowan, cinnamon, etc. which act on G+, G-,

yeasts, dermatophytes, protozoa, virus), plus larger amounts of milder oils

like TTO, Thymus vulG CT linalool, marjoram CT linalool (good range, less

irritant then phenols), mint (good antimycotic).  If I want to make a nicer

cream and do not bother about expenses I use neroli combined with petitgrain

and sometimes lavender (very good range, superior to TTO and nicer, but dec

more expensive)



cheers

marco



-- 

Marco Valussi BSc (Hons.) Herbal Medicine

Medical Herbalist

Vicolo Santa Cecilia 7

37121 Verona

Italy





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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Michelle Morton-niyama" <lakshmi@kingcon.com>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 08:25:00 -0500

--------

Marco



what percentage of the phenolic oils are you using in a cream? I have the

"fear" of sensitization, but I know they are effective(I use oregano and

lemon to clean the bathroom and kitchen!!)

Thanks

Michelle



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: GerstenbergerA@aol.com

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 11:53:50 EST

--------



Rosemary Gladstar suggests tincture of Benzoin or Myrrh oil to inhibit mold. 

I've done some low-tech testing here in Virginia with an herb class of 8-year 

olds. We used various herbs mixed with raw ground meat sitting in jars on a 

window sill for three months (very exciting). Our experiment showed ground 

clove to be an extremely effective inhibitor of visible colonizers compared 

to garlic, thyme, lavender, rosemary, or nothing. So I often use a drop or 

two of clove oil in my salves.

Adds an exotic aroma as well.

Ann G.



In a message dated 3/19/02 12:15:13 PM, jclarke1@mn.rr.com writes:



>There are some essential oils that have some antibacterial properties which

>will help discourage bacteria growth (tea tree oil, lavender, thyme, etc).

>Also, I've heard of adding some GSE to the oil or salve to discourage

>bacterial growth. However, my understanding is that the only thing that

>will

>be guaranteed to prevent bacteria contamination in it is a chemical

>(Germaban? is that what it's called?). 

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 09:03:41 +0100

--------

GerstenbergerA@aol.com wrote:



> Rosemary Gladstar suggests tincture of Benzoin or Myrrh oil to inhibit mold.



I would be a bit wary using benzoin to preserve creams.  It has caused

allergic dermatitis and sensitization.  In fact IFRA recommends not to use it

in cosmetic products, unless you have the specially prepared extracts (reflux

with aqueoius alkali, solvent extraction, neutralisation a,d removal of solvent).

There are in fact many other choices.

Cheers

Marco





-- 

Marco Valussi BSc (Hons.) Herbal Medicine

Medical Herbalist

Vicolo Santa Cecilia 7

37121 Verona

Italy

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: RE: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 15:16:55 -0600

--------

"Our experiment showed ground

clove to be an extremely effective inhibitor of visible colonizers compared

to garlic, thyme, lavender, rosemary, or nothing"



________________________

Hey great! I added cloves to my herb oil and didn't even know it would help 

prevent mold, etc.

Linda S.



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: hypericum oil

From: Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 09:32:00 -0700

--------

>Henriette wrote:

>Sure they are. But some research says the seeds would be even better. So don't

>chuck out the occasional seed that makes it into the basket.





I don't mind leaving the seeds alone but I do get rid of the bugs 

even though they may be collecting the stuff. the bug stuff I do use 

of course bee's wax and propolis, wasp nests both paper and mud 

dauber, oak galls. sharon in tucson

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Uses of dried herbs

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 20:45:46 +0200

--------

"Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> Well, I ordered or bought these herbs that sounded good at the time. I 

> couldn't throw them out! (Where is Karen Vaughn anyway?) Now I want to do 

> something with them.



So do some research. Look up each of your dried frozen herbs in at least five

books.



You'll learn lots.



Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi           Henriette Kress            Helsinki, Finland   

Over 30 MB herbal .html files (FAQs, classic texts, articles, links), plus

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: Infused herbal oils

From: Susan Marynowski <sumar@mail.ifas.ufl.edu>

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 21:28:31 -0500

--------

Thanks, everyone, for the great salve conversation. Plantain is my all-out

favorite salve -- it really great for Florida mosquito bites and insect

stings -- takes the swelling and itching right away. I also enjoy Calendula

very much. My favorite salve of the past few years, however, has been

goldenrod. It just smells so fantastic when you rub it on and it just has

to have antimicrobial properties.



For Linda and others in the hot and humid South lands, if you are going to

infuse oils with herbs in the sun, you should think in terms of 6 to 8

*days* (or less) instead of 6 to 8 weeks, as those wreckless northern

herbalists recommend. Our sun is much stronger. The oil will be done in

just a few days, and any longer it will begin to turn rancid or will more

easily turn rancid later. You can tell when it is rancid by the smell -- it

smells bad. Nevertheless, I have been able to successfully make wonderful

oils (and salves) only using the sun infusion method and only using fresh

plant material. 



Henriette: I am interested in trying your water bath method. What is your

water temperature for the 2-hour infusion period? Do you keep the oil

container sealed during the water bath, or can it be done in a "double

boiler" type pan?  --Susan in Florida

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Re: Infused herbal oils

From: NEHrbSup@aol.com

Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 23:52:43 EST

--------

In a message dated 3/19/2002 9:34:41 PM Eastern Standard Time, 

sumar@mail.ifas.ufl.edu writes:



<< as those wreckless northern

 herbalists recommend. >>



Susan.

How could you?  

Hugs

peter

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Re: Infused herbal oils

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 07:46:41 +0200

--------

Susan Marynowski <sumar@mail.ifas.ufl.edu> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> Henriette: I am interested in trying your water bath method. What is your

> water temperature for the 2-hour infusion period? 



The water is simmering underneath; the oil shouldn't bubble, boil or smoke. The

idea being an infused oil, not herb crisps.



One anal retentive student measured the oil throughout, with a beeping

thermometer. Groan. Every time it deviated 5+ degrees from the temperature he'd

set it went off beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep - enough to

put _me_ off these things forever, so _I_ do not measure any temperatures, not

in the top bowl, nor in the pot.





Later on, when making oil into salve, the water has to boil full out for the

beeswax to melt. (I usually do one liter at a time).



> or can it be done in a "double boiler" type pan?  



Yes. I only add a lid (smaller than the diameter of the top bowl) if I do things

like rose or lavender oil/salve; sure, the house'd smell of those if I didn't,

but then, the salve wouldn't.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi           Henriette Kress            Helsinki, Finland   

Over 30 MB herbal .html files (FAQs, classic texts, articles, links), plus

pictures, zipped archives, the works, at:   http://www.ibiblio.org/herbmed

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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Stellaria

From: "Michelle Morton-niyama" <lakshmi@kingcon.com>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 07:48:39 -0500

--------



> Not familiar with Stellaria, is that grown in USA?  What is the common

name?

> Use?



Dee

Stellaria is chickweed- it grows everywhere, I think!



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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Stellaria

From: "Gardenthyme Lady" <dblan@netusa1.net>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 09:10:04 -0500

--------

OHHH!  Chickweed, I've got tons of it growing wild!  I just became aware of

how  good it is this year.   Thank you so much.

Another questions, and I'm not sure if this is a herb or what, but a friend

is dieting, and said she makes and drinks a blue algae shake every morning.

She bought it as a powder at the herb shop.  Is this truly healthy?  How

does it help?   She calls it pond scum LOL.



Dee

"The Gardenthyme Lady"

Any path is only a path, and there is no affront, to oneself or to others,

in dropping it if that is what your heart

tells you... Look at every path closely and deliberately. Try it as many

times as you think is necessary. Then ask

yourself, and yourself alone, one question ... Does this path have a heart?

If it does, the path is good; if it

doesn't it is of no use. --Carlos Casteneda, from The Teachings of Don Juan









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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Stellaria

From: "Sandra Oliveira Almeida" <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 14:20:13 -0000

--------

Hi Dee:



There are several blue algae in the market. One of them is Spirulina, and it

cames in pills, too.

I've tryed them, and I lost nearly 8 kgs, in 2 months, without any special

diet (I'm a chocolate freak and I've wild cravins for sugar). If it is

spirulina, I've also noticed that my lungs were better, too.

Compliments,

Sandra



----- Original Message -----

From: "Gardenthyme Lady" <dblan@netusa1.net>

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Sent: Wednesday, March 20, 2002 2:10 PM

Subject: RE: [Herb] Stellaria



> Another questions, and I'm not sure if this is a herb or what, but a

friend

> is dieting, and said she makes and drinks a blue algae shake every

morning.

> She bought it as a powder at the herb shop.  Is this truly healthy?  How

> does it help?   She calls it pond scum LOL.

Dee





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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Stellaria

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 08:23:21 -0600

--------

I'd guess she's talking about spirulina. It seems to be de rigueur nowadays.

It is a great source of protein, especially for vegetarians, and appears to

be high in B Vitamins and EFAs. Don't know that it will necessarily help

with weight loss (I assume that's what you mean by "dieting") but it's a

good nutritional supplement.



Kerry



-----Original Message-----

Another questions, and I'm not sure if this is a herb or what, but a friend

is dieting, and said she makes and drinks a blue algae shake every morning.

She bought it as a powder at the herb shop.  Is this truly healthy?  How

does it help?   She calls it pond scum LOL.







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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Stellaria

From: "Michelle Morton-niyama" <lakshmi@kingcon.com>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 10:38:51 -0500

--------

> I'd guess she's talking about spirulina. It seems to be de rigueur

nowadays.



Supposedly, Spirulina is more "building" and feeds deficiencies- while "wild

blue green " is more cleansing, and would be more helpful in dieting-

I think I read that in Paul Petchfords book.

Michelle



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: RE: [Herb] Stellaria

From: "Thomas Mueller" <tmueller@bluegrass.net>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 02:58:31 -0500 (EST)

--------

> I'd guess she's talking about spirulina. It seems to be de rigueur nowadays.

> It is a great source of protein, especially for vegetarians, and appears to

> be high in B Vitamins and EFAs. Don't know that it will necessarily help

> with weight loss (I assume that's what you mean by "dieting") but it's a

> good nutritional supplement.



> Kerry



Anybody know what B vitamins spirulina contains?  I am looking for information

as opposed to commercial hype.  What about vitamin B-12?



Protein on a vegetarian diet is the easy part, vitamin B-12 is the bugaboo

nutrient.  I seem to have great respiratory and/or digestive difficulty with

animal protein foods, though I can take nutritional yeast.  I need a

non-animal B-12 source that will not make me lose weight, since I'm already

skinny.

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Stellaria

From: NRILEY2B2@aol.com

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 09:36:21 EST

--------

I am leaving on vacation and will return next Wednesday.  Is there someway to 

offer the list in summary to catch me up when I return.  Otherwise, my 

mailbox will be innundated with wonderful information that I will not be able 

to "weed" through.  Thank you in advance. 



NR

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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils/preserving

From: "Michelle Morton-niyama" <lakshmi@kingcon.com>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 08:19:39 -0500

--------

> Because any GSE that actually is antibacterial is so because of an

additive, not

> because it's anything even close to "natural"?

>  Most people who make herbal salves try to do without any of those. A drop

of

> lavender EO, now...

>  Henriette

Now thats what Id heard- that GSE wasnt truly anti bacterial- that the

samples that were contained artificial preservatives!

I do use essential oils to preserve and ward against bacteria- but there are

those who say that this isnt effective either- and recommend germaben- ick.

Now how do companies that make "all natural" creams-without preservatives-

do it? There are several on the market(by Weleda, New Chapter[geremy rose]

etc...)

I have not had problems with my creams, but I hear a lot of negativity about

the bacteria possibility.



Michelle



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Anti Bacterial Herbs

From: greg patch <patch@berkshire.net>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 08:54:06 -0500 (EST)

--------

Many herbs and oils are bactericidal in themselves and beeswax is

antiseptic, most are not effective against all bacterial species. If we as

conscientious herbalists are making products for sale, for client use, or,

for personal use, are using anti-bacterial herbs then, justifiably, should

we also include probiotics with these products, whether for external or

internal use?, taken to the "theoretical max". Materials, ie., salves,

oils, ointments placed on the skin are absorbed into the body and spread

via the blood stream and distributed throughout in varying degrees. If we

include "pharmaceutical" bacteriacides in our herbal brews than ask, how

much are we contributing to the cause of the problem that we are addressing

herbally in the first place. Many forms of skin problems are caused by

agents in the body that are not naturally processed, ie., chemicals that

are drying, toxifying, sanitizing, or unprocessable by our organic body

systems. Over sanitizing our bodies and environment is killing us and our

environment. If we are using "correct" processing in making oils, salves,

and ointments, then the problem is mute. Like Susan suggests mold smells,

it is also quite visable, throw it out. Check it out, do some research, and

respect the work we do. Balance, balance, oops, I'm slipping off my natural

soap box and landing on my natural butt. Have a wonder full!

Greg





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Ivy cream

From: GerstenbergerA@aol.com

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 11:39:16 EST

--------

Henriette,

Thanks so much for writing about your salves. I'll definitely try the 

Stellaria/Impatiens combo, nice idea. 



Salves are more reliably stable, but I also like to make creams (water-based 

herbal infusions mixed with oils) - about 1 qt at a time. Here's a hot tip. 

Get one of those electric handheld single-glass milkshake mixers to whip the 

ingredients into an emulsion. For some reason, this little mixer works better 

than a blender, cake mixer, egg-beater, hand whisk, or anything else I've 

tried.  The creams end up pretty stable (hand-made creams sometimes tend to 

separate over time), and it's easy to clean (ever try cleaning face cream out 

of your blender?).



Here's an original recipe, still refining it:

Ivy Cream

Hedera Ilex  (English Ivy) has a reputation for reducing cellulite deposits!  

This stiff cream has a castor oil base for penetration, plus beeswax and EOs 

of Bergamot and Pine. The water portion is  English Ivy stems and leaves, 

chopped and decocted to a deep amber color, plus aloe vera gel. It requires a 

vigorous massage to apply, which can also help break up fat deposits in skin. 

I'd even try it for lipomas along with lymphatic support such as cleaver or 

red clover teas or tinctures.



I generally follow Rosemary Gladstar's cream formula of one part oils and 

waxes to one part waters. The Ivy decoction also contains some melted wax 

from the leaf surfaces that I did not discard. Make sure both oils and waters 

are cool, and at the same temperature, or the mixture won't emulsify 

properly. A drop of tincture of Benzoin will preserve it somewhat, though I 

don't use it. 



I used fresh Aloe Vera gel, though Ms. Gladstar cautions to always use 

storebought, as the fresh will go bad. I did find it oxidized immediately to 

turn my cream a rather lovely shade of putty pink.  My cream did not "go bad" 

ie. smell or grow mold, for about 3 months, which is the same shelf life of 

any unpreserved salve or lotion I make. I refrigerate unopened jars until I'm 

ready to use it or pass it along.



BTW, English Ivy is an invasive and totally out of control in my wooded 

neighbor hood. I pull up and compost tons of it, but it's a losing battle. 

Does anyone have any other use for it? Or a suggestion for controlling it 

after it's gone wild? One time I gritted my teeth and used an herbicide 

(Round-Up) on a small area and it killed everything BUT the ivy. It's a 

living lesson in tenacity.

-Ann G.



In a message dated 3/18/02 3:48:38 PM, hetta@saunalahti.fi writes:



>I make oils into salves - just add beeswax. Oils as oils are too messy

>for me,

>and because it's difficult to just take a little you use more; salves give

>more

>bang for the herb.

>

>Different ones: ...

>

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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Filipendula ulmaria

From: "Sandra Oliveira Almeida" <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 22:24:01 -0000

--------

Hello

I just bought some pills of Filipendula ulmaria (in Portugal , called rainha

dos prados). It was strange for me, because the note of the french lab says

that is for lost of weight and not for fevers and pain, as I thought.

Could you explain this?

I'm confused.

Thank you

Sandra Almeida





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Filipendula ulmaria

From: Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 16:28:54 -0700

--------

Sandra Almeida wrote:

>  pills of Filipendula ulmaria (in Portugal , called rainha

>dos prados). It was strange for me, because the note of the french lab says

>that is for lost of weight and not for fevers and pain,

>





Well I was taught to use it for some cases of nausea in pregnancy.

Sharon in Tucson

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Filipendula ulmaria

From: "herbapo@monitor.net" <herbapo@monitor.net>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 16:31:29 -0700

--------

>Hello Sandra,

This is not answering your question, butI saw that you got herbs in

Portugal. My grandparents were from Portugal and I have an avid interest in

learning about the herbal tradition in that country. Please contact me off

list if you have an interest also or if you can pass on any information.

Thank you so much,

Karen Aguiar

herbapo@monitor.net





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Filipendula ulmaria

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 10:37:55 +0200

--------

"Sandra Oliveira Almeida" <sandraalmeida@netvisao.pt> wrote:



> I just bought some pills of Filipendula ulmaria (in Portugal , called rainha



"pills"?

So what _else_ is in there?



Meadowsweet (or Queen of the meadow) is a tea herb, which can also be used in

oil, salve or tincture. Pills are for pharmacists.



> dos prados). It was strange for me, because the note of the french lab says

> that is for lost of weight and not for fevers and pain, as I thought.



Check North European herbals (for instance Hoffman, Ody, or Bremness). It's

pretty much used for the flu, pain, headaches, to sweat you, and such.



North Americans can check Filipendula rubra (Queen of the prairie), which has

the same scent and can be used the same way. 

It's larger than meadowsweet and has pink flowers - it's gorgeous. Picture

online on my site.



Filipendula vulgaris has other uses.



Cheers

Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi           Henriette Kress            Helsinki, Finland   

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Candida, mold, yeast, bacteria....oh my!

From: Susan Marynowski <sumar@mail.ifas.ufl.edu>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 19:47:24 -0500

--------

Just for everyone's enjoyment, here is a link to Susun Weed's take on

candida and all those micro-creepy-crawlies we need in our diets:

http://www.susunweed.com/Weed_letter_Mar-02.htm

See the "Ask Susun" section to see her answer to candida. I think Susun has

a wise approach to the problem, although I have not had opportunity to try

it with someone yet. She was just here in Florida last month and told the

story about a candida-suffering woman who found a "miracle cure" -- when

Susun checked out the large expensive bottle, it was encapsulated soil

microorganisms! As Ryan Drum says, why not just eat more dirt!?



Peter, I am curious to know more about the entry of candida into the blood

stream. Any suggested reading on the subject? Other ideas for herbs that

will help with entrenched candida? And what is your protocol for chelating

Hg with herbs? Can someone do the chelation and rebuilding therapy even

without a hair analysis (i.e., not available or too expensive)? I seem to

know a lot of people who have (or think they have) candida problems at the

moment and I'll bet that lots of people have elevated Hg in this culture,

especially here in Florida where Hg is in all the swamp water (by natural

means).  --SusAn in North Florida where it has been 90+ F. the last 3 days!











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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] GSE

From: elementalclay@webtv.net (Roxanne Brown)

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 20:28:37 -0600 (CST)

--------

  Since this is a recent topic and I use gse a lot I would like opinions

on

http://www.gfex.com/citricidal.htm

  The brand I use is Nutribiotic and contains citricidal.  I chose this

brand because it did not appear to have the preservatives that others

have spoken of.

Roxanne



Roxanne J. Brown

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] GSE

From: GerstenbergerA@aol.com

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 22:25:44 EST

--------

Can someone please tell me what GSE or GSW is? I looked around the web abit 

and couldn't find it.

Thanks

Ann G.

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] GSE

From: elementalclay@webtv.net (Roxanne Brown)

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 22:16:56 -0600 (CST)

--------

GSE is grapefruit seed extract.

Roxanne 



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] GSE

From: Marco Valussi <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 08:51:50 +0100

--------

Roxanne Brown wrote:



>   The brand I use is Nutribiotic and contains citricidal.  I chose this

> brand because it did not appear to have the preservatives that others

> have spoken of.

> Roxanne



Well, they do wouldn't say there is a preservative, would they? otherwise what

would be the point of selling it as a natural preservative?  

However, the evidence is mounting since at least 1997 and the Pharmazie

article (see archive for Janina's post I believe) that all GSEs active as

antibacterials do contain the preservative benzethonium chloride - BC (sp?),

while those which do not contain it are not active as antibacterial (QED).

Recently there has been a review by some natural health magazines in britain

(don't remember which)that confirmed this suspect,  and I personally had some

batches of citridal tested at Turin University and the data confirmed the

presence of BC.  I also wrote a letter to the manifacturers and had an

official response which is the same they send to anyone, that "there isn't any

BC in their product, just a metabolite that resembles BC".  However, both the

Pharmazie authors and the Turin Uni lab director were adamant it was

impossible to mistake one for the other, since they were specifically looking

for it.

Anyhow, it is important to stress that even if the molecule was only BC-like,

it is difficult to think of citridal as a natural product.  Notwithstanding

the name 'extract', which might give us the idea this is something akin to a

tincture or a FE or even an acetone extract of a herb, this is not the case. 

The production of GSE involves industrial processes that are clearly

emisynthetic, that is, they use the grapefruit seeds as a starting material to

produce something partially new, similarly to the use of Dioscorea to produce

progesterone.  This is not in itself a terrible thing, sometime we need to use

synthetic preservatives, but the point is that 1. they are deceiving the

public and 2. if I have to, I prefer to use substances I know more, and that

have been used for longer than GSE.  And this misuse of the term 'natural' I hate.



Cheers

Marco





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Medical Herbalist

Vicolo Santa Cecilia 7

37121 Verona

Italy



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re:was [Herb] Ivy cream now Baltic Ivy

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 22:43:57 -0500

--------





 BTW, English Ivy is an invasive and totally out of control in my 

> wooded  neighbor hood. I pull up and compost tons ...



I have a major source of Baltic Ivy which in shade is helpful to erosion

control, and "greens" up my maple tree trunks during New England winters.

 I cut it to renew my garden path, etc.  Does anyone have suggestions for

lotions and fresheners, etc.?  And are there any special herbal

properties to Baltic Ivy ( one of the hederas like the English but with

slightly larger leaves and a "coarser" general appearance)?  Do you have

suggestions for shampoos, lotions, fresheners?



Thanks,

Marcia

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] over the counter prescribing

From: "Paulene Bibby" <waratah20@hotmail.com>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 23:11:14 +1100

--------

<html><div style='background-color:'><DIV>

<P><BR>hi....I am a naturopathy student at Southern Cross University in Australia and&nbsp;I need to hear practitioner's opinions of the advantages and&nbsp;disadvantages of &nbsp;about over the counter herbal and naturopathic prescribing.&nbsp; Please add your comments as to how you feel about legal and professional issues that may appear in over the counter prescribing</P>

<P>thank you Paulene</P>

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] ADMIN: Gotta love it...

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 21:47:34 +0200

--------

Thanks guys, looks like the move is a success. The olde list will be gone

shortly.



Cheers

Henriette, listowner.



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] ADMIN: Gotta love it...

From: greg patch <patch@berkshire.net>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 07:22:07 -0500 (EST)

--------

>Thanks guys, looks like the move is a success. The olde list will be gone

>shortly.

>

>Cheers

>Henriette, listowner.



Nice spring forward Henriette!

Thanks,

Greg





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] salve

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 17:29:35 -0600

--------





Well, I got my sesame/almond/olive oil doubly infused with red clover, 

echinacea, plantain, goldenseal & cloves put into jars but the beeswax is 

settling in the bottom of the jar.  Am I inpatient (it hasn't completely 

cooled yet)? Or did I do something wrong? Thanks!

Linda S.



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] salve

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 17:41:55 -0600

--------



Couple things - what do you mean by saying you have it doubly infused?

Double infused, by Henriette's definition, means that you infuse it once

(for several weeks) then drain the herbs, add more fresh herbs to the oil

you just drained off, and infuse again for several more weeks.

Second - the beeswax gets added the very last step before pouring the salve

into the containers. You infuse the oil, drain the herbs, pour the strained

oil into a pan, heat on low and melt the beeswax in that, then pour this

into your containers.



I second Henriette's suggestion to buy a good basic herbal, as this stuff

would be covered in just about every one. A good one is Ody's _The Complete

Medicinal Herbal_.



Kerry



-----Original Message-----

Well, I got my sesame/almond/olive oil doubly infused with red clover,

echinacea, plantain, goldenseal & cloves put into jars but the beeswax is

settling in the bottom of the jar.  Am I inpatient (it hasn't completely

cooled yet)? Or did I do something wrong? Thanks!

Linda S.



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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] salve

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 17:48:30 -0600

--------

Sorry, I realized after I hit post that you must have done the waterbath

method of infusion, rather than cold infusion. Anyway, the part about the

beeswax stands - once you've strained the herbs, the oil gets reheated and

the beeswax added to that, melted, THEN poured.



Kerry





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: RE: [Herb] salve

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 21:14:17 -0600

--------





Well, my salve is ok.  Next time I will add a little less beeswax. I have 

the book Penelope Ody's Medicinal Herbal.  This red clover salve smells 

wonderful.  Thanks for all you guys 'n gals input.  It had been a couple of 

years since I made a salve.

Linda S.



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: RE: [Herb] salve

From: greg patch <patch@berkshire.net>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 07:22:10 -0500 (EST)

--------

>Well, my salve is ok.  Next time I will add a little less beeswax. I have

>the book Penelope Ody's Medicinal Herbal.  This red clover salve smells

>wonderful.  Thanks for all you guys 'n gals input.  It had been a couple of

>years since I made a salve.

>Linda S.



Linda,

Or you/we can re-melt and add the oils, herbalism can be alot of

additive/subtractive work :)

Greg





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] salve

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 15:40:04 +0200

--------

greg patch <patch@berkshire.net> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> Or you/we can re-melt and add the oils, herbalism can be alot of

> additive/subtractive work :)



I tried that once or twice, long ago, when I had added too little beeswax to a

batch or two (they didn't set, not even in the freezer).



You have to add even _more_ than you thought you ought to, if you need to add

more after the fact...



Cheers

Henriette



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] salve

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 08:10:41 -0600

--------

I've usually ended up adding more beeswax than I intended, then had to go

back and add a little more oil to soften it, and back and forth until I've

got about 25% more salve than I began with.



Kerry



-----Original Message-----

> Or you/we can re-melt and add the oils, herbalism can be alot of

> additive/subtractive work :)



I tried that once or twice, long ago, when I had added too little beeswax to

a

batch or two (they didn't set, not even in the freezer).



You have to add even _more_ than you thought you ought to, if you need to

add

more after the fact...







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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] salve

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 09:47:25 +0200

--------

"Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> Well, I got my sesame/almond/olive oil doubly infused with red clover, 

> echinacea, plantain, goldenseal & cloves put into jars but the beeswax is 

> settling in the bottom of the jar.  Am I inpatient (it hasn't completely 

> cooled yet)? Or did I do something wrong? Thanks!



You add beeswax to the sieved oil

You heat it _UNTIL THE WAX HAS MELTED_

You pour your melted salve into jars



Unless you added water (or tea) to that salve, in which case you stir it until

it has cooled.



Henriette



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==========

To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] press?

From: "LJS Doody" <ldoody@internetcds.com>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 16:22:57 -0800

--------

Sent to the herblist by "LJS Doody" <ldoody@internetcds.com> :



I am sure this subject comes up often, but can anyone recommend a good press

or a good plan for getting one made? i have looked at the cost of them and

they seem very expensive for what you get. your opinions and advice would be

great!



i really enjoyed all the recent postings on infused oils, plantian is my

personal favourite.



thanks



Lizzie







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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: press?

From: Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 18:08:09 -0700

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Sharon Hodges-Rust" <mwherbs@dshome.net> :



>

>I am sure this subject comes up often, but can anyone recommend a good press

>or a good plan for getting one made? i have looked at the cost of them and

>they seem very expensive for what you get. your opinions and advice would be

>great!

>

>

Lizzie, Over the years I have tried different things to press oil 

with ie  hand pressing; nesting bowls with a c-clamp and a piece of 

wood; for very small batches a meat juice press($ 5-20); I have a 

lard press I like but it is cast iron although mine is well seasoned 

from age and oils so there isn't any rust involved($70). If I were to 

make my own I would probably buy a drill press frame from harbor 

freight($75-100) and then add nesting stainless steel pans to 

reinforce the upper pan I would put a cut hunk of wood in the pan and 

then bolt it to the top of the press the lower pan would need to have 

a drain( I have seen some like this at the store). Also in Penelope 

Ody's book she has a picture of a white(plastic_ wine press that 

looks interesting if you could find one.

Sharon in Tucson



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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: press?

From: elementalclay@webtv.net (Roxanne Brown)

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 20:09:06 -0600 (CST)

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Roxanne J Brown" <elementalclay@webtv.net> :



I use a potato ricer.  It works well but I did bend it on ginger root.

Roxanne



Roxanne J. Brown

Elemental Clay

http://www.cloudnet.com/~elemclay/

"One does not learn by speaking"





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To: herb@franklin.metalab.unc.edu

Subject: [herb] Re: press?

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 21:18:30 -0600

--------

Sent to the herblist by "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com> :



You know, I was afraid I was going to lose some of the best resin or 

whatever you call it off the herbs in the oil but I got my tincture press 

out (one I ordered over the internet).  It did a pretty good job I think.  

Then I put the beeswax in.

Linda S.







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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: "marcobabi@libero.it" <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 08:45:25 +0100

--------

Michelle Morton-niyama wrote:



> what percentage of the phenolic oils are you using in a cream? I have 

the

> "fear" of sensitization, but I know they are effective(I use oregano 

and

> lemon to clean the bathroom and kitchen!!)



Michelle, the problem with phenol-rich oils is that of irritation more 

than of

sensitisation; you are more at risk when using old coniferae or citric 

oils

for that.  The percentage depends on two things: 1 am I using just those 

oils

or a mixture and 2 am I using the EOs just for preservation or as a

therapeutic component.

Anyhow, for creams not to be used on face or delicate areas of the skin 

I tend

to go for 0.5-1% and then add 4% non phenolics; however, much depends on

single oils.  Their potency can vary dramatically: I have some Oregano 

EO I

can use 5% because of the low carvacrol level, others that are terribly

irritating (85% carvacrol); d-limonene-rich oils, like the citric ones, 

are

very good for reducing evaporation of other EOs and help absorption.  

But if

using citric better to use distilled ones to avoid sensitisation.  Using

resins helps as well: calendula, Commiphora molmol etc.  IMO the secret 

is

using just enough phenolics (I test all nex oils and the % in creams on 

myself

for that) and then add a simple selection of non-phenolics to cover an 

ample

range of bugs.

Cheers

Marco  

-- 

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Medical Herbalist

Vicolo Santa Cecilia 7

37121 

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Re: [Herb] Herbal oils

From: greg patch <patch@berkshire.net>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 07:22:03 -0500 (EST)

--------



>sensitisation; you are more at risk when using old coniferae or citric

>oils

>Cheers

>Marco



I'm learning much from your scientific knowledge, Marco.

Am wondering here with conifer, fresh resinswise, as possibly more

preservative than the citric, realizing citrus has its own resinous

qualities. What is your take on this? Have you seen any science of

bioregional aspect to this? Anecdotally, here in the north, there is that

in the new spring pine tips there is, gram for gram, a higher Vit C content

than citrus. Have you seen any scientific research addressing this?

Thanks,

Greg





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Algae and vitamins, was: Stellaria

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 10:15:26 +0200

--------

"Michelle Morton-niyama" <lakshmi@kingcon.com> wrote:



> > I'd guess she's talking about spirulina. It seems to be de rigueur

> nowadays.

> 

> Supposedly, Spirulina is more "building" and feeds deficiencies- while "wild

> blue green " is more cleansing, and would be more helpful in dieting-

> I think I read that in Paul Petchfords book.



SBGA (and spirulina, and other single-cell algae) are off-topic because 

1. they're not herbs (which in itself isn't a crime on this list, but add points

   2+3 and it is)

2. they're overhyped and it's very difficult to find _real_ information on them

3. they're sold as MLM



Problems with it, which you won't find in any of the hype:



It consists to a large degree of cell nucleus. Compare this with, say, your

usual vegetable or muscle tissue cellmatter-to-nucleus ratio and you know why



- people with joint troubles shouldn't take it

- people with liver problems shouldn't take it

- people who get other problems on uric acid overload shouldn't take it



This because we can't reuse materials found in a cell nucleus. Nuclei get

converted to uric acid, with all that entails in gout flareups, arthritis

flareups, livers that can't catch up with blood crud etc etc etc.



Re. vitamins: as far as I know, if you get B12 from any vegetable it's because

that vegetable hides animal protein. Bugs and things.



Cheers

Henriette



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Herbal oils/preserving w/EO

From: "Michelle Morton-niyama" <lakshmi@kingcon.com>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 07:47:11 -0500

--------



> >sensitisation; you are more at risk when using old coniferae or citric

> I'm learning much from your scientific knowledge, Marco.

> Am wondering here with conifer, fresh resinswise, as possibly more

> preservative than the citric, realizing citrus has its own resinous



Greg

I do know that the citrus and pine oils can be sensitizing when they are

older because the terpenes oxidize- making them irritating to the skin- and

useless for much other than housecleaning or wood preserving! For this

reason- I dont think I would use them for their preserving qualities- as

they dont last long themselves.

The phenol oils(thyme, oregano, clove, etc) are effective against "bugs"-

but you must use a low dilution to avoid skin irritation- which some are

more susceptible to than others!

Michelle



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Herbal oils/preserving w/EO

From: greg patch <patch@berkshire.net>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 22:20:29 -0500 (EST)

--------



>> Am wondering here with conifer, fresh resinswise, as possibly more

>> preservative than the citric, realizing citrus has its own resinous



>The phenol oils(thyme, oregano, clove, etc) are effective against "bugs"-

>but you must use a low dilution to avoid skin irritation- which some are

>more susceptible to than others!

>Michelle



Thanks for your explanation Michelle. I haven't experienced much of a

problem with spoilage in making salves for @20 yrs now. I don't use EOs for

preservation, though I did when I first started out. As a traditional

herbalist I work to keep things simple and less processed, and believe

herbs are herbs, and EOs are EOs. Mold comes from one or two reasons, using

moldy materials, or, too much water or air. Not making large batches is a

preventative. Large commercial enterprises usually do add preservatives,

their salves can sit around for long periods of time. What I was asking

about was if there is some research that has determined the preservative

differentials of conifer and citrus. I have made homeopathic-like waters

with bugs to keep those bugs away, ie., house flies, fleas, ants,

mosquitos, etc, it can take all season to collect enough bugs - very

exasperating! Some of the herbs I've used in salves have higher percentages

of phenols already in them, ie., White Pine/tannins, Willow Salix

spp/Salicylic acid, Wintergreen Gaultheria procumbens/Salicylic, Black

Birch Betula lenta/Salicylic, Thyme Thymus vul./Thymol, Purple Bee Balm

Monarda fistulosa/Thymol, Red Clover Trifolium pratense/Coumarins, I didn't

use them for their preservative natures neccessarily. My main concern is

that the salve works with the problem. Just olive oil and beeswax can be

very effective. All herbs, like all things, deteriorate/transform in time.

I don't know of any of the phenol plants, and most plants have phenols in

them, that are effective against all types of bacteria, gram +, gram -,

etc. As for sensitizing, each of us has at least one or two plants that we

are better off not being around - all we can do is get sensitized once or

twice before we find out, or, correlate and suspect. Then again we can talk

to the plant first, negotiate in a friendly way with it, and perhaps go

beyond the sensitization. For a long time I was never sensitized to Poison

Ivy, but when I got it the first time a few years ago I looked up, sat down

with the plant, and asked it to make ammends. Now I seem to be alright with

it again - funny thing. So much for accumalative effect, possibly.

Sometimes talking to one or two bugs is effective, but, infestations are

kind of like talking to a hungry mob.

I'm going traveling for a week or so in the morning, understand if I'm not

around the list and I'll try to catch up, oh yea, lol, with this busy new

listserver.

Be Well all,

Greg





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Labyrithitis

From: Geoff Harker <point_sun@yahoo.co.uk>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 16:45:25 +0000 (GMT)

--------

Please does anyone have any details for successful

herbal treatment for labyrinthitis.



Thanks.



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Labyrithitis

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 20:47:17 -0500

--------





On Fri, 22 Mar 2002 16:45:25 +0000 (GMT) =?iso-8859-1?q?Geoff=20Harker?=

<point_sun@yahoo.co.uk> writes:

> Please does anyone have any details for successful

> herbal treatment for labyrinthitis.



I had a long term 3 week bout of viral congestion-based vertigo, that was

more kindly managed with ginger capsules, than with prescription

antivert.  Crystallized ginger is helpful if you can deal with sugar.



Marcia

---





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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Re: salves

From: "plantpeople" <plantpeople@triton.net>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 18:05:52 -0500

--------

> I've usually ended up adding more beeswax than I intended, then had to go

> back and add a little more oil to soften it, and back and forth until I've

> got about 25% more salve than I began with.

>

> Kerry



Or you can keep a dish of ice water nearby when making your salve.  Pour a

couple drops of the hot salve mixture into the water.  It'll immediately

gel/harden as hard as it will get.  From there you can decide if you want to

add more oil or wax while it is still warm.  Much easier than cooling and

reheating.

JocyeW



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Re: salves

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 19:19:32 -0600

--------

Oh, how smart. I will have to remember that next time!! Wish I had thought 

of that when I was making the salve.  The ice water would take the guesswork 

out of it, huh?

Linda S.







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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Re: salves

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2002 08:54:03 +0200

--------

"Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> Oh, how smart. I will have to remember that next time!! Wish I had thought 

> of that when I was making the salve.  The ice water would take the guesswork 

> out of it, huh?



Fixed ratios help, too. Once you've made a couple salves at 1:5 (they're very

hard) and one or two at 1:10 (they don't set at all) and lots at 1:8 (mmmm,

yummy!) you know that 1:8 works no matter what, and use that as your standard

beeswax to oil ratio.



Henriette



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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Kigelia africana... the Sausage Tree

From: "Kevin Chisholm" <kchisholm@ca.inter.net>

Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2002 11:11:17 -0400

--------

Dear List



The following URL

 http://www.positivehealth.com/permit/Articles/Herbal/majoe63.htm suggests

that preparations from the Sausage Tree is beneficial in the treatment of

Psoriasis, among other things.



Has anyone on Herb worked with this tree and its preparations? If so, for

what applications, and with what degree of success?



Kindest regards,



Kevin Chisholm









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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re:was Herbal oils now resin

From: Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net>

Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2002 09:56:29 -0700

--------

About 14 years ago when I lived in the Portland Oregon area I found 

at an old farmstead yard sale a bowl full of resin there was one or 2 

large(baseball size) lumps transparent light amber in color and then 

a bunch of crumbly stuff down to powder. In the yard were peach and 

apricot trees. The stuff smelled good,didn't taste acrid and I wanted 

it, the guy sold me the bowl and told me I had to take the stuff in 

it. A few weeks later my son was playing with a friend running and 

slid on the pavement putting a rather large and deep abrasion on his 

upper thigh and bottom(about the size of a large ham) I told him to 

go and wash it up and since he was with his friend and it was a bit 

under his shorts leg I let him go alone to do it unfortunately when 

we got home and I looked at it he hadn't washed it and it was already 

getting infected. I washed and cleaned it up and dressed it but it 

kept getting infected and I was cleaning it up several times a day. 

Letting it air out just made too much crust and the infection was 

under keeping it moist was a little better but still infected. So I 

tried the fine powder of the resin to dry it out but hopefully 

prevent the wound from being infected. It worked beautifully we still 

soaked it once a day and reapplied the powder but it was fine and on 

the mend in a couple of days and he has no scar. At the time I 

thought that it was probably either apricot or peach pitch but I 

don't know haven't been able to observe one to compare. sharon in 

tucson

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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Good Book

From: Quinnten Allen <quinnten@usa.net>

Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2002 15:24:44 -0600

--------

Hey Guys/Gals!



Any recommendations for a good beginning book for making salves and working

with essential oils? Something like "EO's for Dummies" or "Essential Oils

Primer" or "Idiots Guide To Oils and Salves"???



I would like a book that is both comprehansive but unassuming that I know

anything. Any help would be greatly appreciated!



Thanks,

Q











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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Good Book

From: Veronica Honthaas <honthaas@bigsky.net>

Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2002 17:05:24 -0700

--------

At 03:24 PM 3/23/02 -0600, you wrote:

>Hey Guys/Gals!

>

>Any recommendations for a good beginning book for making salves and working

>with essential oils? Something like "EO's for Dummies" or "Essential Oils

>Primer" or "Idiots Guide To Oils and Salves"???

>

>The Herbal Medicine-Makers Handbook by Green is wonderful



Herbal Preparation and Natural Therapies by Nuzzi is a classic

Rosemary Gladstar also has a good one.

Veronica







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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Good Book

From: "Michelle Morton-niyama" <lakshmi@kingcon.com>

Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2002 07:58:29 -0500

--------



 working

> with essential oils? Something like "EO's for Dummies"



Why not go straight for the good stuff?

There is a lot of conflicting info out there-

as for EOs I would recommend Kurt Schnaubelts Advanced Aromatherapy- it

explains the chemistry of the oils and why they work for what...

as for salves- any basic herbal will tell you that...

Michelle



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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] good book

From: "globird" <globird@tenmegs.com>

Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2002 11:25:56 -0600

--------

>Any recommendations for a good beginning book for making salves and working

>with essential oils? Something like "EO's for Dummies" or "Essential Oils

>Primer" or "Idiots Guide To Oils and Salves"???



An all around good basic book with photos is

The Illustrated Encyclopedia of Essential Oils by Julia Lawless



If you just want recipes, two usful references are:

Aromatherapy blends and remedies by Franzesca Watson

The Complete Book of Essential Oils and Aromatherapy by Valerie Ann Worwood



If you want science, chemistry, and understanding of the underlying

principles

The Practice of Aromatherapy by Jean Valnet MD

Advanced Aromatherapy by Kurt Schnaubelt PhD



gloria







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To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] cervical dyplasia -  natural treatments?

From: "Caroline" <carolinef@mindspring.com>

Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 14:20:35 -0800

--------

does anyone know natural remedies for a 15+ year history of cervical

dyplasia (typically Class II) and HPV (that comes and goes)?



many thanks.



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] cervical dyplasia -  natural treatments?

From: Sharon Hodges-Rust <mwherbs@dshome.net>

Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:36:27 -0700

--------

>does anyone know natural remedies for a 15+ year history of cervical

>dyplasia (typically Class II) and HPV (that comes and goes)?

>

>many thanks.

>

Get Tori Hudson's book on women's natural healing, she classes it all 

out and offers different treatments for each class. Her and Molly 

Linton when last I heard had successfully treated over 200 women by 

now I'm sure its more. Basically nutritional support along with 

topical treatments example- vag depletion packs,a brief treatment 

with zinc chloride powder, calendula succus to wash it off, and the 

days you don't use the depletion packs you use a vit pack. One piece 

of their success is that they CAREFULLY screen everyone and are sure 

before they treat that the cervix is all that is involved , 

visualizing the cervix with a culposcope first offers a great deal of 

info.

Also some types of HPV are not aggressive or invasive and will never 

develop into something more serious others are very dangerous. 

Smoking will speed up the process say that one type of HPV may cause 

cancer 20-30 years after exposure if you smoke it may be only 3 yrs. 

Things common among women with cervical cancer are low levels of 

vitamin C , folate, and other B vit.

Sharon in Tucson

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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] cervical dyplasia -  natural treatments?

From: "Niamh" <niamh@nmcginley.fsnet.co.uk>

Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 13:56:21 -0000

--------

Suppositories of Calendula.

Namh



> does anyone know natural remedies for a 15+ year history of cervical

> dyplasia (typically Class II) and HPV (that comes and goes)?

>

> many thanks.

>





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Baltic Ivy

From: Marcia V Grossbard <ngbard@juno.com>

Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 17:49:20 -0500

--------





I have a large source of Baltic Ivy-- a hedera like English Ivy.  Do you

have suggestions for creams or lotions, or a book or a website with that

kind of info?



Thanks,

Marcia

---



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: [Herb] good book

From: "marcobabi@libero.it" <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 12:12:33 +0100

--------

> If you want science, chemistry, and understanding of the underlying

> principles

> The Practice of Aromatherapy by Jean Valnet MD





While Valnet's books are very important for their first-hand clinical

approach, I would suggest much of its info on chemistry and his 

therapeutic

indications is to be taken very critically.  I would suggest more recent 

texts

(they have already been mentioned) as well as texts like Tisserand and 

Balacs

on EOs toxicology to balance some of the overhype typycal of 

aromatherapy

literature.  IMO Price's text AT for health professionals has a good 

balance,

although as usual it gives tens of indications for each oils (way too 

many) 

and assumes direct psycological actions via olfaction which are based on

nothing (but this is common to almost all AT books)



Cheers



Marco









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Medical Herbalist

Vicolo Santa Cecilia 7

37121 Verona

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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Kava Kava

From: "Gardenthyme Lady" <dblan@netusa1.net>

Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 04:28:08 -0500

--------

Hi all,

This must be beat up kava kava week.  It's been in the news here for the

supposedly "danger" of liver failure.  It was on the local news twice, then

I saw it on CNN yesterday, and NBC last night.  I thought it was interesting

they did give the stats on who it effected (2 people in Germany, 10 in USA),

they were saying not to use it and the FDA was investigating it.  Weren't

trials done in Canada on it, and it was ruled safe?  I thought that's what

was in the Richter's newsletter.  Then the very next story was regarding

Prozac and how it's now believed to cause cancer.  They had someone on there

saying the trials were with very large amounts and not really accurate, etc.

(That story would never had gotten out if Lily hadn't lost the patient on

it.)

Dee

"The Gardenthyme Lady"





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Kava Kava

From: elementalclay@webtv.net (Roxanne Brown)

Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 11:51:29 -0600 (CST)

--------

Dee,

  It sounds like your doctor just has a problem with herbals in general.

Once you put your tincture in hot water, the alcohol dissipates anyway.

  On a personal note, I have found passionflower to be effective in the

evening.  I made a tincture but I have a family member that does well

with a commercial tea.

Roxanne



Roxanne J. Brown

Elemental Clay

http://www.cloudnet.com/~elemclay/

"One does not learn by speaking"



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Re: [Herb] Kava Kava

From: "marcobabi@libero.it" <marcobabi@libero.it>

Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 13:07:55 +0100

--------





Gardenthyme Lady wrote:

> 

> Hi all,

> This must be beat up kava kava week.  It's been in the news here for 

the

> supposedly "danger" of liver failure.  It was on the local news twice, 

then

> I saw it on CNN yesterday, and NBC last night.  I thought it was 

interesting

> they did give the stats on who it effected (2 people in Germany, 10 in 

USA),

> they were saying not to use it and the FDA was investigating it.  

Weren't

> trials done in Canada on it, and it was ruled safe?  I thought that's 

what

> was in the Richter's newsletter. 



Kava has indeed a very good safety record, but the 28 cases of liver 

problems in Germany and Swizerland, with 5 liver transplant and two 

deaths are not to be taken lightly.  Check the list archives for 

discussion on this and on the type of kava standardised extract used.  

For a very complete review see EHPA websites, it has it all.



Cheers

Marco 



-- 

Marco Valussi BSc (Hons.) Herbal Medicine

Medical Herbalist

Vicolo Santa Cecilia 7

37121 Ve

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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Re: [Herb] Kava Kava

From: "Gardenthyme Lady" <dblan@netusa1.net>

Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 09:42:26 -0500

--------

I'm not taking it lightly.

I couldn't find anything in the archives, but thanks for the EHPA site

information Marco.  Very interesting and informative.  I personally use Kava

and thus my interest in the "warnings" being put forth by the FDA, etc.

From this information it looks like this is the dosage the EPHA  recommend;

"We propose the following voluntary usage restrictions:



   Dosage levels to be within the GSL limit,  i.e. the equivalent of 2 g

dried rhizome per day containing not more than 120mg kavalactones.



     Kava raw material, for use as crude drug or in the preparation of

extracts, to consist of whole, peeled or unpeeled, rhizome (not peelings) in

accordance with established pharmacopoeial standards."



Now I tincture my own from ground Kava purchased from Blessed Herbs.  I used

Everclear 90% alcohol, basically the simplers method, 1/4 qt. ground root to

3/4 qt. Everclear.  So what dosage is that in my terms? 1 teaspoon, 1

Tablespoon?

I currently take about a teaspoon in tea in the evenings (not every night,

but sometimes when I'm really stressed I will take it both in the day and

the evening)  Is this within those guidelines?

Since this in a tincture, would that increase the risk of liver problems?

My doctor didn't like that I take herbal tinctures because of the alcohol in

them.  Not that I have liver problems that I'm aware of.   I told her it was

usually put into hot tea, but she still didn't agree with it.  Wanted to put

me on antidepressants, (those are so much better, yeah right.)

Dee

"The Gardenthyme Lady"



Kava has indeed a very good safety record, but the 28 cases of liver

problems in Germany and Swizerland, with 5 liver transplant and two

deaths are not to be taken lightly.  Check the list archives for

discussion on this and on the type of kava standardised extract used.

For a very complete review see EHPA websites, it has it all.



Cheers

Marco



--

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Medical Herbalist

Vicolo Santa Cecilia 7

37121 Ve





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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Re: [Herb] Kava Kava

From: "Kerry & Jack" <jclarke1@mn.rr.com>

Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 08:53:40 -0600

--------

My doctor didn't like that I take herbal tinctures because of the alcohol in

them.  Not that I have liver problems that I'm aware of.   I told her it was

usually put into hot tea, but she still didn't agree with it.  Wanted to put

me on antidepressants, (those are so much better, yeah right.)



*********************************



Your doctor SERIOUSLY has a problem with the amount of alcohol in tinctures?

What if you told her you took a glass of red wine nightly (isn't there some

therapeutic value to red wine?)? Does she say you should swear off all

alcohol? Geesh, that seems kind of unreasonable.



Kerry





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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: RE: [Herb] Re: [Herb] Kava Kava

From: "Gardenthyme Lady" <dblan@netusa1.net>

Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 11:47:22 -0500

--------

I just think she didn't like that I was taking herbs, and used that as an

excuse, hard to understand Doctors, and I avoid them if I can.  Even after I

explained I took SJW for depression, she wanted to put me on Prozac.  I know

you aren't supposed to combine the two, but apparently she didn't?



Dee

"The Gardenthyme Lady"



***



Your doctor SERIOUSLY has a problem with the amount of alcohol in tinctures?

What if you told her you took a glass of red wine nightly (isn't there some

therapeutic value to red wine?)? Does she say you should swear off all

alcohol? Geesh, that seems kind of unreasonable.



Kerry







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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Kava

From: hkobayas <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu>

Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 14:49:23 -0600

--------

Some of you may know this, but I also found this yesterday:



Mov Disord 2002 Jan;17(1):195-6

Life-threatening parkinsonism induced by kava-kava.



Meseguer E, Taboada R, Sanchez V, Mena MA, Campos V, Garcia De Yebenes J.



Servicio de Neurologia, Fundacion Jimenez Diaz, Madrid, Spain.



We present a 45-year-old female with severe parkinsonism induced by kava-kava. 

The patient, who had a family history of essential tremor, developed severe 

and persistent parkinsonism after days of treatment with kava extract for 

anxiety. The symptoms improved with anticholinergics. Kava derivatives could 

produce severe parkinsonism in individuals with genetic susceptibility. 

Copyright 2002 Movement Disorder Society.



This is not even published yet, so I don't have much idea. This certainly is 

not a good idea for me since I study this plant, but I haven't paniced yet.



<Now I tincture my own from ground Kava purchased from Blessed Herbs.>



I am not sure kava tincture is a good idea. I beleive kavapyrones (or 

kavalactones) are GABA (Gamma Amino Butyric Acid) agonist, and so is ethanol. 

I know the amount of ethanol taken is very small, but I don't know what 

synergistic reaction may occur.



Hideka Kobayashi

Dept. of Natural Resources and Environmental Sciences

1115 Plant Science Laboratory

1201 S. Dorner Dr.

Urbana, IL 61801



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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Kava

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 00:40:36 +0200

--------

hkobayas <hkobayas@students.uiuc.edu> wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> I am not sure kava tincture is a good idea. I beleive kavapyrones (or 

> kavalactones) are GABA (Gamma Amino Butyric Acid) agonist, and so is ethanol. 

> I know the amount of ethanol taken is very small, but I don't know what 

> synergistic reaction may occur.



Kava tincture is the way to go. But it's best done fresh 1:2 95 %, in which case

the dose to take, when needed, is 1-3 drops.



Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi           Henriette Kress            Helsinki, Finland   

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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: [Herb] Opening breathing passages...

From: "Lynn Kelly, DC" <drkelly@icdc.com>

Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 16:02:30 -0500

--------

Anyone have a good herbal mixture for opening breathing passages that

tighten during exercise and cold, damp weather?  Thank you.    Lynn Kelly,

DC

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Opening breathing passages...

From: C B <chimpcugee@yahoo.com>

Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 13:09:40 -0800 (PST)

--------

I'd be very interested in this as well.



Christiane



--- "Lynn Kelly, DC" <drkelly@icdc.com> wrote:

> Anyone have a good herbal mixture for opening

> breathing passages that

> tighten during exercise and cold, damp weather? 

> Thank you.    Lynn Kelly,

> DC

> _________________________

> "Don't let your spine get on your nerves."

> http://members.aol.com/starchiro/starchiro.html

> 

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] Opening breathing passages...

From: Veronica Honthaas <honthaas@bigsky.net>

Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 14:42:59 -0700

--------

I really like plantain.  You can just remember to drink a lot of the 

tea  or just take plantain tincture when you need it. When taking the 

tincture you may need to take a squirt (dropper full) every 10 minutes till 

symptoms improve. Veronica



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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] stuffy noses

From: LINOLDRN@aol.com

Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 21:07:59 EST

--------

Grated horse radish helps with nasal stuffiness and sinus head aches.

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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] Strauss heart drops

From: brtaylor@telebyte.net (Bob and Rusty Taylor)

Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 21:39:29 -0800

--------

I got a flyer in the mail today for a product called "Strauss Heart Drops"

by Dr. Knoll Products of Canfield Ohio.



does anyone know anything about this product or what it contains?



Bob Taylor



**********************************************************************

   "There are no coincidences, only small miracles." Author Unknown



                  Mrs. Rusty Taylor - Poulsbo, WA

                    brtaylor@telebyte.net (home)

         website -- http://pacific.telebyte.com/~brtaylor/

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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] Strauss heart drops

From: "Joanie MacPhee" <macphee@net1plus.com>

Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 12:09:29 -0500

--------

Hi Bob-



I have no familiarity with this product, but do have the ingredients (as of

December) from a post from a woman in Canada on another list --



"Here are the ingredients for Strauss Heart Drops:

"Water, garlic, cayenne, bilberry, motherwort, hawthorn berries, hawthorn

leaves, fruit alcohol"



Joanie





>I got a flyer in the mail today for a product called "Strauss Heart Drops"

>by Dr. Knoll Products of Canfield Ohio.

>does anyone know anything about this product or what it contains?

>Bob Taylor





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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: [Herb] endangered plants

From: "Antti Hovi" <ahovi@latkk.helsinki.fi>

Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 10:32:30 EETDST

--------

I have tried to find out lists of endangered and threatened (vascular) 

plant species of different conuntries. 

My results have so far not been very good. Trough web-pages I 

found the following: Canada 82 species, Ontario 61, Maryland 420, 

North Carolina 91, Illinois 260, Texas 27, Vermont 2 (?), Sweden 

469. We in Finland have 107 (and 120 Near Threatened).



If you know a similar web-site of your country or state I would 

appreciate.  

Also if you can mention which of them are also (commonly used) 

medicinal herbs.



I could only recognise as herbs in above (N-American) lists Golden 

Seal (Hydrastis canadensis). 

I think many herbs go into categories uncommon, rare, or near 

threatened and are not (yet) officially threatened. So they can be 

protected only by common sence and good will, not by legislation.



Thank you,

Antti Hovi

antti.hovi@helsinki.fi







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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] endangered plants

From: herbapo@monitor.net

Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 11:22:03 -0700

--------

Try the United Plant Savers an organization "dedicated to replanting

at-risk native medicinal plants." www.plantsavers.com or email

info@plantsavers.com.



good luck

Karen





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==========

To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] endangered plants

From: Henriette Kress <hetta@saunalahti.fi>

Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 21:59:18 +0200

--------

herbapo@monitor.net wrote to herb@lists.ibiblio.org:



> Try the United Plant Savers an organization "dedicated to replanting

> at-risk native medicinal plants." www.plantsavers.com or email

> info@plantsavers.com.



The plantsavers lists are pretty bad, though, because they don't take into

account geography. Ie. plants that are endangered in their northernmost reaches,

say, in Oregon, but are _wildly_ successful in their heartland, say, in

California, end up on that list.



Better to list endangered plants by more closely defined geographical areas than

all of the U.S. - lists by state, for you guys, would be by far the best.



Henriette



-- 

hetta@saunalahti.fi           Henriette Kress            Helsinki, Finland   

Over 30 MB herbal .html files (FAQs, classic texts, articles, links), plus

pictures, zipped archives, the works, at:   http://www.ibiblio.org/herbmed

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To: herb@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Re: [Herb] cervical dyplasia - natural treatments?

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 17:16:07 -0600

--------





Please tell us more about the calendula suppositories?

Linda



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==========

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Subject: Re: [Herb] cervical dyplasia - natural treatments?

From: "Caroline" <carolinef@mindspring.com>

Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 16:30:08 -0800

--------

yes, where do you get them  - or do you make them yourself?? 



what exactly do they do? sounds...intriguing.



thanks.

----- Original Message ----- 

From: "Linda Shipley" <clarinetgirl72@hotmail.com>

To: <herb@lists.ibiblio.org>

Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 3:16 PM

Subject: Re: [Herb] cervical dyplasia - natural treatments?





> 

> 

> Please tell us more about the calendula suppositories?

> Linda

> 

> _________________________________________________________________

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> http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx

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